Fezmid Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Lets see, two guys who want their share of catches (translate incentives) and defensive players who know nada about offense, let alone QB play. As someone already pointed out, you simply cannot have the inmates running the asylum. Player are paid to play, not judge ability or performance. In today's highly specialized game they must concentrate on their own position, there is no time for judging others. 544475[/snapback] Defensive players in the NFL know "nada" about offense, yet people on a message board do?! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 would carson palmer have beat out jon kitna in open competition last year? 544445[/snapback] just playing devil's advocata here - would cade mcnown have beat out john kitna last year? rick mirer? the point being, be careful with your comparisons ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tux of Borg Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Holcomb has had 10 years in this league to become a starting QB. He's been scouted by other NFL teams and nobody else thought he was starting QB material. We have one meaningless game left this season. It's a great chance to give Losman some experience and we are going to waste it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 jon kitna at the end of 2003-2004 looked reborn, some speculated marvin lewis would bench carson palmer another year and keep kitna. instead lewis put palmer out there, let him play with no pressure, and voila, you have a full fledged NFL starter 544452[/snapback] to repeat: based upon college career, draft position, play this year, etc., losman has pretty definitively proven -- so far -- that he's no carson palmer. so please don't compare the two ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 This pretty much reflects a post that Back In Da Day started a couple of days ago and he hit it right on the head. The problem here is that the organization (MM and TD) did not create an environment where Losman would be the unequivocable starter, unlike M. Lewis has done as some have pointed out. Instead we have a situation where he's given the job without a fight before the season, gets pulled after game 4, gets it back (by way of injury), loses it again (by way of 'injury'???), and now it seems like he will be competing for the job next year. MM/TD needed to commit one way or another, either stick with him come hell or highwater, or have him compete for it from the start untill he legitimately earns it. Instead, the situation has gotten to where the locker room is picking favorites, RJ/DF redux minus the nastiness. 544466[/snapback] again, just playing devil's advocate -- what if the guy ain't that good? and what if it's pretty apparent to everybody? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sweet baboo Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Even Bills defenders are beginning to back Holcomb, a 10-year veteran in his first season with Buffalo. ``I mean, look at the statistics,'' linebacker London Fletcher said. ``He's proven that he can be a starting quarterback in the National Football League week in and week out and definitely a starter for us.'' 544423[/snapback] Fletcher and the defense can STFU part of the reason why the JP experiment hasn't worked this year is because they couldn't hold up their end of the bargain...defense controls the game while the offense scores just enough to win and the QB tries not to make mistakes remember? instead, they laid down and spread eagled themselves Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan III Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 More much ado about nothing... None of the players said anything remotely negative about Losman.. None of the players said Holcomb should be the starter.. You could have replaced Holcomb with any other player and got similar responses. Every player knows they could lose their job at any time. Players accept that because they know the other 52 guys are in the same boat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crackur Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 JP needs to grow up.....he is impatient........he needs to stop looking at his wrist for plays........he looks toward the receiver he wants too much........kids needs a bootcamp from some vets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
major Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 Of course the players support Holcomb more than Losman. You want to go with the guy that gives you the best opportunity to WIN. That's the problem with too many coaches, they don't go with the players that give them the best chance of winning ball games each week. Instead, politics resides in management, coaching, etc... It happens in college and it happens in the NFL. Sad, but true. This isn't the first time the Bills have gone with the wrong guy. Anyone remember the Rob Johnson experiment? Flutie gave us the best chance to win; however, management went with the taller and less experienced Rob Johnson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mcjeff215 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 again, just playing devil's advocate -- what if the guy ain't that good? and what if it's pretty apparent to everybody? 544498[/snapback] Yeah, I agree. What if he honesty just sucks ass? Note that that's not what I want, but it is certainly a possibility. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest BackInDaDay Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 again, just playing devil's advocate -- what if the guy ain't that good? and what if it's pretty apparent to everybody? 