VIPP Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 All that personality BS aside, I don't get it! JPs Short Career Highlights -The kid was stapled to the bench for his entire first season (partly due to his injury) -Struggled mightly in his first few games and was sent to the bench -came in for the injured holocomb and played really well -showed progress, before getting injured again -and now he's back on the bench, and we're talking about Holocomb and finding another QB What I don't understand is how you can judge a YOUNG QB of all all players over the span of only 8 games played!! *Joey Harrington was given 3 years to prove himself, and he had the backing of the team and coached 100% *David Carr has struggled and he is still considered the franchise *Alex Smith has played HORRIBLE and his team still has faith in him *peyton manning was 3-13 his first year and had almost a double INT-TD ratio, and his team still backed him ***** And here's my gem, Eli Manning was HORRIBLE in his rookie season..i mean HORRIBLE!!!!!!! There is only so much you can learn by riding the bench and watching, 80% of learning is doing! Learning how to pick up blitz, learning to check down, learning to audible, learning the hurry up....these are things that you pick up while playing the game You guys gotta realize that not everyone is a ben rothleisberger, a tom brady or a carson palmer those are rare players who somehow manage to adapt. I mean hell, it takes WRs atleast 2 full seasons before they become IMPACT player (juss ask Eric Moulds)...and all they gotta do is learn a bunch of routes...whereas QB's gotta learn ALL the routes and all the plays and everything for the entire offence!! Brian Billick stood by Kyle Boller for a LONG time, and was patient with him..in his last few games he's been lighting up opposing secondary's!! And the reason why is because he's becoming COMFORTABLE in that offense...JP is still shaky... If after year 3 we don't see some SERIOUS progess, or even backwards development then by all means dumb him...but after what I have witnessed.. -Willis's lack of effort and production -the O-line putrid pass blocking at times(not all the time, they're sporadic) -the WR's drop balls -the horrible play calling -lack of a running game is it REALLy fair to judge him soley as the reason why were not playing well. I'm sorry but i don't want noddle arm Holocomb who's pushing 30 calling our plays he's a CAREER backup... Can some1 please explain to me what the problem is, cuz i don't get it.. boller, carr, harrington = we'll give u some time jp =win now or u suck, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Can some1 please explain to me what the problem is, cuz i don't get it.. boller, carr, harrington = we'll give u some time jp =win now or u suck, 545181[/snapback] Maybe it's the expectations imposed by fans. I mean so many people here felt this team was going to to as good if not better than last year as JP should have had no problems being as good as bad as Bledsoe was in 2004. Infact I was criticized when I predicted in the preseason that we'd go 6-10 this season. Granted I felt the defense would be much better than it's been and felt the Bengals be the worst team in the AFC, which proves I can be wrong too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 I'm not counting JP out. Even if Kelly Holcomb is named the started, he'll suffer an injury before week 6. JP will get another chance, hopefully he'll stay healthy, and play well. Holcomb is a great backup, nothing more. I guess people forgot about the last great backup (AVP), who replaced an injured Rob Johnson, and threw for back-to-back 300+ yard games, by dinking and dunking. I don't remember people hollering for Alex to be a starter, even though he played more impressive, on a worse team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe in NC Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 jp =win now or u suck, 545181[/snapback] Or better yet, JP = win now behind arguably the worst o-line in the NFL or you suck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thailog80 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Maybe just maybe the goddamn kid is hurt. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Sometimes they call QBs "Coach Killers". We might have a coach who eventually will be labled "QB Killer" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VIPP Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 i understand we have high expectations for JP...but what team doesn't have high expectations when they take a player in the first round! For the most part, when you draft a OL, DL, LB, RB, TE, you can typically plug them in and they will make an impact... But for WR,CB, S, and especially QB's they're development takes a little longer...if you get outstanding production from those positions, count your blessing and thank the lord cuz them type of things don't happen often. JP has all the talent in the world, but this is a team game played by 22 players....our Defence can't hold ANYONE!!! Our WR's can't seperate from the DB's...when is the last time u remember seeing a wide open WR for the buffalo bills? Our defense is so used to those broken coverages where an opposing WR is running by himself in our secondary, but wen's the last time we have had that kind of luxury! And with this