nodnarb Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I look at the team Bill Polian has built. And it didn't take long on his watch for the Colts to be a real contender. Look at the team AJ Smith has built in less time than TD. Look at the team Marvin Lewis has built in two years on the job. His GM has nothing to do with it. He buys the groceries. I could go on and on, but you know what I mean. I'm tired, so tired of the mediocrity. Tired of TD's soft excuses. Tired of the same old problems, year after year. How many years now have fans screamed OFFENSIVE LINE? And TD thinks he's done enough, and we just haven't gelled yet. Always a reason. TD and his crew have hit on quite a few good players, but their overall performance is worthy of a firing. I have defended him and defended him and defended him. But I'm out of ammunition. I'd like to see him succeed in the end but I have ZERO faith. And he's 0-2 in selecting coaches. I like Mike in so many ways, but I just don't think he has the elite smarts to take a team very far. He hasn't shown anything, so how could I think otherwise? The Bills are heading for 7-9, 8-8 at best. What's the 5-year record again? What's the home record? Where is this offense ranked on average through 5 years? If only this was an all-special teams game.
BillnutinHouston Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 TD and his crew have hit on quite a few good players, but their overall performance is worthy of a firing. I have defended him and defended him and defended him. But I'm out of ammunition. I'd like to see him succeed in the end but I have ZERO faith. 508223[/snapback] Amen.
nodnarb Posted November 21, 2005 Author Posted November 21, 2005 Amen. 508253[/snapback] You watch. We'll hear the same things we always hear. We have to execute better. We haven't played to our potential. We haven't gelled yet. We haven't been consistent.
Beerstm Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I look at the team Bill Polian has built. And it didn't take long on his watch for the Colts to be a real contender. Look at the team AJ Smith has built in less time than TD. Look at the team Marvin Lewis has built in two years on the job. His GM has nothing to do with it. He buys the groceries. I could go on and on, but you know what I mean. I'm tired, so tired of the mediocrity. Tired of TD's soft excuses. Tired of the same old problems, year after year. How many years now have fans screamed OFFENSIVE LINE? And TD thinks he's done enough, and we just haven't gelled yet. Always a reason. TD and his crew have hit on quite a few good players, but their overall performance is worthy of a firing. I have defended him and defended him and defended him. But I'm out of ammunition. I'd like to see him succeed in the end but I have ZERO faith. And he's 0-2 in selecting coaches. I like Mike in so many ways, but I just don't think he has the elite smarts to take a team very far. He hasn't shown anything, so how could I think otherwise? The Bills are heading for 7-9, 8-8 at best. What's the 5-year record again? What's the home record? Where is this offense ranked on average through 5 years? If only this was an all-special teams game. 508223[/snapback] Very well said! Great post! Exactly how I feel!
Mile High Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 You watch. We'll hear the same things we always hear. We have to execute better. We haven't played to our potential. We haven't gelled yet. We haven't been consistent. 508396[/snapback] You're right. I said it once and I'll sy it again..... In football all sucessful teams are built from the inside out (ol and dl line). TD had one side right (the dl) two years ago and last year. But that fuggin ol just keeps getting ignored. Yeah the whole building from the outside in thingy isn't working.
Steven in MD Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 You're right. I said it once and I'll sy it again..... In football all sucessful teams are built from the inside out (ol and dl line). TD had one side right (the dl) two years ago and last year. But that fuggin ol just keeps getting ignored. Yeah the whole building from the outside in thingy isn't working. 508400[/snapback] If you watched the Bengals/Colts game, you see how you build a franchise. I think they are the two best teams in the AFC, and they have dominant OL and DL. In addition, they drafted wisely at the QB and WR position. They used FA to fill holes.
