Terry Tate Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 ... If you can prove empirically that first time black offenders are sentenced to more jail time that white first time offenders, is that not a systemic problem? ... I'd be more curious as to the relationship between average income and convictions. Actually, I'm not curious, as I know damn well what it would reflect. Unless you think OJ the janitor would also be free. Maybe instead of blaming racism for a higher percentage of black convictions, our resident lawyer will recognize there is a far greater number of blacks being convicted for a lack of a high-dollar defense, and offer his services for free. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olivier in france Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 Olivier did. That's what started all this. While your example is a very good one of racism in this country, it doesn't even BEGIN to demonstrate (and you didn't say it did, I know) olivier's observation that blacks are "oppressed" in the US. All true. As RunTheDamnBall said, people fear difference...when they aren't simply ignorant, like my parents. "Oh, I hope those blacks don't buy the house behind us...all the drugs and wild parties..." 563243[/snapback] i never said blacks are oppressed in the US Crap!! read my posts again! i said they were as oppressed as muslims in France! (JSP is the first one that used the word "oppressed"), Blacks in the US are not oppressed, muslims in France are not oppressed, but a lot of them are victims of racism, discrimination and living out of the mainstream society, that's all i said! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I've never understood why WNYers love to stereotype and critic Boston and New England that much... Those are my two favorite places in the USA and they have a lot in common... WNYers like to think New England is a white collar arrogant place while it has deep blue collar and down to earth roots. I love WNY and New England because people are "real" in those regions, those places have a "soul", a peculiar feel ... 561781[/snapback] I used to think that until I moved to the Midwest. Maybe it is a "Westward Movement" thing that dates back through American history? Yes, things are pretty different now... But, the stereotypes of the people back east as arrogant and snobby goes back far. Did you catch the History Channel's program on "Blizzards?"... It was pretty interesting on NYC's take on the 1888 Plains Blizzard... It is funny to look back at history and note the "eastern arrogance." Just 2 months later that year NYC would eat their words. Part of my sig is from 10,000 Maniacs, Gold Rush Brides: follow the typical signs, the hand-painted lines, down prairie roads. pass the lone church spire. pass the talking wire from where to who knows? there's no way to divide the beauty of the sky from the wild western plains. where a man could drift, in legendary myth, by roaming over spaces. the land was free and the price was right. Dakota on the wall is a white-robed woman, broad yet maidenly. such power in her hand as she hails the wagon man's family. I see indians that crawl through this mural that recalls our history. who were the homestead wives? who were the gold rush brides? does anybody know? do their works survive their yellow fever lives in the pages they wrote? the land was free, yet it cost their lives. in miner's lust for gold. a family's house was bought and sold, piece-by-piece. a widow staked her claim on a dollar and his name, so painfully. in letters mailed back home her eastern sisters they would moan as they would read accounts of madness, childbirth, loneliness and grief. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olivier in france Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 I used to think that until I moved to the Midwest. Maybe it is a "Westward Movement" thing that dates back through American history? Yes, things are pretty different now... But, the stereotypes of the people back east as arrogant and snobby goes back far. Did you catch the History Channel's program on "Blizzards?"... It was pretty interesting on NYC's take on the 1888 Plains Blizzard... It is funny to look back at history and note the "eastern arrogance." Just 2 months later that year NYC would eat their words. Part of my sig is from 10,000 Maniacs, Gold Rush Brides: follow the typical signs, the hand-painted lines, down prairie roads. pass the lone church spire. pass the talking wire from where to who knows? there's no way to divide the beauty of the sky from the wild western plains. where a man could drift, in legendary myth, by roaming over spaces. the land was free and the price was right. Dakota on the wall is a white-robed woman, broad yet maidenly. such power in her hand as she hails the wagon man's family. I see indians that crawl through this mural that recalls our history. who were the homestead wives? who were the gold rush brides? does anybody know? do their works survive their yellow fever lives in the pages they wrote? the land was free, yet it cost their lives. in miner's lust for gold. a family's house was bought and sold, piece-by-piece. a widow staked her claim on a dollar and his name, so painfully. in letters mailed back home her eastern sisters they would moan as they would read accounts of madness, childbirth, loneliness and grief. 564670[/snapback] well i find NYC people much more snobby and arrogant than New England's... a little like the parisians in France... but i don't rank Paris as french or NYC as american, those two towns are in their own special world. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 well i find NYC people much more snobby and arrogant than New England's... a little like the parisians in France... but i don't rank Paris as french or NYC as american, those two towns are in their own special world. 564708[/snapback] You are gonna catch flak for this Olivier! IMO, NE lacks the "warmth" of people that other regions in America enjoy. I think the northeast gets a lot of slack because of the "yankee rat-race" that is preceived to exist there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RuntheDamnBall Posted January 13, 2006 Share Posted January 13, 2006 well i find NYC people much more snobby and arrogant than New England's... a little like the parisians in France... but i don't rank Paris as french or NYC as american, those two towns are in their own special world. 564708[/snapback] Hint: If you don't like being generalized, don't do it yourself. I imagine you probably have visited a little of Manhattan and not much of Brooklyn, Queens or the Bronx, also parts of NYC. They're pretty working-class, by comparison. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olivier in france Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 Hint: If you don't like being generalized, don't do it yourself. I imagine you probably have visited a little of Manhattan and not much of Brooklyn, Queens or the Bronx, also parts of NYC. They're pretty working-class, by comparison. 564858[/snapback] yes i know... and i did not want to generalize the very diverse population of the NYC metro area . What i meant is that the way of life in NYC is not very "american" compared with the rest of the country. In fact New York has its own issues, own problems, a lot of New Yorkers don't often leave the town and don't know much about what is life outside the city limits and a big part of the US people do not really imagine what life really is for a New yorker. and the same can be said for parisians and the rest of France. i've lived in Paris for 3 years and i could not imagine before , being from a small town, how it could be even if i had lived in big towns (Lyon, Barcelona, SF...) . New York, Paris are more than big towns, they are their own universe in some points, i think that it must be true for most towns reaching the 8-9 millions limit , it gets so difficult to go out of it, there is so much to do inside of it that you 're a like a prisoner that do not even know there is an "outside". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ExiledInIllinois Posted January 14, 2006 Share Posted January 14, 2006 yes i know... and i did not want to generalize the very diverse population of the NYC metro area . What i meant is that the way of life in NYC is not very "american" compared with the rest of the country. In fact New York has its own issues, own problems, a lot of New Yorkers don't often leave the town and don't know much about what is life outside the city limits and a big part of the US people do not really imagine what life really is for a New yorker. and the same can be said for parisians and the rest of France. i've lived in Paris for 3 years and i could not imagine before , being from a small town, how it could be even if i had lived in big towns (Lyon, Barcelona, SF...) . New York, Paris are more than big towns, they are their own universe in some points, i think that it must be true for most towns reaching the 8-9 millions limit , it gets so difficult to go out of it, there is so much to do inside of it that you 're a like a prisoner that do not even know there is an "outside". 566561[/snapback] I have a brother-in-law from Boston that fits this profile to a tee. NE as a "region" fits what you say. When he comes to Buffalo, you'd think he was heading up river into the "heart of darkness." He traveled to the "other" coast (Seattle) one time and he almost went into "DT's." Seems he doesn't mind Chicago though. Sorry to denegrate the conversation to generalizations... I guess it happens everywhere. But, there is a northeast elitism that seems to be preceived by the rest of the country. With the Bush family for example, GWB distance from this has payed dividends politically for him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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