wack Coaching staff, that calls trick plays at the WRONG times, and run's when we should passs...and pass's when we should run...and abandons the run so quickly in a game...what do u expect!! The kid needs TIME he has all the tools...and now he needs the experience...How many children in their lives hoped on a two wheeler and took off riding...JP is gonna fall, pick himself up and get the hang of this eventually...I seen more promise in him, than Carr, Harrington and Boller...and i think he will be better than all three... juss give the kid time Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 How many children in their lives hoped on a two wheeler and took off riding...JP is gonna fall, pick himself up and get the hang of this eventually juss give the kid time 545199[/snapback] It's a little tougher when daddy takes away the two wheeler and locks it away in the shed. All the kid can do is imagine riding the bike as he sits in his room instead of being outside riding the bike. The kid doesn't get any better at bike riding doing this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tortured Soul Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Holcomb is a great backup, nothing more. I guess people forgot about the last great backup (AVP), who replaced an injured Rob Johnson, and threw for back-to-back 300+ yard games, by dinking and dunking. I don't remember people hollering for Alex to be a starter, even though he played more impressive, on a worse team. 545188[/snapback] AVP was not a great backup. He was a mediocre backup. Rich Gannon was a great backup, and when he was finally given a chance - at about the same age Holcomb is now - all he did was take his team to the SB and win the MVP. Or better yet, JP = win now behind arguably the worst o-line in the NFL or you suck 545189[/snapback] Why is no one anxious to see what Holcomb can do behind a line that gives him time? Why do people only use this excuse for JP? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikie2times Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 All that personality BS aside, I don't get it! JPs Short Career Highlights -The kid was stapled to the bench for his entire first season (partly due to his injury) -Struggled mightly in his first few games and was sent to the bench -came in for the injured holocomb and played really well -showed progress, before getting injured again -and now he's back on the bench, and we're talking about Holocomb and finding another QB What I don't understand is how you can judge a YOUNG QB of all all players over the span of only 8 games played!! *Joey Harrington was given 3 years to prove himself, and he had the backing of the team and coached 100% *David Carr has struggled and he is still considered the franchise *Alex Smith has played HORRIBLE and his team still has faith in him *peyton manning was 3-13 his first year and had almost a double INT-TD ratio, and his team still backed him ***** And here's my gem, Eli Manning was HORRIBLE in his rookie season..i mean HORRIBLE!!!!!!! There is only so much you can learn by riding the bench and watching, 80% of learning is doing! Learning how to pick up blitz, learning to check down, learning to audible, learning the hurry up....these are things that you pick up while playing the game You guys gotta realize that not everyone is a ben rothleisberger, a tom brady or a carson palmer those are rare players who somehow manage to adapt. I mean hell, it takes WRs atleast 2 full seasons before they become IMPACT player (juss ask Eric Moulds)...and all they gotta do is learn a bunch of routes...whereas QB's gotta learn ALL the routes and all the plays and everything for the entire offence!! Brian Billick stood by Kyle Boller for a LONG time, and was patient with him..in his last few games he's been lighting up opposing secondary's!! And the reason why is because he's becoming COMFORTABLE in that offense...JP is still shaky... If after year 3 we don't see some SERIOUS progess, or even backwards development then by all means dumb him...but after what I have witnessed.. -Willis's lack of effort and production -the O-line putrid pass blocking at times(not all the time, they're sporadic) -the WR's drop balls -the horrible play calling -lack of a running game is it REALLy fair to judge him soley as the reason why were not playing well. I'm sorry but i don't want noddle arm Holocomb who's pushing 30 calling our plays he's a CAREER backup... Can some1 please explain to me what the problem is, cuz i don't get it.. boller, carr, harrington = we'll give u some time jp =win now or u suck, 545181[/snapback] I agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twist_to_open Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 I agree 545220[/snapback] With our team so shored up, solid lines on both sides of the ball and all the skilled players we need, now is the time to call JP a wash so we can go after another QB with our high 1st rounder! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 AVP was not a great backup. He was a mediocre backup. Rich Gannon was a great backup, and when he was finally given a chance - at about the same age Holcomb is now - all he did was take his team to the SB and win the MVP.Why is no one anxious to see what Holcomb can do behind a line that gives him time? Why do people only use this excuse for JP? 545218[/snapback] LOL! Rich Gannon! Please don't even compare the two, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bbills17 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 There is only so much you can learn by riding the bench and watching, 80% of learning is doing! Learning how to pick up blitz, learning to check down, learning to audible, learning the hurry up....these are things that you pick up while playing the game If 80% is learned by doing, Brady, Hasselbeck, Pennington, Bulger, etc learned an awful lot in that 20% being on the bench!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 If 80% is learned by doing, Brady, Hasselbeck, Pennington, Bulger, etc learned an awful lot in that 20% being on the bench!! 545264[/snapback] Yes, but I think they were less raw then JP coming out of college. Remember, the word on him was that he was a raw product, with tons of "potential" Typically, them QB's need more time, because they are less NFL ready. It's obvious that Big Ben, Brady, and many other QB's were more ready then JP coming out of college. The knock on NFL ready QB's is usually, their ceiling of potential is not nearly as high. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 All that personality BS aside, I don't get it! JPs Short Career Highlights -The kid was stapled to the bench for his entire first season (partly due to his injury) -Struggled mightly in his first few games and was sent to the bench -came in for the injured holocomb and played really well -showed progress, before getting injured again This is where your narrative breaks down. 1) At no point has JP Losman ever played "really well" for a complete 60 minute football game. 2) JP Losman hasn't ever really shown signs of progress, in that his worst game as a pro was his last one (home vs. New England) and one of his two best games as a pro was his first one (home vs. Houston). JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cåblelady Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 JDG 545300[/snapback] JDG=RJ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 This is where your narrative breaks down. 1) At no point has JP Losman ever played "really well" for a complete 60 minute football game. Please be specific and cite one example of a rookie QB playing well for 60 minutes. 2) JP Losman hasn't ever really shown signs of progress, in that his worst game as a pro was his last one (home vs. New England) and one of his two best games as a pro was his first one (home vs. Houston). JDG 545300[/snapback] I disagree. He's been much better and it doesn't surprise me (nor should it surprise anyone else) that NE manhandled him. Belichick's defense has made Peyton Manning look like a rookie more than once. Losman has been dealt an impossible hand and I doubt that many rookie QBs would have faired much better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 This is where your narrative breaks down. 1) At no point has JP Losman ever played "really well" for a complete 60 minute football game. 2) JP Losman hasn't ever really shown signs of progress, in that his worst game as a pro was his last one (home vs. New England) and one of his two best games as a pro was his first one (home vs. Houston). JDG 545300[/snapback] But to say JP looked bad and should be benched, is like saying Drew looked bad and should be cut. A year later we all see that Drew wasn't completely washed up and his decline here was due to factors other than in his control. Why not bench half our starters? They all suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 Please be specific and cite one example of a rookie QB playing well for 60 minutes. Eli Manning vs. Pittsburgh 16 of 23 (70%) for 182 yards, 2 TD, 1 INT, 2 rushes for 18 yards Tom Brady - Super Bowl (O.k., this was Brady's 2nd year, but Losman threw more passes as a rookie than Brady did.) Ben Roethlisberger - @Dallas (to pick just one example) 21 of 25 (84%!!!) for 193 yards, 2 TD Byron Leftwich - vs. San Diego 19 of 28 (68%) for 336 yards!!!, 2 TD Carson Palmer - @Baltimore (again, 2nd year, but Losman threw more passes as a rookie than Palmer did) 29 of 36 (80.6%!!) for 382 yards!!!, 3 TD and 1 INT Rex Grossman - vs. Washington 19 of 32 (59.4%) for 249 yds 2TD and 1 INT (note: this is not spectacular by any means, but is more yards than Losman has ever thrown for, and a higher completion percentage than ever game against the Texans.) Next question? JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JDG Posted December 30, 2005 Share Posted December 30, 2005 But to say JP looked bad and should be benched, is like saying Drew looked bad and should be cut. A year later we all see that Drew wasn't completely washed up and his decline here was due to factors other than in his control. Why not bench half our starters? They all suck. 545313[/snapback] For the record, I think we should play Losman on Sunday. I am simply pointing out that in NFL terms the time has come to be concerned about the long-term prospects of JP Losman. He has been unusually bad, and has given us very scant glimmers of hope for the future. And as such, the Buffalo Bills coaches and players should not be excoriated for having a bit of concern about this thing themselves..... JDG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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