SDS Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I look at the team Bill Polian has built. And it didn't take long on his watch for the Colts to be a real contender. Look at the team AJ Smith has built in less time than TD. Look at the team Marvin Lewis has built in two years on the job. His GM has nothing to do with it. He buys the groceries. 508223[/snapback] Lots of problems with this post... You're smarter than this Brandon. Polian started with the Colts in friggin' 1998... They are ROUTINELY blasted for beiing soft and getting spanked in the playoffs. Maybe this year is different, we'll see. If you want to talk about the fact that they are competitive, then you need to look no further than Manning. Manning is the reason they were competitive so quickly. Unfortunately, Archie didn't have 32 kids to pass around to all the teams. How many draft picks have we gone through to address the QB position since Kelly? Maybe Losman is our man, but Peyton has a 7 year head start on him. Having a star QB in his prime is every GM's dream. As for AJ Smith. How many people are going to get credit for their success? Is it Butler? Smith? Marty? Where are they if LT turns out to be another Kajana Carter? they have put a good team together this year, but it loks a lot more like Marty's doing than the talent provided by AJ Smith as you suggest. As for the Bengals, yes they seem to be on the upswing. They did allow 40+ points at home in a crucial game today and got spanked by a wounded Steeler team a few weeks back. They aren't the model team quite yet. However, they FINALLY got their QB a couple of years ago and lo and behold they can score points... bunches of them. Just like Indy. Polian is an excellent executive, but he has had his share of ups and downs through the years too. His praises haven't always been sung every year. How many years have they been clamoring for a defense in Indy? It would be no different here. Unless we win the SB we will ALWAYS B word. ALWAYS.
nodnarb Posted November 21, 2005 Author Posted November 21, 2005 Lots of problems with this post... You're smarter than this Brandon. Polian started with the Colts in friggin' 1998... They are ROUTINELY blasted for beiing soft and getting spanked in the playoffs. Maybe this year is different, we'll see. If you want to talk about the fact that they are competitive, then you need to look no further than Manning. Manning is the reason they were competitive so quickly. Unfortunately, Archie didn't have 32 kids to pass around to all the teams. How many draft picks have we gone through to address the QB position since Kelly? Maybe Losman is our man, but Peyton has a 7 year head start on him. Having a star QB in his prime is every GM's dream. As for AJ Smith. How many people are going to get credit for their success? Is it Butler? Smith? Marty? Where are they if LT turns out to be another Kajana Carter? they have put a good team together this year, but it loks a lot more like Marty's doing than the talent provided by AJ Smith as you suggest. As for the Bengals, yes they seem to be on the upswing. They did allow 40+ points at home in a crucial game today and got spanked by a wounded Steeler team a few weeks back. They aren't the model team quite yet. However, they FINALLY got their QB a couple of years ago and lo and behold they can score points... bunches of them. Just like Indy. Polian is an excellent executive, but he has had his share of ups and downs through the years too. His praises haven't always been sung every year. How many years have they been clamoring for a defense in Indy? It would be no different here. Unless we win the SB we will ALWAYS B word. ALWAYS. 508502[/snapback] Well hey, no example is argument-proof. And I admit to occasional hyperbole. It probably would have been better if I had just compared the Bills to nobody but their own record. 5 years, still don't have an effective, consistent offensive line. The BIG ANSWER this year was...Bennie Anderson. Our best linemen are Chris Villarial and Trey Teague, and I like both those guys well enough. Gandy has been solid, particularly for his pay rate, but left guard and right tackle have been this line's dual achilles for years. We have guys who just don't seem to play with much heart. And for the second time on TD's watch, we have a coach who repeats the same thing after every loss, who has only beaten ONE good coach on the road (Holmgren) and who can't seem to find the right strategy for the games that matter most. I won't even mention his gameday coaching. TD has a knack for picking guys that just have no feel for it. I give Mike credit for looking good and being a stand-up, classy, likeable guy. I'd rather have an ugly prick who wins games.
SDS Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 Well hey, no example is argument-proof. And I admit to occasional hyperbole. It probably would have been better if I had just compared the Bills to nobody but their own record. 5 years, still don't have an effective, consistent offensive line. The BIG ANSWER this year was...Bennie Anderson. Our best linemen are Chris Villarial and Trey Teague, and I like both those guys well enough. Gandy has been solid, particularly for his pay rate, but left guard and right tackle have been this line's dual achilles for years. 508516[/snapback] Why are you stopping at 5 years for this o-line??? What was it like 6 years ago? As far as my Bills memory goes - we have been bitching about our OL since Will Wolford left - and that wasn't 2000 on my calendar. Shall we revisit what John Butler did for our line the 5 years before that? Ruben Brown... a couple of one year wonders like Robert Hicks. Our best years in the last 13 were horribly average.
