Starting Holcomb Over Losman

[JDG]

Allow me to present this in the form of questions:

 

1) Would the Bills have gained 375 yards of offense vs. Cincy and 343 yards vs. the Jets with JP Losman at QB? Would we have scored 37 and 26 points the last two weeks with JP Losman at QB?

 

2) If Eric Moulds had not caught 10 for 99 and 8 for 96 the last two weeks, would you possibly be thinking that just maybe Eric Moulds really might not be able to play any more?

 

3) If teams had continued to have zero fear of our QB (JP Losman) being able to pass the ball, at Willis McGahee didn't have 100 yards against the Jets, would you be a bit more concerned about McGahee not having had 100 yards since Halloween?

 

JDG

[Frez]

What is JP's sole purpose for being drafted in the first round? Why is he here?

[Johnny Coli]

Would the Bills have won the KC game had Holcomb stayed in?

Would the Bills have held on to beat Miami had Moulds not pouted on the sidelines?

Would you be using the Cinn game for your argument had McGee not single-handedly scored 14 points?

Would JP have thrown 4 picks in a game because the defense knew the QB was incapable of completing a deep pass?

[Nanker]

What is JP's sole purpose for being drafted in the first round? Why is he here?

548372[/snapback]

 

Exactly. This could go down as THE Hallmark TD blunder of his tenure here.

He paid a king's randsom for JP and force-fed him to the fans and the HC.

Most of the fans bought into it, but the HC never did and likely never will.

We would have been better keeping those three draft picks if the staff wasn't buying-in to the process of developing a rookie QB. MM had more faith in a noodle-armed version of Alex VanPelt than in his own ability to develop a young talent - even with Sam Wyche on the case.

Now, even if he does come back he's set JP's development back at least a year.

 

It's a dreadful situation TD has managed this team into. Simply dreadful.

That said, I think he stays on as president and chief marketing officer and Ralph gives the team management responsibilities to someone else. I'm on the fence about MM staying, but if he does stay, a few of his staff should definitely be shown the door.

[Frez]

I'd like to know why JP didn't start yesterday?

 

 

WHY?

[Johnny Coli]

I'd like to know why JP didn't start yesterday?

WHY?

548384[/snapback]

Mularkey was trying to squeeze out a win to get to 6-10. That is the only explanation. I'm not an Xs and Os guy, though. I clearly don't understand the complex nuances of the game.

 

I'd also like to add, why wasn't JP playing the second half of last season when this all could have been sorted out?

[Fixxxer]

I've learned he can't throw an out route to safe his life, hence the pass over the middle of the field with 90 seconds left in the fourth Qrt. Several times yesterday receivers had to wait for the pass to get to them.

 

I've learned defenses will play a cover two defense giving him the underneath stuff, for his stats and pass % to look good.

Because of this Willis game benefits.

[rockpile]

I'd like to know why JP didn't start yesterday?

WHY?

548384[/snapback]

Um, benching him builds character?

 

What did we learn? If QB was the question, Holcomb is not the answer.

 

Holcomb = Kerry Collins

[Nanker]

Would the Bills have won the KC game had Holcomb stayed in?

Would the Bills have held on to beat Miami had Moulds not pouted on the sidelines?

Would you be using the Cinn game for your argument had McGee not single-handedly scored 14 points?

Would JP have thrown 4 picks in a game because the defense knew the QB was incapable of completing a deep pass?

548381[/snapback]

 

Deep Pass

Definition:

A pass (that preferably goes for a completion) to a Receiver (on the same team) who is further than 10 (ten) yards downfield of the line of scrimmage while the Quarterback remains behind said line of scrimmage and the entire Offensive Line does not commit a holding penalty or other similar infraction, and the remaining Offensive Players e.g., Weak-kneed Running Backs, Invisible Tight Ends, and Non-Receiving Receivers don't hold, interfere, make a false start or commit a personal foul (such as spitting at an opponent) during the entire duration of the play.

 

Preferably, after completion of the deep pass, if the Receiver hasn't scored, he gains additional yardage and/or is tackled and the play whistled dead before the momentum-shifting fumble occurs.

[coltrane34]

they learned absolutely nothing by not starting JP. Actually they lost another chanch to give him some game experience, or at least give him another chance to prove himself. Any QB besides big ben needs at least 12 starts before the begin to get it. Look at Palmer, Eli, Boller, Harrington, Farve, Elway......none of these palyers looked good in their first 10 starts. JP needs experience and a line to protect him. The bills lost a goodchance for JP to gain experience against a division rival.

[eSJayDee]

1) Would the Bills have gained 375 yards of offense vs. Cincy

probably not.

 

and 343 yards vs. the Jets with JP Losman at QB?

 

Probably so.

 

Would we have scored 37 and 26 points the last two weeks with JP Losman at QB?

Considering in both games the offense only scored 2 TDs, then yes, it is conceivable.

 

The more important question w/ respect to this one, is what good did it accomplish?

Did it get us any closer to the playoffs this year? Did it likely improve our chances for making the playoffs next year? The answer is no.

