Tolstoy Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 I, too, am frustrated by the embarassment that was Sunday's game. Every time we think this team might be on track towards respectability, they do a nosedive. Let's do a diagnosis. Why have the Bills done so badly? (1) Injuries to key players: Losman lost a year of development last year; Parrish and Everett this year, and of course, TKO on defense. Good teams need their high draft picks to produce, but many of our picks have not had an adequate chance to do so because of delayed development. Other injuries, especially on the O-line, don't help, but good teams need to overcome these game -to-game type injuries. My Point: you cannot reasonably blame anyone for this factor. Our offense has not developed as it should have if injuries didn't happen. (2) Some talent has not played to its potential. Mike Williams, Benny Anderson, and JP Losman (if you think he has had an adequate chance) come to mind. I don't know about you, but I do not blame TD for Mike Williams. MW had everything coming out of college, and there is simply no way to predict how a player will develop over time. They are not machines, but humans, who often fail. It is far too early to call Losman a bust. Benny Anderson, however, I do blame TD for. Anderson has played enough in the league that we ought to have seen his failings. My point: as far as talent evaluation is concerned, I think TD has made enough good signings that we can overlook the mistake with Anderson. MW is the only one to blame for MW. (3) Bad rushing defense: I think we miss Pat Williams more than we thought we would. Defense used to be our strength. It is now our weakness. The TKO loss hurts, but the Bills were having trouble stopping the run before they lost TKO. Those of you calling for Jerry Gray's head should take a deep breath. This team has been a top 3 defense for several years now. Give Gray a chance. Perhaps Donahoe can be blamed for letting PW go, but perhaps PW wasn't worth the money he was asking for, at his age. So, this one is a tough call. My point: I think it is too facile to blame Gray or Donahoe for the way the D has played this year. They may be contributing factors, but injuries, a free agent loss, and perhaps aging veterans are greater factors. Bottom line: We need some infusion of talent on the O-line, and D-line, and time for our young players to develop. Until then, the last thing we need is an overhaul of management and coaching, so that we have to start from square one.
Boatdrinks Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Sorry, but that sounds like an apology for TD's miscues. What team DOESN'T have injuries or free agent defections? That is the GM's job I'm afraid, to minimize damage of injuries and free agency through smart drafting and calculated business decisions on contracts. Fans know very well that the draft is an inexact science at best, but that's why TD gets the bucks- to be right more often than not. Otherwise, why not have Joe Fan as GM? The Bills right now are lying in a bed made by Tom Donahoe. Our drafting of "big men" OL, DT, DE that win or lose games in the trenches has been woefully deficient under ol' whitey. Our starting OL is now comprised of ZERO Bills draft picks. You'd be hard pressed to find a winning team in the league today that has such a dubious distinction. We haven't had a Bills drafted DL or LB in the pro bowl in years. TD has done fairly well drafting DB's and fair at wideout. Those positions usually do not dominate games, however. Even a casual fan watching the Bills can see us getting beaten down at the point of attack consistently. Do we even have a player w/ a multi sack game on the road this year? Or a road interception even? The road is where the truth of your football team comes out, because there is no crowd noise or extra adrenaline to provide an advantage. Even good teams are .500 or only slightly above in the free agent era, but the Bills are hard pressed to even compete in road games, much less win them. So the Bills are exactly as TD has built them. The walls are crumbling, the foundation cracked, the roof is leaking. The structure ought to be condemned. TD should have known Phat Pat had no replacement on the roster, instead of haggling over a couple hundred G's. Should have seen the pass rush ability of Dwight Freeney or the dominating play of Richard Seymour as more intriguing than Mike Williams and gone with that instinct. TD has run out of chances, we'll see if Uncle Ralph runs him out of town.
kasper13 Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Come on now Mr. Donahoe, stop being a wuss and use your real name when you post. Injuries? Spikes is the only injury on defense. Stop making excuses.
RuntheDamnBall Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Come on now Mr. Donahoe, stop being a wuss and use your real name when you post. Injuries? Spikes is the only injury on defense. Stop making excuses. 509797[/snapback] Right, the only injury to the defense, besides Ron Edwards, London Fletcher, Terrence McGee, Kevin Thomas, and Lawyer Milloy. Besides those, he's the only guy who's been hurt.
