TC in St. Louis Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 I'm glad the TD era is over, but I am sick of reading that drafting Mike Williams was one of Donahoe's biggest mistakes. Nobody said that at the time. At the time, he was all over ESPN, big Mike. great pick, yadda yadda. I personally was rooting to trade down because one guy cannot make that big a difference...the team needed more picks. but there was no trading partner, and Williams was hailed as a very good pick. Now, he has not lived up to expectations. That's on Mike Williams, not Donahoe. His big mistake was hiring GW.
JimBob2232 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Agree. MW was held in the same regard as Debrickshaw Furgeson is right now. Imagnine if we select ferguson and 4 years from now he is Mike Williams. Was it a mistake? Yes. Would Marv be responsible for this mistake? No, not really. Nobody would see it coming. Its a consensus pick. TD gets a pass on the MW pick.
BB2004 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 I'm glad the TD era is over, but I am sick of reading that drafting Mike Williams was one of Donahoe's biggest mistakes. Nobody said that at the time. At the time, he was all over ESPN, big Mike. great pick, yadda yadda. I personally was rooting to trade down because one guy cannot make that big a difference...the team needed more picks. but there was no trading partner, and Williams was hailed as a very good pick. Now, he has not lived up to expectations. That's on Mike Williams, not Donahoe. His big mistake was hiring GW. 562562[/snapback] Disagree. If you have the fourth pick in the draft overall and you are planning on picking from that spot, you'd better get yourself a good player. Mike Williams didn't work out for the Bills so far. He could work out very well with another team or maybe he'll come back at a lower price and play well.
Buffalo_Stampede Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 You cant judge draft picks when they are taken. Philly booed McNabb and wanted that pothead Ricky Williams, who knew. Draft picks are judged 3, 4, 5 years down the road, and it was a bad pick if Mike Williams is not a productive starter on this team. Its the GM's job to best sort out the players that have that drive in them to be the best and the ones that dont, especially 1st round picks. Talent alone doesnt get you by in the NFL. Mike Williams cant play football like he is Barney in pads. He needs to play with an edge and determination, i dont see it.
ans4e64 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 i couldnt agree more, i've wanted to make a thread about this for a while but havent. At the time, mike williams was touted to be a great player. And yes, you can judge draft picks when they are taken. And this was a good one. We needed a tackle, and williams had all the talent in the world, he was athletic, personable, and massive. Point being, it is not TD's fault mike williams failed. TD made the pick we needed and everybody loved it because mike williams was thought to be a future star. When is it mike williams' fault he failed? when do we say mike, you had all the talent to succeed, you had everything, and you didnt do it?
Tcali Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 i couldnt agree more, i've wanted to make a thread about this for a while but havent.At the time, mike williams was touted to be a great player. And yes, you can judge draft picks when they are taken. And this was a good one. We needed a tackle, and williams had all the talent in the world, he was athletic, personable, and massive. Point being, it is not TD's fault mike williams failed. TD made the pick we needed and everybody loved it because mike williams was thought to be a future star. When is it mike williams' fault he failed? when do we say mike, you had all the talent to succeed, you had everything, and you didnt do it? 562601[/snapback] ..unless of course he DID'NT have the talent---and he just intimidated college players like that steroid freak--im forgetting his name.....huge guy--...oh Mandarich......-Then it IS a bad move on TDs part. If TD gets the credit for a good move he has to take it for bust move. If M<W had the talent but not the motivation--then it is still on TD because he didnt evaluate MWs character properly.
Tcali Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 ..unless of course he DID'NT have the talent---and he just intimidated college players like that steroid freak--im forgetting his name.....huge guy--...oh Mandarich......-Then it IS a bad move on TDs part. If TD gets the credit for a good move he has to take it for bust move. If M<W had the talent but not the motivation--then it is still on TD because he didnt evaluate MWs character properly. 562606[/snapback] sorry--typo city....
ans4e64 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 ..unless of course he DID'NT have the talent---and he just intimidated college players like that steroid freak--im forgetting his name.....huge guy--...oh Mandarich......-Then it IS a bad move on TDs part. If TD gets the credit for a good move he has to take it for bust move. If M<W had the talent but not the motivation--then it is still on TD because he didnt evaluate MWs character properly. 562606[/snapback] we all saw mike williams' character, it was all over tv. he did espn commercials and numerous interviews where all they talked about was how great a person was. you think mike williams doesnt have the talent? he could be a pro bowler if he wanted to
Nostradamus Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 i couldnt agree more, i've wanted to make a thread about this for a while but havent.At the time, mike williams was touted to be a great player. And yes, you can judge draft picks when they are taken. And this was a good one. We needed a tackle, and williams had all the talent in the world, he was athletic, personable, and massive. Point being, it is not TD's fault mike williams failed. TD made the pick we needed and everybody loved it because mike williams was thought to be a future star. When is it mike williams' fault he failed? when do we say mike, you had all the talent to succeed, you had everything, and you didnt do it? 562601[/snapback] The fact that Williams is a bum is Williams fault, the fact that he was picked is Donoahoe's fault. Just because a pick may appear solid at the time does not make it so. The player's performance will determine whether it was a good or bad pick. And yes, we in Buffalo as well as the national press all came to the consensus it was a good pick. But, it is not our job to examine every characteristic of a college player before picking him to be a member of an organization. it his Donahoe's. While the pick may have been understandable, it is still most defintly a mistake, and his bust status clearly indicates it was a bad pick.
