smokinandjokin Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 Actually, they're the only RBs of the league's top 30 rushers that have a worse yards per rush average than Willis. Are we to believe that every team except the Ravens, Jets, Patriots, Lions, and Bills have good offensive lines? 557303[/snapback] C'mon Rich, you're better than that. YPC is the biggest hoax stat there is. Willis' 3.8 vs. Edge's 4.2 works out to 8 yards a game over the course of 20 carries. Are you telling me you see a huge impact between 2nd & 5.8 yds and 2nd & 6.2 yds? Two long breaks by Willis, or a couple of non-penalties on a few longer runs that he had called back, and he would have been up over 4.0. Would that have changed the Bills' record? Listen, I'm not saying McGahee is the second coming of Walter Payton. This Bills team needed him to put them on his shoulders, and truthfully, he didn't. But he had 1250 yards and we all seem to concur that he had a bad year. What if he did carry the team? Would he have had 1900? Is that really what we were expecting? Don't discount the fact that JP struggled completing a pass in his first go-round as starter, and Holcomb had trouble looking further than 6 yards downfield. Add to that, the fact that half the time he ran, McGahee ran up the back of Shelton who was getting blasted back in his face, and I'd say he did okay. Not great, certainly, but I don't think he had a bad season. When Willis was running up 110 per game last year during the winning streak, that was not the upper echelon of the NFL we were playing. Yards are hard to come by against good teams, and even harder to come by when you are playing from behind and have no passing attack.
tennesseeboy Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 Hopefully Marv will get us a real offensive line before the beginning of the next season. We really don't know about McGahee or Losman...or for that matter Holcomb...until we get that straightened out. Right now it looks like both WM and JPL are something of a disappointment but give them an offensive line and a good tight end and we can take their measure. IId if they can't perform we address that next year. I'm hoping they can and will perform.
LabattBlue Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 but give them an offensive line and a good tight end and we can take their measure. 557346[/snapback] Are we talking about Losman or Bledsoe? If I didn't know better, this phrase resembles what you read hear for a couple of years and what you will read if you go to a Cowboys board right now .
K-9 Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 1247 yards in a 16 game season isn't so great. averages out to about 78 yards per game. 1000 yards should no longer be the measuring stick for a good or better running back. I can think of several times when he was stuffed on successive carries for no gain. Granted the OL is poor at best, but great backs find a way to gain yards when they have to. His attitude is questionable at best. Personally I'm wondering if McGahee will ever be any better than he is now. He shows no ability to break the long run and doesn't seem to have gotten his speed back after the injury. He doesn't make people miss, he runs through them sometimes. He just might be a Travis Henry clone without the fumbles. I think next year will be the proving ground. The OL should be better, I'm guessing the play calling will be better and then there will be excuses. He either shows or doesn't. 557242[/snapback] Well, if 1,000 yards was the benchmark in a 14 game season, then actually 1247 is a bit better than that over 16 games. Do the math, you'll see. I'm curious as to how be was second in the league in runs of 20+ yards in '04 and TOTALLY regressed this year. Next year is his make/break year and I agree with you that the oline will be better. But I also think a little coddling my Marv (a la TT) will do him good. He's got character (nobody outworks him. my god, just coming back at all from that injury show us that). Don't worry about his lack of breakaway speed. That's a NICE to have in a back, not a HAVE to have. Like TT, who didn't scare anyone with his speed, WM has the ability to pick up yards in 7-10 yard chunks. Otherwise known as controlling the run game. Marv WILL make a better player out of him. If WM really wants to be here. If not, GTFO! GO BILLS!!!
SF Bills Fan Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 I think willis wants to get out of Buffalo. I might want out after last year too.
Beerball Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 Are we to believe that every team except the Ravens, Jets, Patriots, Lions, and Bills have good offensive lines? 557303[/snapback] Ummmm.......Yes? I mean no? I mean...you scare me!
ans4e64 Posted January 6, 2006 Posted January 6, 2006 Willis didnt have the year we all expected, but how can you say 1200 yards is ugly? Its clear these guys dont know what the hell they're talking about, also evident by the fact they had Lofa Tatupu winning defensive rookie of the year over Shawn Merriman, thats rediculous. Im not taking anything these morons say to heart.
