Kelly the Dog Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 i think you're partly right, but as it so happens i paid exceptionally close attention to college ball and the draft that year and the word at least in the LA media as i recall it was that there were questions about his attitude, football intelligence, and the quote-unquote fire in his belly. the local LA papers and many other places had him going anywhere from late 1st (the most common slotting) to late second. everyone knew he had a killer arm and good athletic skills. 526827[/snapback] I recall that, too, as a Pac 10 fan and living in LA. They just knew he didn't have the intangibles. And it was proven. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Risin Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 "fire in his belly" It's easier. Saves keystrokes I'm just sayin... 526830[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 sometimes i just have to step back and remind myself, "this is deep RJ territory." it's a dark, dark place, man. 526831[/snapback] na you should just know I'm the one that created the famed Flutie Haters web site Yet again all things being equal I stand by the thoughts I had about Rob never getting the chance to develop on the NFL field is what ultimately cost him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 I don't know where you are going here... but if you are trying to imply RJ was better than Flutie based on these two "facts," it is quite laughable. Moreover, if you are trying to imply that Flutie and RJ were even in the same class... you get the idea 526626[/snapback] They were in the same class, they both sucked. There's a reason neither got a starting gig once they left the Bills. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Dean Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 They were in the same class, they both sucked. There's a reason neither got a starting gig once they left the Bills. 526838[/snapback] Bingo (and Bingo was his name-o). Time for this one to go home... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 Bingo (and Bingo was his name-o). Time for this one to go home... 526840[/snapback] this probably should go home, but i do have to add that flutie definitively did not suck for the bills. 47 tds, 30 ints, and an over-7.0 ypa is pretty damn good. plus there is the 21-8 (i'm including just give it to 'em as a victory) record thing (not all his doing, i know) ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 It's always a guy that has a lot of talent but there are off the field or injury or personality issues that makes some GMs stay away from him and then it begins a snowball effect. I don't recall too many players that had no issues that this happened to, although I assume it has happened. 526829[/snapback] Right...And in a QB's case if enough Teams remove you from their Draft Board, and few more Teams move you way down, only a couple Teams are left with QB Needs...Those Teams take other QB's and a guy like RJ slides all the way to the 4th Round... RJ was the 1st Player taken on Day 2, which is usually an indicator he slid a little farther than expected...And regardless of how his career fell apart, there were QB's taken ahead of him that did almost nothing in the NFL...At least RJ Started Playoff Game... Anyway...Obviously something kept quite a few Teams away from RJ... But like a previous post mentioned had he gone to Buffalo instead of Collins it's pretty easy to make the argument that based on the way they developed, RJ was a better value overall...Then again so was Kordell Stewart, but I digress... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MDH Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 this probably should go home, but i do have to add that flutie definitively did not suck for the bills. 47 tds, 30 ints, and an over-7.0 ypa is pretty damn good. plus there is the 21-8 (i'm including just give it to 'em as a victory) record thing (not all his doing, i know) ... 526848[/snapback] Yeah, all those teams lined up to give this fine player a starting job once he was released by the Bills. Btw, don't use stats, because according to the stats RJ was a better QB. Hell, according to the stats RJ was a good QB. I watched the games. I watched the Bills offense average 14 points per game with Flutie at the helm. I watched the D hold teams to less than that many times. You can credit Flutie for those wins if you want, personally, I'll give the nod to the D. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 Right...And in a QB's case if enough Teams remove you from their Draft Board, and few more Teams move you way down, only a couple Teams are left with QB Needs...Those Teams take other QB's and a guy like RJ slides all the way to the 4th Round... RJ was the 1st Player taken on Day 2, which is usually an indicator he slid a little farther than expected...And regardless of how his career fell apart, there were QB's taken ahead of him that did almost nothing in the NFL...At least RJ Started Playoff Game... Anyway...Obviously something kept quite a few Teams away from RJ... But like a previous post mentioned had he gone to Buffalo instead of Collins it's pretty easy to make the argument that based on the way they developed, RJ was a better value overall...Then again so was Kordell Stewart, but I digress... 526862[/snapback] AVP was better value than todd c.! plus he's a pretty good color guy. my favorite thing about collins -- he might go 10 years with the chiefs without ever throwing a remotely significant pass. that's amazing. remember, he's a vested vet now making something approaching 1 million a year. that goes a long way in KC (and in Buffalo). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 Yeah, all those teams lined up to give this fine player a starting job once he was released by the Bills. Btw, don't use stats, because according to the stats RJ was a better QB. Hell, according to the stats RJ was a good QB. I watched the games. I watched the Bills offense average 14 points per game with Flutie at the helm. I watched the D hold teams to less than that many times. You can credit Flutie for those wins if you want, personally, I'll give the nod to the D. 526863[/snapback] you can make that argument re 99, but there is no way you can make that re 98 or 2000. he was damn good in 98, and in the games he subbed in 2000, he was 4-2 and racked up great stats. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KOKBILLS Posted December 10, 2005 Share Posted December 10, 2005 my favorite thing about collins -- he might go 10 years with the chiefs without ever throwing a remotely significant pass. that's amazing. remember, he's a vested vet now making something approaching 1 million a year. that goes a long way in KC (and in Buffalo). 526867[/snapback] Too true...Some are just blessed... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dawgg Posted December 10, 2005 Author Share Posted December 10, 2005 HE WAS 39 FOR CRYING OUT LOUD!!! Of course teams aren't going to give him a starting gig. No 39 year old gets a starting gig. That doesn't mean he wasn't good in Buffalo, though. Yeah, all those teams lined up to give this fine player a starting job once he was released by the Bills. Btw, don't use stats, because according to the stats RJ was a better QB. Hell, according to the stats RJ was a good QB. I watched the games. I watched the Bills offense average 14 points per game with Flutie at the helm. I watched the D hold teams to less than that many times. You can credit Flutie for those wins if you want, personally, I'll give the nod to the D. 526863[/snapback] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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