Profiles in Christianity

[GG]

I was in Florida last week on vacation and went skeet shooting with my Father-in-law.  He and a group of about 12 guys get together every Thursday for a shooting 'league'.  Well, there happened to be another new guy (he was from Fort Pierce, Florida) shooting, as well.  As he finished up a round (he shot extremely well), one of the guys felt comfortable enough to say, within earshot of everyone in the group "That's how you shoot them ni@#$rs down in Fort Pierce, in't it!?"  Most of the group had a real good laugh at that...

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Stupid Q, but what does this enlightned crew think of Jews, Chinese, Indians, and Mexicans?

[X. Benedict]

Stupid Q, but what does this enlightned crew think of Jews, Chinese, Indians, and Mexicans?

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Chinese, Mexican, and Indian Food, all good.

I have never really been to Jewish resturaunt, but my

Uncle makes a mean rack of lamb.

[olivier in france]

I've never understood why WNYers love to stereotype and critic Boston and New England that much... Those are my two favorite places in the USA and they have a lot in common... WNYers like to think New England is a white collar arrogant place while it has deep blue collar and down to earth roots. I love WNY and New England because people are "real" in those regions, those places have a "soul", a peculiar feel ...

[RkFast]

I've never understood why WNYers love to stereotype and critic Boston and New England that much... Those are my two favorite places in the USA and they have a lot in common... WNYers like to think New England is a white collar arrogant place while it has deep blue collar and down to earth roots. I love WNY and New England because people are "real" in those regions, those places have a "soul", a peculiar feel ...

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So here we have a dude located in the country that has become the poster child for racial intolerance and a culture struggling with the issue or racial integration lecturing US about how racist WE are.

 

And the kicker? Hes does so while pumping up one of the most racist, intolerant places in the U.S.!

 

Youre a hoot, Ollie!

[olivier in france]

So here we have a dude located in the country that has become the poster child for racial intolerance and a culture struggling with the issue or racial integration lecturing US about how racist WE are.

 

And the kicker? Hes does so while pumping up one of the most racist, intolerant places in the U.S.!

 

Youre a hoot, Ollie!

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i had forgotten there was some world class specialists in the field of xenophobia, intolerance and stereotyping on this board, thanks for the reminder Mr Fast

[SilverNRed]

You said:

 

"I think a lot of black people are brought up to think that they are victims of racism and that they won't be allowed to succeed in America and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy.  Their motivation to stay in school and go to college has to suffer.  You tell someone every day of their life that they're worthless and they'll start to believe it.  You tell someone every day of their life that everyone else hates them because of their skin and eventually they'll believe that too."

 

Your point seems to be that there is no racism,

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No, that's not my point and you know that. My point all along has been that the race issue is overblown.

 

the problem is that someone is telling blacks that there are racists when there aren't and they are mistakenly believing that.  Since you don't think there is racism, then who ever is bringing them "up to think they are victims of racism" is lying or terribly mistaken according to your theory that there is no racism.  You know, the theory based on what you see on TV.  So...who is telling them or bringing them up to believe that there are racists when, in your view, there are none?  Why would it make a difference if the reality is that there is no racism, won't blacks be able to see that despite all these lies they are being fed by whoever is bringing them up?

Everything you just wrote is crap because I never said there was "no racism." Keep digging.

 

If there is no racism, why can't blacks see that as clearly as you do?  Why do they believe it resulting in losing "their motivation to stay in school and go to college"?  Tell me why they aren't able to see what you see?

Again with the "no racism" tag. Hilarious. One of my first posts in this thread was where I stated that racism was never going to end. Remember when I said there would be no VOR Day like you wanted?

 

Here's a reminder:

Racism is going to exist until the end of time.  Your fictional VOR Day (ha ha, so funny, send it to Letterman) will never take place.  As a whole, however, this country doesn't hold any group down.

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Really, are you seriously offering the presence of black entertainers on your TV dial as proof that there is no racism?  That was a joke right?  Ever heard of minstrel shows?  Even in the worst days of Jim Crow blacks were accepted as entertainers.

Black entertainers as proof? No. That fact that anyone of any color can be a popular and influential figure in this country? Yes.

 

Plenty of strides against racism have been made and in truth, many of the toughest battles have already been fought and won.

No duh.

 

However, the idea that there is no racism, coming from a 24 year old boy who thinks the world began when he was born and that his limited observations of people on TV are sufficient to declare an end to the most resilient and ancient of evils is laughable.  Stop watching TV and google "modern racism" and do some reading.

You should do some reading yourself. Earlier in the thread I said there would never be an end to racism. Then again, you do have this miraculous ability to read things that people don't write.

 

By the way, you need to sharpen your reading skills anyway.  Even though I put it in bold, you still missed that the lynching I referred to was only the last MASS lynching.  The last lynching was that of James Byrd in Texas in 1998.  Guess his killers hadn't heard the news from your TV that racism was dead.