nodnarb Posted November 21, 2005 Author Posted November 21, 2005 Why are you stopping at 5 years for this o-line??? What was it like 6 years ago? As far as my Bills memory goes - we have been bitching about our OL since Will Wolford left - and that wasn't 2000 on my calendar. Shall we revisit what John Butler did for our line the 5 years before that? Ruben Brown... a couple of one year wonders like Robert Hicks. Our best years in the last 13 were horribly average. 508525[/snapback] Troo, troo. I just expected a lot more from this group of football men. clutching at straws to figure out why this team plays as poorly and inconsistently as it does.
SDS Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 Troo, troo. I just expected a lot more from this group of football men. clutching at straws to figure out why this team plays as poorly and inconsistently as it does. 508552[/snapback] There are certain positions that need to be solid to be a contender and then you need to hit big on a few others. Look at our drafts in the past 10 years. Despite the Butler/TD apologists, how many BIG-TIME players did we draft in the last decade? Players that solidified their positions for more than 1 or 2 years and were/are NFL top-tier talent? Eric Moulds... Willis McGahee... Nate Clements... Anyone else? 70 players and this is our top talent? How many years did we have Kelly, Thomas, Reed, Smith, Hansen, Tasker, Pike, Talley, Bennett, Hull and company holding down key spots? We are missing badly in the drafts in getting guys that anchor our team for any length of time. Guys that dominate their positions for a multi-year window.
colin Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 i think it is simpler we aren't a super bowl team, so don't compare us to the top of the NFL. we are beginning to suck badly on D, and do suck badly on O. our special teams are very good, if not great. our special teams coach is a top guy, and was a top guy when he came here. now, the last time we had a GREAT o, it was 02 in 02 we got gilbride. gilbride is insane, but knows how to make an O produce (a la mike martz). he knows how to make a passing game run (houston, jags, buffalo, giants, he can make a big play O work well) we had bledsoe and the weapons, but a bad line and travis butter fingers. i'd say we were a bit better in 02 than in 04 in terms of personel (mcgahee and evans are top talents tho), but our QBs and Lines were about as bad the last time we had a good D was in 04, and it started in 03. leBeou came in in 03, and the D kinda rode that for 2 years we have had a drop off in talent this year in D, but we were down some guys in secondary last year and managed to show up. frankly, the answer is clear we are a bad team because we have 3rd rate coaching. everyone on our staff, except special teams, is cutting their teeth and sucking. of course, we also have a head coach who doesn't really know what he is doing either. if we had fox, or lewis, or capers, or anyone with some balls at HC, we'd have made it to the play offs last year and be doing better this year.
ajzepp Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 There are certain positions that need to be solid to be a contender and then you need to hit big on a few others. Look at our drafts in the past 10 years. Despite the Butler/TD apologists, how many BIG-TIME players did we draft in the last decade? Players that solidified their positions for more than 1 or 2 years and were/are NFL top-tier talent? Eric Moulds... Willis McGahee... Nate Clements... Anyone else? 70 players and this is our top talent? How many years did we have Kelly, Thomas, Reed, Smith, Hansen, Tasker, Pike, Talley, Bennett, Hull and company holding down key spots? We are missing badly in the drafts in getting guys that anchor our team for any length of time. Guys that dominate their positions for a multi-year window. 508557[/snapback] Don't you think that free agency wreaks havoc with that though? There are only so many positions you can lock up for a long period of time nowadays.....you have to be able to consistently replenish your roster around those few key players.
Mikie2times Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I'm an advocate of cohesiveness to your team, and I certainly think a long tenured GM fits into that picture, but when is a spade a spade? We keep losing, we keep showing no progress, and against good teams we have been coming up short since TD came here. Everybody tries to find a reason for it, maybe, just maybe, we don't have the right talent at the right positions. Against teams with a .500 or better record including TD's first year H- 6-15 A- 4-18 Against teams with a .500 or better record not including TD's first year H- 6-10 A- 3-15 Coaching plays a role in this of course, but then again TD is responsible for bringing in the coach also. We just didn't have a fighting chance today, and as this clearly indicates against good teams we rarely do. As a fan I'm not bitching because we can't make the big one, I just want progress, and hope, and the feeling that every Sunday we at least have a chance. It just hasn't been like that for awhile, and I certainly don't blame anybody for turning to the man in charge of assembling this team when trying to find the reason for all of it.