R. Rich Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 C'mon Rich, you're better than that. YPC is the biggest hoax stat there is. Willis' 3.8 vs. Edge's 4.2 works out to 8 yards a game over the course of 20 carries. Are you telling me you see a huge impact between 2nd & 5.8 yds and 2nd & 6.2 yds? Two long breaks by Willis, or a couple of non-penalties on a few longer runs that he had called back, and he would have been up over 4.0. Would that have changed the Bills' record? Listen, I'm not saying McGahee is the second coming of Walter Payton. This Bills team needed him to put them on his shoulders, and truthfully, he didn't. But he had 1250 yards and we all seem to concur that he had a bad year. What if he did carry the team? Would he have had 1900? Is that really what we were expecting? Don't discount the fact that JP struggled completing a pass in his first go-round as starter, and Holcomb had trouble looking further than 6 yards downfield. Add to that, the fact that half the time he ran, McGahee ran up the back of Shelton who was getting blasted back in his face, and I'd say he did okay. Not great, certainly, but I don't think he had a bad season. When Willis was running up 110 per game last year during the winning streak, that was not the upper echelon of the NFL we were playing. Yards are hard to come by against good teams, and even harder to come by when you are playing from behind and have no passing attack. 557342[/snapback] You're absolutely right: I should know better. Foolish me for believing the words of former NFL coaches and players, many of whom are Hall of Famers, when they seem to feel that one of the things that distinguishes the great Jim Brown from other backs who have played since he retired is the fact that he averaged over 5 yards per rush for his career. Man, were they hoodwinked by this hoax! Considering how many people have gone on to pass Brown's yardage total over the years, there can simply be no way that he's the best ever. So, the simple solution should be to give Willis about 700 rushes. That way, he'll be a lock to go over 2,000 yards, and we can ride on his coattails to a championship. You are right about yards being hard to come by. It's not just his 3.8 average that bothers me, it's the fact that he just doesn't seem to be able to make the game breaking plays he used to. His longest run of the season is 27 yards. Heck, even Jerome Bettis has a longer run! In fact, of the top 30, only Jamal Lewis (25) and Lamont Jordan (26) have done worse for a longest run. Maybe it would've been better for Willis if he had played behind a much better offensive line, like........Houston's. After all, Domanick Davis' longest run of the season is a whopping 44 yards. Another hoax? Look, I am not anti Willis McGahee. I am against looking @ ANY Bills player's performance through rose colored glasses. He had a decent season, that's all. Can he do a lot more? He certainly can. I'm trying to stay optimistic that Marv Levy will spearhead the effort to put the line in place for not only Willis to do better, but for JP as well. I just hope we're not getting lip service and another dose of the "same ol' Bills" once the season begins.
KnightRider Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Willis didnt have the year we all expected, but how can you say 1200 yards is ugly? Its clear these guys dont know what the hell they're talking about, also evident by the fact they had Lofa Tatupu winning defensive rookie of the year over Shawn Merriman, thats rediculous. Im not taking anything these morons say to heart. 557640[/snapback] Didn't Travis Henry have over 1300 running behind the Mike Pucillo & RJ handing him the ball? By the way, only 5TDs is very, very not best in the league...
billsfanone Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Hard to break out of that category when he got 8 or 9 carries in some games.
BillsWatch Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Hard to break out of that category when he got 8 or 9 carries in some games. 558050[/snapback] Hard to break out of that category when the times they DID try to run Willis was stuffed.
Talonz Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Does anyone think that WM has enough trade value to call for a 1st or 2nd rounder? I don't think so... I think we are stuck with him another year, then CYA. Wouldn't break my heart in the least . I didn't like the pick, I was a little excited about it last year, then when the poop hits the fan, WM shows his true character ----> Disinterest
Spiderweb Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Hard to break out of that category when the times they DID try to run Willis was stuffed. 558065[/snapback] I do recall a long run (first meeting against Miami) that was 50-60 yards, but was called back on a stupid meaningless hold by Evans that had little effect on the play. Willis surely is not without fault, and I believe there lies the truth between the Willis is great and the Willis is a bum camps. There WERE many factors that held Willis back, our offensive line surely is part of the blame, as is our anemic passing attack. Sorry, but even though Holcomb had a bit more success, neither he nor JP ever forced teams to respect our passing attack to any real degree. I also mst add that for a 5-6 game stretch, it did appear that Willis had made the run for the bus early. In the final against the Jets, he should have had more carries. It also would have been nice to see him get more attempts without having the beat 1-2 guys in the backfield as often as he had to as well. It would have been equally as nice to see him make a quick (and proper) decision on where he was going and then blow it up in there a bit more often too. I see this story as being a tale of two sides.