IBTG81 Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Right, the only injury to the defense, besides Ron Edwards, London Fletcher, Terrence McGee, Kevin Thomas, and Lawyer Milloy. Besides those, he's the only guy who's been hurt. 509803[/snapback] Ron Edwards? Ummm, last time I checked, he SUCKS. Fletcher missed what? 2 quarters? If you have to count on Kevin Thomas, we're in trouble. How much time has Milloy missed? The only thing Milloy misses is the RB running right past his slow ass.
RuntheDamnBall Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Ron Edwards? Ummm, last time I checked, he SUCKS. Fletcher missed what? 2 quarters? If you have to count on Kevin Thomas, we're in trouble. How much time has Milloy missed? The only thing Milloy misses is the RB running right past his slow ass. 509806[/snapback] Last time I checked, Edwards was a little better than Bannan or Anderson. But whatever. The time Fletcher, Milloy and McGee has missed takes nothing away from the fact that they're playing hurt and that compromises the defense. Way to ignore McGee's injury, also. My point was, others on the defense have been hurt.
Buftex Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 I, too, am frustrated by the embarassment that was Sunday's game. Every time we think this team might be on track towards respectability, they do a nosedive. Let's do a diagnosis. Why have the Bills done so badly? Good teams need their high draft picks to produce, but many of our picks have not had an adequate chance to do so because of delayed development. 509742[/snapback] Is it safe to assume, doctor, that good GM's will then use early draft picks on needs rather than taking a first round flyer on a RB that was injured, a QB that only a few teams coveted as much as our GM, and a diminutive WR that did not fill any pressing need? Nothing against JP, Willis, or Parrish, but I am just playing along. If we were going into this season expecting Parrish and Everett to be major contributers, we were sunk from day one.....
Johnny Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Is it safe to assume, doctor, that good GM's will then use early draft picks on needs rather than taking a first round flyer on a RB that was injured, a QB that only a few teams coveted as much as our GM, and a diminutive WR that did not fill any pressing need? Nothing against JP, Willis, or Parrish, but I am just playing along. If we were going into this season expecting Parrish and Everett to be major contributers, we were sunk from day one..... 509850[/snapback] c'mon buftex he said no noodleheads
Buftex Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 c'mon buftex he said no noodleheads 509851[/snapback] Hey, I thought you were leaving!
Johnny Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Hey, I thought you were leaving! 509856[/snapback] [/quote
Formerly Allan in MD Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 What continually puzzles me is the fact that at Pittsburgh, TD, year after year, had significant losses of key players thru free agency but was always able to come up with outstanding replacements in the draft or elsewhere. Yet, with the Bills, the players he brings in are, with a few exceptions, a pretty mediocre lot. Where has the magic gone? Was TD merely lucky, or did he have a coaching staff that far outdistances the Bills' in its ability to develop players?
apuszczalowski Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Milloy, Fletcher and McGee may not have missed much time, but they are not playing at 100% right now. Neither is Parrish or Mike Williams. It would be like putting MaGahee in right after drafting him and calling him a bust. I've liked some of the more riskier picks that have been made like MaGahee, and will agree that there have been a ton of bad picks too. Just because a player was great playing in college or gets drafted in a high position, doesn't anything in the nfl. Drafts are like gambling, nothing is a sure thing. Players get hurt, they don't always stay out til they are 100%, they come back usually once they feel good enough to play again even if it means they're play is not as good as before.
alg Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Thanks Tolstoy, for writing a reasonable post. I'm glad to know I am not the only one who cringes at the histrionics on this board.
bills_fan Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 We need some infusion of talent on the O-line, and D-line, and time for our young players to develop. Fuggin TD doesn't think so....right from the his mouth!! Kyle Shrader (Orlando, FL): When can we admit, as an organization, that both lines have been insufficiently addressed in regard to personnel, and that the personnel we do have does not fit with our "schemes?" Tom Donahoe: As a personnel staff, we do not feel that our lines have been insufficiently addressed. We have addressed the offensive and defensive lines both in free agency and the draft. Our biggest concern with the play of our lines has been inconsistency. At times this year, the line play has been very good and at other times it has been lacking. We have to continue to find a way to play more consistently on both sides of the ball. It makes TD sound like the Iraqi information minister...the guy who claimed there were no American troops in Iraq, when we held Bagdhad airport...