SDS Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 Don't you think that free agency wreaks havoc with that though? There are only so many positions you can lock up for a long period of time nowadays.....you have to be able to consistently replenish your roster around those few key players. 508569[/snapback] That is my point - we don't have really ANY of those players for 4-7 years. We aren't losing top draft choces to FA... Maybe Clements this year. Who else? Who is signing that rich money after their contract is up? Jonas Jennnings? 70 picks and barely a handful of top-tier talent.
ajzepp Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I'm an advocate of cohesiveness to your team, and I certainly think a long tenured GM fits into that picture, but when is a spade a spade? We keep losing, we keep showing no progress, and against good teams we have been coming up short since TD came here. Everybody tries to find a reason for it, maybe, just maybe, we don't have the right talent at the right positions. Against teams with a .500 record including TD's first year H- 6-15 A- 4-18 Against teams with a .500 record not including TD's first year H- 6-10 A- 3-15 Coaching plays a role in this of course, but then again TD is responsible for bringing in the coach also. We just didn't have a fighting chance today, and as this clearly indicates against good teams we rarely do. As a fan I'm not bitching because we can't make the big one, I just want progress, and hope, and the feeling that every Sunday we at least have a chance. It just hasn't been like that for awhile, and I certainly don't blame anybody for turning to the man in charge of assembling this team when trying to find the reason for all of it. 508575[/snapback] Do you guys really think that TD is clueless? Do you really think he's just totally unaware of what's wrong with the team, and that we suck? You guys make it sound like he's just up there partying with Modrak, completely indifferent to what is going on. Believe it or not, we don't know more than TD does. Being that it's his team, I'm pretty sure that he's just as pissed off, if not more so, than the rest of us. I'm sure that he's immensely frustrated with the way certain people are performing, and I would bet my ass that he's going to do whatever he can to continue trying to get it right.
Rico Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 I give Mike credit for looking good and being a stand-up, classy, likeable guy. I'd rather have an ugly prick who wins games. 508516[/snapback] Amen, I've finally seen enough. Either get MM a heart transplant or get a real HC in here.
nodnarb Posted November 21, 2005 Author Posted November 21, 2005 That is my point - we don't have really ANY of those players for 4-7 years. We aren't losing top draft choces to FA... Maybe Clements this year. Who else? Who is signing that rich money after their contract is up? Jonas Jennnings? 70 picks and barely a handful of top-tier talent. 508577[/snapback] I think we have enough good players to make the playoffs and win a game or two. We have good LBs, CBs, and pretty good safeties...although they don't hit for schit. Good DEs, mediocre DTs. Mediocre line, very good WRs, although I don't want to see Josh Reed continue to drop balls and get that stupid look on his face. Bench 'em. I'd rather see J. SMith out there. Anyway, my point is that I belive the problem is coaching. I just don't think Jerry Gray is as good as billed. I don't believe it. And I don't think we have coaches with the elite smarts that it takes to get the job done. They're good enough to win one, lose two, win two, lose three, win one, lose one, win one, lose three, etc. Last year's run consisted of two tough wins and three marshmallow teams with a fired coach. It was a mirage. I'm going empirical on the Bills. Screw "belief". I'll doubt these guys until they prove otherwise. In the meantime, maybe the Sabres can do something.
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 Real GMs who didn't spend their off-time zoned out at ESPN looking for emails.
beerme1 Posted November 21, 2005 Posted November 21, 2005 Do you guys really think that TD is clueless? Do you really think he's just totally unaware of what's wrong with the team, and that we suck? I'm sure that he's immensely frustrated with the way certain people are performing, and I would bet my ass that he's going to do whatever he can to continue trying to get it right. 508578[/snapback] Really? I don't think he is as concerned as you think he is. Remember he is embarrased to be a part of this community!!! Oh, and he got a 5 year deal didn't he? Oh and he gave a guy who never has been a head coach a 5 year deal didn't he? Enough of the TD worship already! Including Ralph, what a joke
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