Nanker Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 He doesn't deserve to be above the Vikings cruise as an "Ugly" part of the NFL season. 557194[/snapback] The page I saw had no "rankings." Did it offend you that the Bengals' O was "ranked" higher than the Foreskins' "D" or that Ron Mexico was "ranked" more bad than the Jints' extra home game? The way I read it, The Good, Bad, and Ugly were just buckets. I don't know who the motivational speaker/hypnotist the front office hired last summer to get last year's squad mentally focused with positive thoughts of their inner greatness, but I hope he's not brought back again this year. One of the positives that Marv brings back to the organization is to know how to believe in yourself and your teammates, but not to write checks with your mouth that your body can't cash.
Fan in San Diego Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 In the end, the media and fans have taken off running with the "I am the best in the NFL" comment. Willis did utter those words, but taken in context, he also listed LT, Edge, and Portis as great backs. When asked which one was the best, Willis said something along the lines of, "I think I am the best. You always have to walk on the field thinking you are the best." The fact that Willis finished 10th in the NFL in rushing with 1247 yards behind a pathetic, makeshift line, and without a complementary passing attack, seems like he did pretty well. He would have had more than 5 TD's if MM didn't have a love affair with Shelton when they get inside the 5-yard line. I guess what I'm saying is that Willis didn't have a great year, but he was not the reason we were 5-11. He doesn't deserve to be above the Vikings cruise as an "Ugly" part of the NFL season. If the media wasn't so obsessed with him saying that he was the best, it would be looked at as a solid year. 557194[/snapback] I agree, the media just has to latch onto something !
finknottle Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 There's no doubt that willis was disappointing on a couple levels, but he never had any of the big holes that the more productive backs had, either. It's a tough call, but if we could get a 1st and a 3rd for Willis, I think you have to make that trade. I question his heart. He just says some stupid and selfish things sometimes. 557208[/snapback] Frankly, I think his value around the league right now is a 2nd round pick. Seriously. In their eyes he is a legit starter, but he has no track record of taking over and dominating games. He has only 1 year left on his contract, with DR as an agent. There is never a shortage of young explosive backs in the draft. Actually, I think I'm talking myself into a 3rd round pick... WM has the same numbers as TR in about the same conditions, but costs 10 times as much and looks more likely to be a problem player.
LabattBlue Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 In their eyes he is a legit starter, but he has no track record of taking over and dominating games. He has only 1 year left on his contract, with DR as an agent. There is never a shortage of young explosive backs in the draft. 558199[/snapback] He has 2 years left on his contract... http://nflpa.org/Members/playerProfile.asp?ID=34527
2003Contenders Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 I think the team could do themselves a favor by bringing in a halfway decent backup -- someone who could actually start in a pinch. It is clear to me that Willis never caught his second wind around the halfway mark. Was that a conditioning problem? Maybe. But it would be wise to have a second quality back to spell him on occassion -- and to maybe ignite some competetive juices. Since we never saw anythig out of Lionel Gates, I presume he is not the answer. There will be an ample number of good RBs (Ahman Green, Chester Taylor, Jamal Lewis) available in free agency. And based on what we saw last year, we shouldn't have to break the bank on one.
Kelly the Dog Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Most running backs have more holes to run through each game than Willis did the entire season. I bet there werent more than 10 of those 320 carries where Willis was untouched more than 5 yards downfield. On a team that couldn't block at all, couldn't pass, couldn't convert third downs, didn't play Willis on third downs, didn't run enough, and couldnt get off the field on defense, 1250 or so yards was actually pretty damn good. he easily would have had 10 TDs if we ran him at the goalline like we should have, too.
1959BillsFan Posted January 7, 2006 Posted January 7, 2006 Maybe. But Marv has a great way of getting these kind of "me-me" guys to buy into what he's selling. It will be interesting to watch their relationship develop. 557187[/snapback] What I will add is that Therm Thomas and mcgahee had very similiar injuries with similiar situations. Thomas was drafted in the second round because he was injured, mcgahee was drafted later in the first round due to his injury. The difference, Thomas was mad, he was angry that he fell that far. He came out to prove the rest of the league wrong. mcgahee, well....... it really looks like he wants to make his contract incentives then relax The character Marv mentions is what Thomas displayed. The situations are almost identicle, but the people and the times aren't. I do think Marv will be taking a HARD look at mcgahee, maybe bring Thomas in to have a heart to heart with mcgahee.
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