stuckincincy Posted December 7, 2005 Share Posted December 7, 2005 December 8, 1941 President Roosevelt: "To the Congress of the United States: Yesterday, Dec. 7, 1941 - a date which will live in infamy - the United States of America was suddenly and deliberately attacked by naval and air forces of the Empire of Japan. The United States was at peace with that nation and, at the solicitation of Japan, was still in conversation with the government and its emperor looking toward the maintenance of peace in the Pacific. Indeed, one hour after Japanese air squadrons had commenced bombing in Oahu, the Japanese ambassador to the United States and his colleagues delivered to the Secretary of State a formal reply to a recent American message. While this reply stated that it seemed useless to continue the existing diplomatic negotiations, it contained no threat or hint of war or armed attack. It will be recorded that the distance of Hawaii from Japan makes it obvious that the attack was deliberately planned many days or even weeks ago. During the intervening time, the Japanese government has deliberately sought to deceive the United States by false statements and expressions of hope for continued peace. The attack yesterday on the Hawaiian islands has caused severe damage to American naval and military forces. Very many American lives have been lost. In addition, American ships have been reported torpedoed on the high seas between San Francisco and Honolulu. Yesterday, the Japanese government also launched an attack against Malaya. Last night, Japanese forces attacked Hong Kong. Last night, Japanese forces attacked Guam. Last night, Japanese forces attacked the Philippine Islands. Last night, the Japanese attacked Wake Island. This morning, the Japanese attacked Midway Island. Japan has, therefore, undertaken a surprise offensive extending throughout the Pacific area. The facts of yesterday speak for themselves. The people of the United States have already formed their opinions and well understand the implications to the very life and safety of our nation. As commander in chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense. Always will we remember the character of the onslaught against us. No matter how long it may take us to overcome this premeditated invasion, the American people in their righteous might will win through to absolute victory. I believe I interpret the will of the Congress and of the people when I assert that we will not only defend ourselves to the uttermost, but will make very certain that this form of treachery shall never endanger us again. Hostilities exist. There is no blinking at the fact that our people, our territory and our interests are in grave danger. With confidence in our armed forces - with the unbounding determination of our people - we will gain the inevitable triumph - so help us God. I ask that the Congress declare that since the unprovoked and dastardly attack by Japan on Sunday, Dec. 7, a state of war has existed between the United States and the Japanese empire." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of BiB Posted December 7, 2005 Share Posted December 7, 2005 If one gets the opportunity for a Hawaii trip, they should stand over the Arizona, and reflect a few moments. It is an experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted December 7, 2005 Author Share Posted December 7, 2005 If one gets the opportunity for a Hawaii trip, they should stand over the Arizona, and reflect a few moments. It is an experience. 523514[/snapback] Yes. So many brave young men. And Roosevelt's words have contemporary application... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mickey Posted December 7, 2005 Share Posted December 7, 2005 Yes. So many brave young men. And Roosevelt's words have contemporary application... 523571[/snapback] I think you could substitute "AQ" for "Japan" but I'm not sure it works as well by substituting "Iraq". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 7, 2005 Share Posted December 7, 2005 Yes. So many brave young men. And Roosevelt's words have contemporary application... 523571[/snapback] Yeah I see the contemporary application: As commander in chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense. Instead of invading Japan, I'm directing an immediate invasion of Mexico, which had nothing to do with the attack, but there are bad people there who would develop weapons to use against us somewhere down the line. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wacka Posted December 7, 2005 Share Posted December 7, 2005 Yeah I see the contemporary application:As commander in chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense. Instead of invading Japan, I'm directing an immediate invasion of Mexico, which had nothing to do with the attack, but there are bad people there who would develop weapons to use against us somewhere down the line. 524006[/snapback] There you go again Tenny, swimming in the sewer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stuckincincy Posted December 7, 2005 Author Share Posted December 7, 2005 Yeah I see the contemporary application:As commander in chief of the Army and Navy, I have directed that all measures be taken for our defense. Instead of invading Japan, I'm directing an immediate invasion of Mexico, which had nothing to do with the attack, but there are bad people there who would develop weapons to use against us somewhere down the line. 524006[/snapback] So said President Clinton, an unimpeachable source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromagnum Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 I have read some books on world war 2, and one them was the battan death march... The japanese were a brutal military at that time.... As for todays war with A.Q. in afghanistan, to the bitter end..