ans4e64 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 The fact that Williams is a bum is Williams fault, the fact that he was picked is Donoahoe's fault. Just because a pick may appear solid at the time does not make it so. The player's performance will determine whether it was a good or bad pick. And yes, we in Buffalo as well as the national press all came to the consensus it was a good pick. But, it is not our job to examine every characteristic of a college player before picking him to be a member of an organization. it his Donahoe's. While the pick may have been understandable, it is still most defintly a mistake, and his bust status clearly indicates it was a bad pick. 562613[/snapback] if it is a good pick at the time then yes it does. the GM does not coach the team, it isnt his fault if the player has the tools to play, seems like he has a good head on his shoulders, but fails, i could see you making an argument it was greggs fault, but not TD's. There are picks that are bad at the time, such as taking an injured player, or someone that clearly has mental and off-field issues. Mike had nothing of the sort, thus it was a good pick. you cant say that a players performance decides whether or not it was a good pick, BECAUSE YOU DONT KNOW HOW HE IS GOING TO PERFORM, all you know is whats infront of you and you evaluate it, his size was good, feet were good (i remember him dancing on tv), his college career let us believe he was good, and attitude at the time looked good. Thus, it was a good pick. All you know are the facts, and nothing more. Like i said, its different if one or more of those scouting aspects dont line up, but they did. You dont know how he will perform thats why you project how you think he will perform, which is what everybody did, and why everybody thought he would be good.
Dawgg Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Biggest mistake was hiring MM. The team needed an experienced head coach. His big mistake was hiring GW. 562562[/snapback]
ans4e64 Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Biggest mistake was hiring MM. The team needed an experienced head coach. 562616[/snapback] but gregg williams wasnt an experienced head coach...... and he actually failed, so how is MM a bigger mistake?
billsfanmiami(oh) Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 That year, if the Bills didn't take a "stud" o-lineman with the pick, there may have been riots in Buffalo. It was going to be one of the 2 "can't miss" picks, MW or Bryant McKinnie. Either way, we'd still be pissed and in the same position. The draft is a crap shot.
Bill from NYC Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 I'm glad the TD era is over, but I am sick of reading that drafting Mike Williams was one of Donahoe's biggest mistakes. Nobody said that at the time. At the time, he was all over ESPN, big Mike. great pick, yadda yadda. I personally was rooting to trade down because one guy cannot make that big a difference...the team needed more picks. but there was no trading partner, and Williams was hailed as a very good pick. Now, he has not lived up to expectations. That's on Mike Williams, not Donahoe. His big mistake was hiring GW. 562562[/snapback] I agree. It was a great idea to give 38 million dollars or so to a player who, for the most part, sucks. It was also great thinking to make a fat slob with a history of injuries the highest paid right tackle in NFL history. Needing an OT, TD would have been dumb to select McKinnie who is still starting at LT for the Vikes while Fat Mike was unsuccessful even at the OG position. Very good pick indeed!
Carmel Corn Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 That year, if the Bills didn't take a "stud" o-lineman with the pick, there may have been riots in Buffalo. It was going to be one of the 2 "can't miss" picks, MW or Bryant McKinnie. Either way, we'd still be pissed and in the same position. The draft is a crap shot. 562619[/snapback] Agreed. Remember that many posters felt that Mt. McKinney was going to be the answer because he neutralized Dwight Freeney in a bowl game. Around here (Indy), people were quick to criticize Polian for taking Freeney as early as he did.
bluv Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Biggest mistake was hiring MM. The team needed an experienced head coach. 562616[/snapback] TD's biggest failures has beenthe hiring of weak coaches who wouldn't challenge his authority like Cowher did in Pittsburg. The talent he has assemble, with some hits and misses has been adequate. Putting together a coaching staff to fully utilize this talent has been his downfall. ANd to those who act like MW is a TOTAL BUST, plays like Barney and gives up 35 sacks alone a year: it's mihty funny that once he went out the lineup McGahees running numbers fell off as well.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Problem with this rosy theory: He had weight issues coming out of college. You NEVER draft an OL with weight issues.
obie_wan Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 That year, if the Bills didn't take a "stud" o-lineman with the pick, there may have been riots in Buffalo. It was going to be one of the 2 "can't miss" picks, MW or Bryant McKinnie. Either way, we'd still be pissed and in the same position. The draft is a crap shot. 562619[/snapback] Teflon Tom would have taken Joey Harrington. Fortunately, he was saved that embarassment by Matt Millen. Due to his infatuation with Joey H, Teflon did nothing prior to the draft to cultivate trading partners if Joey H was not available. Just because a huge player "moves well for his size" does not make him a player deserving of a $40 mil contract.
BuffOrange Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 I'm glad the TD era is over, but I am sick of reading that drafting Mike Williams was one of Donahoe's biggest mistakes. Nobody said that at the time. At the time, he was all over ESPN, big Mike. great pick, yadda yadda. 562562[/snapback] Speaking of stuff I'm sick of reading.... "_ gets a pass on _ because Joe 6pack fan wouldn't have done any better". Awesome - I'm glad we have such lofty expectations for our GM
Tortured Soul Posted January 12, 2006 Posted January 12, 2006 Agreed. Remember that many posters felt that Mt. McKinney was going to be the answer because he neutralized Dwight Freeney in a bowl game. Around here (Indy), people were quick to criticize Polian for taking Freeney as early as he did. 562646[/snapback] I'm just wondering if by the logic of this thread - does this make Freeney a bad pick because people were calling him a reach? If that's a bad pick, then I don't want to be good. A GM has to be held accountable for the bottom line and nothing else. Maybe Big Mike failed because he had two stupid head coaches that didn't use him right. But Maybe GW and MM have failed (so far) because they have lazy players. So you can't necessarily call either one a bad move in isolation. And as long as that holds, and no move move on its own can be THE move that ruined the team, then how can you hold TD responsible? It's the bottom line.
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