544498[/snapback] Then the Bills should start him against a poor Jets team and give him every oportunity to shine. Kind of like spiffin' up the old lemon and driving it up and down Main St trying to get some chumps interested. If that's what they all think, then they better try to recover something for that wasted 1st rounder. Now, please don't tell me our team's the only one that would waste time, money and draft picks on adding obvious busts to our roster. There's got to be another owner/GM tandem out there that hasn't done their homework either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alg Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 would carson palmer have beat out jon kitna in open competition last year? 544445[/snapback] Seriously. I cannot believe the drivel people are spewing over Holcromb. Kitna played OUTSTANDING ball the year before, but no one messed with the Palmer kid's development. But in Bills land a QB with 5 starts better put up or he goes to the bench....for a career journeyman. Fans and press have created a fake QB controversy, and it was allowed to fester because MM didn't put his foot down and cut this puppy off at the knees. I was here for DF v RJ, but this one is about as bogus and "Dawgged" as anything I have ever seen. 'We' fans better get a grip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
meazza Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 I wouldn't call Cincy's D pathetic. 544490[/snapback] as of NFL.com rankings, Cinncinati is in the bottom 15. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MartyBall4Buffalo Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 as of NFL.com rankings, Cinncinati is in the bottom 15. 544540[/snapback] they lead the league in ints though, but yeah they're not a great defense. 22nd overall, still holcomb played quality football on the road against a division leading team and made some great throws. It is what it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Buftex Posted December 29, 2005 Author Share Posted December 29, 2005 More much ado about nothing... None of the players said anything remotely negative about Losman.. None of the players said Holcomb should be the starter.. You could have replaced Holcomb with any other player and got similar responses. Every player knows they could lose their job at any time. Players accept that because they know the other 52 guys are in the same boat. 544511[/snapback] Normally I would agree with you. Recall, however, the first time JP was benched in favor of Holcomb, the vetrans (Moulds, Campbell, etc etc) all said they were exicted to see Holcomb play, but always added the qualifier that JP was "the future". It is strange. I was very much in favor of Losman being benched after week 4. I thought he had played three of the worst games I had ever seen a Bills QB play (keep in mind, I had season tickets back in the Ferragamo/Mathison/Dufek era). I wasn't writing him off as a bust, but I was firmly convinced that he was a long, long way from being ready to be a starting NFL QB. Upon JP's second stint as the starter, I thought he showed a lot of progress. Not great, mind you, but I thought the benching was Mularkeys best (if not only) good move of the season. Now, that he has actually had some modicum of success, the media, a growing number of fans, and maybe some coaches seem less enthused about him than they were before he did anything. It just seems like there is something more to this whole thing. IMO, JP should start Sunday, if healthy... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC-Bills Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 ... Anyway Losman is nowhere near as good as Holcomb. Holcomb has a much better sense of field awarness. More accurate, and better at getting every wr involved. and Holcomb should be allowed to compete for the job next year. 544449[/snapback] And this revelation should come as a suprise how?!? Of course KH will be better than JP at this stage of the game. He's been in the league longer and played more than JP. This season is JP's first in starting. Get a grip folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bear Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 to repeat: based upon college career, draft position, play this year, etc., losman has pretty definitively proven -- so far -- that he's no carson palmer. so please don't compare the two ... 544497[/snapback] College career and draft position mean absolutely nothing. Play this year? Maybe if Losman weren't getting pulled every 3 games he would have been able to progress like Palmer did his first year. We'll never know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 That's because Marvin Lewis is a good coach. We got a moron running the show here. 544455[/snapback] Wait a minute. Didn't MM just get done beating Marvin on his home field? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zow2 Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 JP has 8 starts under his belt and that is ample for getting his "feet wet" in the NFL. If he's as good as people think , he will bust out in training camp next season and win the job hands down. Many teams including the BIlls are not going to kill a season by trying to develop a QB. The Bills 2005 season was effectively kiiled by a rookie QB and a poor defense. Next year they will upgrade the D again and use the QB that gives them the best chance to win and i will support whoever they choose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted December 29, 2005 Share Posted December 29, 2005 The Bills 2005 season was effectively kiiled by a rookie QB and a poor defense. 544567[/snapback] You're half-right there. Yeah, Holcomb has more wins this year. what, 2 of them? The Defense BLEW this year. So did the O-Line, so did Willis. So did the coaching for that matter. I'd hardly pin this season on Losman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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