SOMEONE explain this to me...regarding JP

[MDH]

Eli Manning vs. Pittsburgh

16 of 23 (70%) for 182 yards, 2 TD, 1 INT, 2 rushes for 18 yards

 

Tom Brady - Super Bowl

(O.k., this was Brady's 2nd year, but Losman threw more passes as a rookie than Brady did.)

 

Ben Roethlisberger - @Dallas (to pick just one example)

21 of 25 (84%!!!) for 193 yards, 2 TD

 

Byron Leftwich - vs. San Diego

19 of 28 (68%) for 336 yards!!!, 2 TD

 

Carson Palmer - @Baltimore (again, 2nd year, but Losman threw more passes as a rookie than Palmer did)

29 of 36 (80.6%!!) for 382 yards!!!, 3 TD and 1 INT

 

Rex Grossman - vs. Washington

19 of 32 (59.4%) for 249 yds 2TD and 1 INT (note: this is not spectacular by any means, but is more yards than Losman has ever thrown for, and a higher completion percentage than ever game against the Texans.)

 

Next question?

 

JDG

545319[/snapback]

 

What you're forgetting in all of those examples (except Grossman, but I'd hardly call those stats "good the whole game") is that each of those players had a larger sample set from which to draw their "good" game. If JP had gotten to start 16 games this season I'd guess that he'd have a few flashy number games too. Who knows what the kid does for the entire KC game.

 

It's unbelievable to me that anybody has given up on a first round draft pick who has only gotten to start eight games. There are maybe 2 QBs in the history of the NFL who have looked good in that number of starts. Until JPs last start the kid had shown much improvement over his last 3-4 games. It might not show up in the stats but that's why you actually have to watch the games.

 

The way this team has handled the QB situation this year has been a complete joke. You either show full commitment to the 1st round draft pick and let him play hell or high water or you don’t cut Bledsoe and see if JP can beat him out in camp. If he doesn’t you go with Drew. Cutting Drew and not showing a full commitment to JP was a huge mistake and we’re reaping the “rewards” of it right now.

[JDG]

What you're forgetting in all of those examples (except Grossman, but I'd hardly call those stats "good the whole game") is that each of those players had a larger sample set from which to draw their "good" game. 

 

Not quite. Eli Manning started the same number of games as a rookie as JP did this year. Leftwich's San Diego game was his second start. Big Ben's Dallas game was his 4th start. Point being, NFL Rookie QB's *are* capable of showing us good games in the time allotted to Losman so far. Now, he could well be a late-bloomer ala Rich Gannon, but that doessn't preclude being concerned about the present.

 

And yes, while Grossman's game was hardly spectacular - its still better than any game that Losman has ever had - which is surely an adequate description of how very bad Losman has been.

 

JDG

[MDH]

Not quite.  Eli Manning started the same number of games as a rookie as JP did this year.  Leftwich's San Diego game was his second start.    Big Ben's Dallas game was his 4th start.  Point being, NFL Rookie QB's *are* capable of showing us good games in the time allotted to Losman so far.    Now, he could well be a late-bloomer ala Rich Gannon, but that doessn't preclude being concerned about the present.

 

And yes, while Grossman's game was hardly spectacular - its still better than any game that Losman has ever had - which is surely an adequate description of how very bad Losman has been.

 

JDG

545327[/snapback]

 

I guess I've seen a different player than you have. I'll agree 3/4 of his first four starts were bad. However once he came back from the benching I saw a QB who made better decisions, threw the ball more accurately and used the entire field. While he didn't look spectacular he looked good for a young QB. The stats don't tell the entire story. I'm wondering how many of the games you listed above by other QBs you actually watched or are you just looking at a stat line?

 

Also, I don't see how you think Grossman's game was better than Losman's game against Houston or his game against KC, but whatever (and yeah, I saw the Grossman game you listed).

[BillsObserver]

Please be specific and cite one example of a rookie QB playing well for 60 minutes.

I disagree.  He's been much better and it doesn't surprise me (nor should it surprise anyone else) that NE manhandled him.  Belichick's defense has made Peyton Manning look like a rookie more than once.

 

Losman has been dealt an impossible hand and I doubt that many rookie QBs would have faired much better.

545311[/snapback]

 

Precisely.

 

Good stuff.

 

It's a shame a lot of people are writing off Losman already.

[Tasker]

Holcomb gives us nothing...period.

 

I like 6-10 more than 5-11, but it doesn't matter. The team would have to be much better to have any chance of making the playoffs with Holcomb at any point in the future. I'm not interested in what Kelly Holcomb brings to the table. We bet a lot on JPL, and we need to give that investment a chance to pay off. He should have taken every snap where he was not injured all season long, and MM is basically wrong every snap he put KH in.

 

If we wanted to try to be a team with a KH type quarterback, pounding the ball on the ground and relying on defense, that decision should have been made last year, and we should have saved the 1st, 3rd, and 5th round picks we spent on JPL on three linemen or a tightend.