Kipers Hair Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 I, too, am frustrated by the embarassment that was Sunday's game. Every time we think this team might be on track towards respectability, they do a nosedive. Let's do a diagnosis. Why have the Bills done so badly? (1) Injuries to key players: Losman lost a year of development last year; Parrish and Everett this year, and of course, TKO on defense. Good teams need their high draft picks to produce, but many of our picks have not had an adequate chance to do so because of delayed development. Other injuries, especially on the O-line, don't help, but good teams need to overcome these game -to-game type injuries. My Point: you cannot reasonably blame anyone for this factor. Our offense has not developed as it should have if injuries didn't happen. (2) Some talent has not played to its potential. Mike Williams, Benny Anderson, and JP Losman (if you think he has had an adequate chance) come to mind. I don't know about you, but I do not blame TD for Mike Williams. MW had everything coming out of college, and there is simply no way to predict how a player will develop over time. They are not machines, but humans, who often fail. It is far too early to call Losman a bust. Benny Anderson, however, I do blame TD for. Anderson has played enough in the league that we ought to have seen his failings. My point: as far as talent evaluation is concerned, I think TD has made enough good signings that we can overlook the mistake with Anderson. MW is the only one to blame for MW. (3) Bad rushing defense: I think we miss Pat Williams more than we thought we would. Defense used to be our strength. It is now our weakness. The TKO loss hurts, but the Bills were having trouble stopping the run before they lost TKO. Those of you calling for Jerry Gray's head should take a deep breath. This team has been a top 3 defense for several years now. Give Gray a chance. Perhaps Donahoe can be blamed for letting PW go, but perhaps PW wasn't worth the money he was asking for, at his age. So, this one is a tough call. My point: I think it is too facile to blame Gray or Donahoe for the way the D has played this year. They may be contributing factors, but injuries, a free agent loss, and perhaps aging veterans are greater factors. Bottom line: We need some infusion of talent on the O-line, and D-line, and time for our young players to develop. Until then, the last thing we need is an overhaul of management and coaching, so that we have to start from square one. 509742[/snapback] Donohoe...is that you? Please - this team is an embarrassment to the city and league. I seriously bet that players such as Spikes, Moulds, Voncent and Milloy regret coming or staying here...
PJBrown Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Perhaps it is time that we realize the PLAYERS are under-achieving. Everyone has pointed the finger at the front office but there is enough talent on this roster to be competitive. We have seen it at times. I think the players have let everyone down.
Realist Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 Perhaps it is time that we realize the PLAYERS are under-achieving. Everyone has pointed the finger at the front office but there is enough talent on this roster to be competitive. We have seen it at times. I think the players have let everyone down. 510219[/snapback] People can blame the front office all they want, but you said it, it all comes down to the players on the field. They do have talent and they should be playing a hell of a lot better than we have seen.
jester43 Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 it's sad to say, but right now the whole organization is a cluster!@#$, from the owner right down to the little kid who runs out to get the tee after kickioffs.
Tolstoy Posted November 22, 2005 Author Posted November 22, 2005 If Donahoe was an architect, and Mularkey his builder, I would agree that they should both be fired. However, we are not dealing with bricks here, but human beings. Sometimes, human beings fail, get injured, have chemsitry problems, etc. And sometimes, too (I am coming to realize), luck enters into the equation. Every great coach and GM have had bad years. You do not judge them on a few bad years. You judge them on how sensible their decisions are, and their success over the long term. We need to give TD and Mularkey a chance. Thus far, they have failed, but I think they both have good football sense, and will eventually succeed. The last thing we need to do is to start all over again, and watch others go through the same thing.
stuckincincy Posted November 22, 2005 Posted November 22, 2005 I, too, am frustrated 509742[/snapback] Don't be. To paraphrase Firesign Theater, "I Think We're All Noodleheads on This Bus"
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