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 There you go again Tenny, swimming in the sewer. 524074[/snapback] Yeah..next thing I do wil be lie about wmd's and needlessly kill more than 3,000 GI's and 20 some thousand casualties before we bug out of some middle eastern country. Now THAT would be swimming in a sewer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Yeah..next thing I do wil be lie about wmd's and needlessly kill more than 3,000 GI's and 20 some thousand casualties before we bug out of some middle eastern country. Now THAT would be swimming in a sewer. 524848[/snapback] No Tenny it was more like declaring war on Germany after the Japanese attacked us. But don't let facts get in your way again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Yeah..next thing I do wil be lie about wmd's and needlessly kill more than 3,000 GI's and 20 some thousand casualties before we bug out of some middle eastern country. Now THAT would be swimming in a sewer. 524848[/snapback] 3000? Did the Iraqis suddenly kill 900 soilders overnight? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 3000? Did the Iraqis suddenly kill 900 soilders overnight? 524881[/snapback] No that's VAbills math. I ignored that stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 3000? Did the Iraqis suddenly kill 900 soilders overnight? 524881[/snapback] Nah..I just projected conservatively the number dying before Bush finally bugs out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 No Tenny it was more like declaring war on Germany after the Japanese attacked us. But don't let facts get in your way again. 524870[/snapback] Fact is we declared war on Germany after Germany declared war on us. Fact is also that Germany had a treaty with Japan (the Real Axis of Evil), and I don't believe Al Qaeda had any kind of treaty with Saddam. Truth be told I don't believe they even liked each other all that much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Fact is we declared war on Germany after Germany declared war on us. Fact is also that Germany had a treaty with Japan (the Real Axis of Evil), and I don't believe Al Qaeda had any kind of treaty with Saddam. Truth be told I don't believe they even liked each other all that much. 524895[/snapback] And Iraq has had an ongoing declaration of war against us. What the !@#$ is the difference? And yes Al Qeada did have arrangments for training purposes in Iraq, just because of their common enemy. Very similar to the Axis agreements. Again facts suck. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Nah..I just projected conservatively the number dying before Bush finally bugs out. 524886[/snapback] Ah...you made it up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 And Iraq has had an ongoing declaration of war against us. What the !@#$ is the difference? And yes Al Qeada did have arrangments for training purposes in Iraq, just because of their common enemy. Very similar to the Axis agreements. Again facts suck. 524901[/snapback] Va...the assertion was that we declared war on Germany after the Japanese attacked us. We didn't. Germany declared war against us. That is an empirical fact. Al Qaeda did not have a treaty with Iraq in which there was an agreeement that Iraq would declare war on us if a war should break out between us and Iraq. I agree with you, my friend, that facts in general may suck. Relevant facts can, however, be useful and sometimes dispositive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Va...the assertion was that we declared war on Germany after the Japanese attacked us. We didn't. Germany declared war against us. That is an empirical fact. Al Qaeda did not have a treaty with Iraq in which there was an agreeement that Iraq would declare war on us if a war should break out between us and Iraq. I agree with you, my friend, that facts in general may suck. Relevant facts can, however, be useful and sometimes dispositive. 524915[/snapback] Shouls read "if war should break out between us and AQ." I suspect if such a treaty had been made it would have also had an agreement as originally stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VABills Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Va...the assertion was that we declared war on Germany after the Japanese attacked us. We didn't. Germany declared war against us. That is an empirical fact. Al Qaeda did not have a treaty with Iraq in which there was an agreeement that Iraq would declare war on us if a war should break out between us and Iraq. I agree with you, my friend, that facts in general may suck. Relevant facts can, however, be useful and sometimes dispositive. 524915[/snapback] Iraq didn't need to declare war. They had a standing declaration of war for years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tennesseeboy Posted December 8, 2005 Share Posted December 8, 2005 Iraq didn't need to declare war. They had a standing declaration of war for years. 524927[/snapback] I don't know if that is true or not...but it is certainly irrelevant to the argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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