 

I'm not ready to say that JPL is as big a bust as Mike Williams, and I think he can be good, but obviously the coach and front office are already decided. This team needs to rebuild to make the playoffs, and an upside quarterback is a big piece of that. Play to win on Sunday, but play to win with JPL.

[Tasker]

Also, developing quarterbacks takes time and patience as people point out again and again. If JPL isn't our guy, then TD needs to be fired BEFORE JPL watches one play from the bench.

[Spiderweb]

This is where your narrative breaks down. 

 

1) At no point has JP Losman ever played "really well" for a complete 60 minute football game.

 

2) JP Losman hasn't ever really shown signs of progress, in that his worst game as a pro was his last one (home vs. New England) and one of his two best games as a pro was his first one (home vs. Houston).

 

JDG

545300[/snapback]

 

Prior to the Pats game, I'd have to disagree. JP did show improvement beginning with his KC game. What bothered me about him was that he wasn't consistent. Start hot, cool off and go into a shell. Much was the play calling, but JP never did anything to rid me of that nagging feeling. A 60 minute game? No, he hasn't to date, but now lately it's been even tougher for him to reach this point sitting on the bench.

[MartyBall4Buffalo]

I'll go farther then not playing good for an entire game. Has Losman once played good this season for more then a quater of football? his burst against miami came in the first 5 minutes, we all know what happened after that. The KC game was basically coming off the bench. Houston has proven to be the worst team in the league, and even then he played poorly in the 2nd half.

 

 

 

I'm not saying he wont ever be a good quaterback, but he's yet to prove he can string together 2 good quaters let alone 4. I've seen some improvements with him since his benching. I've seen him look off his first option more. I've seen him make some throws he wasn't making earlier in the year. However he still panics with imaginary pressure. He needs to learn to take some of the heat off the short passes. This will go a long way to improving his completion pct drastically. So will a receiving te. I'm not giving up on losman, but I'd like to see him improve his short passes, learn to check down it's not there deep. Learn to get other wr's involved. And add some weight to your frame. I'm worried he's too lanky to take hits in this leauge that he will take.

[Risin]

I'll go farther then not playing good for an entire game.  Has Losman once played good this season for more then a quater of football? his burst against miami came in the first 5 minutes, we all know what happened after that. The KC game was basically coming off the bench. Houston has proven to be the worst team in the league, and even then he played poorly in the 2nd half.

I'm not saying  he wont ever be a good quaterback, but he's yet to prove he can string together 2 good quaters let alone 4.   I've seen some improvements with him since his benching.  I've seen him look off his first option more.  I've seen him make some throws he wasn't making earlier in the year. However he still panics with imaginary pressure.  He needs to learn to take some of the heat off the short passes.  This will go a long way to improving his completion pct drastically.  So will a receiving te.  I'm not giving up on losman, but I'd like to see him improve his short passes, learn to check down it's not there deep. Learn to get other wr's involved. And add some weight to your frame.  I'm worried he's too lanky to take hits in this leauge that he will take.

545497[/snapback]

 

 

 

Worry less about JP, and more about the guy you're named after.

 

Maybe if he played better, JP would have a chance.

[bluv]

I'll go farther then not playing good for an entire game.  Has Losman once played good this season for more then a quater of football? his burst against miami came in the first 5 minutes, we all know what happened after that. The KC game was basically coming off the bench. Houston has proven to be the worst team in the league, and even then he played poorly in the 2nd half.

I'm not saying  he wont ever be a good quaterback, but he's yet to prove he can string together 2 good quaters let alone 4.  I've seen some improvements with him since his benching.  I've seen him look off his first option more.  I've seen him make some throws he wasn't making earlier in the year. However he still panics with imaginary pressure.  He needs to learn to take some of the heat off the short passes.  This will go a long way to improving his completion pct drastically.  So will a receiving te.  I'm not giving up on losman, but I'd like to see him improve his short passes, learn to check down it's not there deep. Learn to get other wr's involved. And add some weight to your frame.  I'm worried he's too lanky to take hits in this leauge that he will take.

545497[/snapback]

Ok besides the Bengals game, has KH played a complete game? I mean in his 1st two starts against the Jets and Dolphins he started off great but faded in the 2nd half. Same thing in NE game on ESPN as well. But it isn't KH fault either as most of that has to do with coaching and gameplanning as this coaching staff doesn't adjust well on gameday. As much as they need to stick with a QB, they need to stick to a gamplan and a philosohpy so that we can have an identity That is why I want to see JP as the starter for based on these flashes in only 8 starts I know his upside is better than KH wants we get a coaching staff who knows what it is doing. Now if JP was playing like Alex Smith showing no glimpse I'd be worried.

[KD in CA]

It's a little tougher when daddy takes away the two wheeler and locks it away in the shed.  All the kid can do is imagine riding the bike as he sits in his room instead of being outside riding the bike.  The kid doesn't get any better at bike riding doing this.

545216[/snapback]

 

 

but...but....he gets to look out the window at his more popular big brother riding his bike. doesn't that help???