Nice example. Here's what I wrote above:

 

I just said you can't rely on history as proof that racism is a huge problem now and your rebuttal is that the last mass lynching in this country was just 60 FRICKIN YEARS AGO.

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I see the word 'mass' in there. Do you? I put it in bold to help you. Your lack of honesty in this thread is staggering.

 

How embarassing for you that a 24 year old 'boy' can take you to the woodshed on something like this.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

If there is no racism, why can't blacks see that as clearly as you do?  Why do they believe it resulting in losing "their motivation to stay in school and go to college"?

Tell me why they aren't able to see what you see?

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"...that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie..."

 

Name that author.

 

It's easy to sway a population that is largely poor and under-educated for WHATEVER reason that something exists when it may or may not.

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

I live in Boston.  Racism is alive and well in this city.  From affluent suburban schools pulling out of leagues so they don't have to play inner city schools, to parents sueing school districts to keep from busing inner city kids into their schools.  South Boston and parts of Dorchester are extremely unwelcome for black kids to be in at night. Boston still has a racist reputation that comes up alot when FA atheletes are being courted for teams here.

 

People can choose to ignore it.  People can choose to pretend its going away.  And people can pretend it's all their own fault.  But it's there.

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So because someone opposes bussing, that means they're a racist? Sorry, not buying it.

 

I work hard to get my kid into a good school district, I don't want someone getting a free ride, black, white or otherwise.

[Scraps]

"...that in the big lie there is always a certain force of credibility; because the broad masses of a nation are always more easily corrupted in the deeper strata of their emotional nature than consciously or voluntarily; and thus in the primitive simplicity of their minds they more readily fall victims to the big lie than the small lie..."

 

Name that author.

 

It's easy to sway a population that is largely poor and under-educated for WHATEVER reason that something exists when it may or may not.

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Like WMDs?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Like WMDs? 

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Or a racist bogeyman. Take your pick.

[Scraps]

Or a racist bogeyman. Take your pick.

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You don't think racism exists?

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

You don't think racism exists?

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You don't think the WMD's exist?

 

I don't think it is institutionalized and systematic like the Jackson, Sharpton and their clownish colleagues would have the black community believe.

 

I think that SilverNRed is more right than wrong. These leeches prey on black people, playing to their fears to line their own pockets. The truth is, ANYONE can make it in America regardless of race...if they're willing to work and sacrifice.

 

That's the key, and it's why this country's gone to sh--. People are all about instant gratification and instant remedies. And I personally believe this syndrome is even worse in the black community, where kids routinely think they're going to grow up to be a basketball star or hip-hop artist.

 

And before you call me a racist, know that my wife teaches in an inner-city school. She interacts with black kids every day, and to a fault, when asked about their future, ALL of them reply in a similar fashion.

[Gavin in Va Beach]

And before you call me a racist, know that my wife teaches in an inner-city school. She interacts with black kids every day, and to a fault, when asked about their future, ALL of them reply in a similar fashion.

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Does she experience black kids not caring about school work because that would be "acting white"? It's not racism when a group inflicts mass stupidity on themselves...

[Pine Barrens Mafia]

Does she experience black kids not caring about school work because that would be "acting white"? It's not racism when a group inflicts mass stupidity on themselves...

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No, most of the kids are good about doing their work at whatever level they can. It's the PARENTS that are totally delinquent, if present at all. Not suprisingly, the answer is totally different when you speak about her Hispanic students. While they struggle with the language barrier, their parents (or some older family member) almost always make the trip for conferences or to the PTO.

 

I think the number one problem in the black community is the breakdown of the nuclear family.

[Wacka]

Thanks to LBJ's "War on Poverty".

[Mickey]

No, that's not my point and you know that.  My point all along has been that the race issue is overblown.

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Okay, keep running away from your own assertions, we'll narrow it down some more since now you are down to a defense that there is a real difference between asserting no racism and there being no significant racism, ie "overblown".

 

Ignoring for a minute that you said:

 

"Fact is: blacks are not persecuted in America."

 

And that you also said:

 

"As a whole, however, this country doesn't hold any group down."

 

And we will also forget that you said:

 

"I don't think racists are running around subverting opportunities for non-whites."

 

We will forget all of that for now and concentrate on the position you seem at last willing to stick by, that racism is not significant, that it is "overblown". Going back to the quote from you:

 

"I think a lot of black people are brought up to think that they are victims of racism and that they won't be allowed to succeed in America and it becomes a self-fulfilling prophecy. Their motivation to stay in school and go to college has to suffer. You tell someone every day of their life that they're worthless and they'll start to believe it. You tell someone every day of their life that everyone else hates them because of their skin and eventually they'll believe that too."

 

I'll ask the same questions only changing "no racism" to "no significant racism" or "overblown racism".

 

Who is bringing up these black people to erroneously beleive that racism is a significant problem, that it isn't overblown? Who is lying to them about the significance of racism? Why aren't they able to see what you see, that racism is not significant, that it is overblown? Why are they so blind and why are you able to see this so much more clearly than they despite their actually being black and experiencing the "insignificance" of racsim first hand?