 

 

2) If Eric Moulds had not caught 10 for 99 and 8 for 96 the last two weeks, would you possibly be thinking that just maybe Eric Moulds really might not be able to play any more?

I would think he's declined from his prime, but even w/ his stellar production these last 2 weeks, I still don't think he's worth the >$5m cap space retaining him will cost.

 

3) If teams had continued to have zero fear of our QB (JP Losman) being able to pass the ball, at Willis McGahee didn't have 100 yards against the Jets, would you be a bit more concerned about McGahee not having had 100 yards since Halloween?

The problem is that this brings even closer to light the issue of why can't he/we be this successful on a more consistent basis? Is it coaching, blocking or him?

[Kgun5]

Exactly. This could go down as THE Hallmark TD blunder of his tenure here.

He paid a king's randsom for JP and force-fed him to the fans and the HC.

Most of the fans bought into it, but the HC never did and likely never will.

We would have been better keeping those three draft picks if the staff wasn't buying-in to the process of developing a rookie QB. MM had more faith in a noodle-armed version of Alex VanPelt than in his own ability to develop a young talent - even with Sam Wyche on the case.

Now, even if he does come back he's set JP's development back at least a year.

 

It's a dreadful situation TD has managed this team into. Simply dreadful.

That said, I think he stays on as president and chief marketing officer and Ralph gives the team management responsibilities to someone else. I'm on the fence about MM staying, but if he does stay, a few of his staff should definitely be shown the door.

548383[/snapback]

 

However one feels about JP's ability, it was shockingly mishandled. So many coaches in pro sports underestimate how much confidence has to do with young-player success. These are still kids, for the most part. Sure, some guys are unflappable, but most aren't. New players have to be handled differently then veterans, and this wasn't done with JP.

 

JP played his best when he threw caution to the wind. The coaches should have stood behind him and been supportive. Instead they gave him the hook in game #2. That kind of thing can kill a player. It's really too bad.

[colin]

the way i see it, jp should NOT have had the starters job come week one.

 

he just wasn't ready and the team knew it, and he was erratic.

 

holcomb should have started for a couple/few weeks until jp looked good in practice or holcomb got hurt, or holcomb started just totally sucking ass (sooner or later it would happen). you have to go with your best chance to win.

 

after the 5 or 6 game mark, we'd have won 3 or 4 and then put in JP in a much less pressured situation (this is pretty much how manning got involved last year, and how big ben got in, when maddox went down).

 

frankly i think we did the exact worst thing we could have done. gave the starting job to the kid who wasn't ready, pulled him and put him back in a few times, then put in the vet back up.

 

i also think our O was NOT suitable for our team or our young QB. the dumb slow to develope plays, the lack of running especially late in the game, and the lack of the deep ball early (it makes laugh how solid jp is at the deep bomb and how they didn't bother with them in the first 7 weeks or so) just shows we have coaches who don't know what the hell they are doing.

 

i really really hope all our coaches (with the exceptions of april and perhaps some other position coaches) get the axe along with td.

 

with a couple big men and an average or better coaching staff this team might be able to do something.

[rockpile]

It seems that the Bills have a history of stomping the heart out of their QBs, at least since JK!

 

If JP is going to survive, he NEEDS to be the swaggering confidant MoFo QB he was advertised to be. He also better buy Isotoners for his blockers too. He needs every player on this team to be watching his back.

 

However one feels about JP's ability, it was shockingly mishandled.  So many coaches in pro sports underestimate how much confidence has to do with young-player success.  These are still kids, for the most part.  Sure, some guys are unflappable, but most aren't.  New players have to be handled differently then veterans, and this wasn't done with JP.

 

JP played his best when he threw caution to the wind.  The coaches should have stood behind him and been supportive.  Instead they gave him the hook in game #2.  That kind of thing can kill a player.  It's really too bad.

548418[/snapback]

[Johnny Coli]

Deep Pass

Definition:

A pass (that preferably goes for a completion) to a Receiver (on the same team) who is further than 10 (ten) yards downfield of the line of scrimmage while the Quarterback remains behind said line of scrimmage and the entire Offensive Line does not commit a holding penalty or other similar infraction, and the remaining Offensive Players e.g., Weak-kneed Running Backs, Invisible Tight Ends, and Non-Receiving Receivers don't hold, interfere, make a false start or commit a personal foul (such as spitting at an opponent) during the entire duration of the play.

 

Preferably, after completion of the deep pass, if the Receiver hasn't scored, he gains additional yardage and/or is tackled and the play whistled dead before the momentum-shifting fumble occurs.

548396[/snapback]

To add..

 

Holcomb had 23 completions:

-16 were for 9 yards or less

-5 were for 10-19 yards

-2 were for 20+, the longest being a 22 yard gain

 

Of his 4 INTs:

Three INTs came on passes of 20, 17 and 18 yards, the fourth was to Shelton for 3 yards

 

He was 5 for 7 passing to McGahee/Williams/Shelton for a total of 33 yards with the majority coming from a 19 yard catch and run by Willis.

 

Note that YAC are included in these numbers.