 

Now, lets reconsider some of things you said that we put aside. Why can't these blacks see for themselves what you so clearly see, that they are not persecuted, they are not being held down and that there are no racists subverting them?

[jjamie12]

Stupid Q, but what does this enlightned crew think of Jews, Chinese, Indians, and Mexicans?

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I don't really know... I was only down there for a week, and I really didn't feel like getting to know them much more than that. I wouldn't want to put words in their mouths...

 

I DO know that my in-laws go to a small Catholic Church that had a significant Philipino population, probably around 30% or so... There were some problems with the white people in the church trying to keep the Philipinos out of leadership positions in the church, and with the typical non-inclusion problems that you might think would exist. It is better now, with some different lay leadership in that church, the most vocal of the 'discriminators' have stopped being vocal (I'm pretty sure they still feel the same way, obviously) and/or left the church.

[SilverNRed]

Okay, keep running away from your own assertions, we'll narrow it down some more since now you are down to a defense that there is a real difference between asserting no racism and there being no significant racism, ie "overblown".

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I'm on the defense? That's cute. Just remember, you're the guy who can't even keep track of who is saying what and, more often than not, just decides to stretch what anyone else says to fit your rebuttal. Like so:

 

Who is bringing up these black people to erroneously beleive that racism is a significant problem, that it isn't overblown?  Who is lying to them about the significance of racism?  Why aren't they able to see what you see, that racism is not significant, that it is overblown?  Why are they so blind and why are you able to see this so much more clearly than they despite their actually being black and experiencing the "insignificance" of racsim first hand?

You've put so many words in my mouth right there, it's hard to keep track. What a shock. Anyways, seeing as how you think white racism is sweeping the nation and resulting in massive persecution of all black people (see, I can pretend you say things too) and I am in fact white, I'm probably in an OK position to comment on how white people really may feel about black people. Especially from a standpoint of someone in a younger generation than yourself. Or are only black people allowed to comment on racism? The people who are supposedly so racist aren't allowed to speak on it?

 

Now, lets reconsider some of things you said that we put aside. Why can't these blacks see for themselves what you so clearly see, that they are not persecuted, they are not being held down and that there are no racists subverting them?

There you go again with "no racists." Are you working with some sort of "When in doubt, make stuff up" playbook? Anyways, I find it interesting that you don't want me to comment on racism from the standpoint of a white person (which I am) but continue to implore me to explain why some black people feel the way they do. Are you trying to tell me that the race card has never been used inappropriately? Are you trying to tell me that black people are not capable of having incorrect ideas about how white people may feel?

 

Feel free to misinterpret/distort/invert everything I just said. I'm sure you will anyway. And you've still failed to convince me in any way that America is full of racists persecuting black people. You should actually give that a try when you aren't calling me a 'boy' or making an ass out of yourself over the word "mass."

[Alaska Darin]

Feel free to misinterpret/distort/invert everything I just said.  I'm sure you will anyway.

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It's apparently the only trick he has left in the bag. I no longer wonder why the justice "system" is so fugged up, given the antics of the legal minds who hang out here.

[jjamie12]

And you've still failed to convince me in any way that America is full of racists persecuting black people.

 

I have a buddy here in Ithaca, NY that goes to the Business School at Cornell with me. He's a black fellow, about 6'3" 250 lbs... Needless to say, he sticks out like a sore thumb here. He is a graduate of Colgate University, and is a really great guy; fun, good-natured and good-hearted... He's also fabulously wealthy. He's a co-owner of a venture capital firm that has something like $100 million under management.

 

Anyhow... He drives some type of Jaguar. Now, I'm no gearhead, and don't know what the name of this particular vehicle is, but I CAN tell you that this is a very, very, nice ride. In any case, he's been in Ithaca since September and has been pulled over 4 times. He's never been issued a ticket. He's been pulled over because he was 'driving too slow' and because he 'looked lost'. Of course, the first thing that the police officers do when they get to the window is to ask the question, "Who's car is this?" which is surprising because if someone looked lost, I would probably ask them if they needed directions or something. Anyway, I don't think that their concern was the 'slow driving' or the 'lost lookingness' of this guy.

 

The problem with what you're saying (and the point of this story), SilverNRed, is that it doesn't take an 'America full of racists' to persecute Blacks or Indians or Philipinos or whomever... All it takes is a few people here and there, (maybe without them even knowing it) doing things like I've brought up in my two anecdotal examples, and a larger group of people that either don't or won't see the problems that this (relatively) small amount of people cause... Instead, they spend time on message boards, saying that the problems are minimal, Black people being poor is a self-fulfilling prophecy, and generally minimizing the difficulties that Black people have to deal with in these United States.

 

I happen to agree with you on one thing... I think that people like Rev.'s Sharpton and Jackson have probably done more harm than good for their people by playing racial politics in cases where there probably was no race case to be made. However, what you're doing, by minimizing the impact of prejudice, and, to a lesser degree, racism in our society, is just as bad as sensationalizing race problems...