John from Riverside Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 He through some balls low or into the ground.....I attribute that to lack of reps with the starting unit.... One thing Kelly WAS doing that I was impressed with was his ability to see the whole field and his accuracy in getting balls out in front of receivers.... The Lee Evans catch was on....there was also another one where he put it out there were Mould could reach for it and run in stride........ JPL wouldn't make those throws right now.......it is as simple as that.... In the second half I dont know what happened....it seemed like Miami changed up its defensive scheme to get pressure and we never adjusted......I dont blame Holcomb for that..... There was a time when most of us would say a 20 point effort by our offense would have been a sure win.........
Kelly the Dog Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 There were several short passes by KH that were excellent throws. I think that was expected of him. he also dumped the ball off a few times pretty quickly and effectively. I also give him a lot of credit for several of those Dolphin defensive offsides penalties as his cadence and hard counts seemed to be messing with them a lot. He did what he needed to do but he also made some very big mistakes and looked rather slow to me and didnt throw the ball down the field. It was a win though.
inkman Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 There were several short passes by KH that were excellent throws. I think that was expected of him. he also dumped the ball off a few times pretty quickly and effectively. I also give him a lot of credit for several of those Dolphin defensive offsides penalties as his cadence and hard counts seemed to be messing with them a lot. He did what he needed to do but he also made some very big mistakes and looked rather slow to me and didnt throw the ball down the field. It was a win though. 472222[/snapback] He still looked like an NFL caliber QB, something that can't be said about JP at this point.
Spun Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 He through some balls low or into the ground.....I attribute that to lack of reps with the starting unit.... One thing Kelly WAS doing that I was impressed with was his ability to see the whole field and his accuracy in getting balls out in front of receivers.... The Lee Evans catch was on....there was also another one where he put it out there were Mould could reach for it and run in stride........ JPL wouldn't make those throws right now.......it is as simple as that.... In the second half I dont know what happened....it seemed like Miami changed up its defensive scheme to get pressure and we never adjusted......I dont blame Holcomb for that..... There was a time when most of us would say a 20 point effort by our offense would have been a sure win......... 472213[/snapback] Good post. Miami did adjust with a full steam ahead pass rush and the line couldn't handle it. Another thing that Holcomb did that I liked was his scrambling... He lost 32 yards in sacks which statistically disguises his escapes. But he showed an ability to move. I may have this wrong but the Bills sacked Frerotte twice, didn't these sacks come on the last two plays from scrimmage?
Peter Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 Because of his experience, he was much more comfortable at the line of scrimmage calling audibles and in the pocket. With any luck, JP will display the same as he gets more experience. I also would like to see what both QBs could do with better protection. Once the Dolphins decided to bring the heat, our line had some real problems. I really hope that the line can get it together once MW and CV get healthy. Otherwise, look forward to seeing 8 or more guys in the box and a short passing attack. We really have to find a way to loosen things up. Otherwise, Willis is going to get killed.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 Good post. Miami did adjust with a full steam ahead pass rush and the line couldn't handle it. Another thing that Holcomb did that I liked was his scrambling... He lost 32 yards in sacks which statistically disguises his escapes. But he showed an ability to move. I may have this wrong but the Bills sacked Frerotte twice, didn't these sacks come on the last two plays from scrimmage? 472231[/snapback] Yes, the last two desperation plays when the game was virtually over. Unless it was like the Bills against Jax. Ooops. Okay, so the game was still in question.
Dan Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 I have to admit... KH played well enough to let us win the game. However, he still showed me why he's a backup qb and not a starter somewhere. I do think the replacement had a trickle down effect on the rest of the team, because the D and the recievers definitely came out playing better. So if for nothing else, it was good for that. JP (or someone else) is definitely the future though. Give it 2 maybe 3 weeks tops and KH will look miserable in my opinion. Thanks mostly to an Oline that couldn't stop anyone for anything,
Kelly the Dog Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 I have to admit... KH played well enough to let us win the game. However, he still showed me why he's a backup qb and not a starter somewhere. I do think the replacement had a trickle down effect on the rest of the team, because the D and the recievers definitely came out playing better. So if for nothing else, it was good for that. JP (or someone else) is definitely the future though. Give it 2 maybe 3 weeks tops and KH will look miserable in my opinion. Thanks mostly to an Oline that couldn't stop anyone for anything, 472296[/snapback] During last week, when someone asked him about Losman being benched, and the musical chairs of the QB situation, Holcomb was quoted as saying something to the effect of, "Yeah, it does bother you. You're looking over your shoulder and thinking about making mistakes and maybe being pulled." Something like that. And I immediately thought to myself, "Exactly! You're so right! That's precisely what I expect to happen!" To a back-up. Now wonder he's really not a long term starter in this league. If you have the talent and the confidence and the mental toughness to play and survive in the NFL, at the hardest position in all of sports, you are not looking over your shoulder. You're looking into your self and figuring out what the next damn play is and how am I going to combat these mofo's trying to kill me so I can lead my team into the endzone and score and win this friggin abortion of a game. Rob Johnson looks over his shoulder. KH, unfortunately does, too.
finknottle Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 During last week, when someone asked him about Losman being benched, and the musical chairs of the QB situation, Holcomb was quoted as saying something to the effect of, "Yeah, it does bother you. You're looking over your shoulder and thinking about making mistakes and maybe being pulled." Something like that. And I immediately thought to myself, "Exactly! You're so right! That's precisely what I expect to happen!" To a back-up. Now wonder he's really not a long term starter in this league. If you have the talent and the confidence and the mental toughness to play and survive in the NFL, at the hardest position in all of sports, you are not looking over your shoulder. You're looking into your self and figuring out what the next damn play is and how am I going to combat these mofo's trying to kill me so I can lead my team into the endzone and score and win this friggin abortion of a game. Rob Johnson looks over his shoulder. KH, unfortunately does, too. 472321[/snapback] Sort of a chicken-and-the-egg thing, isn't it? If you've never played qb musical chairs then you don't think about it. But if you go through two years of what he had in Cleveland, then you'ld have to be a bone-head not to be aware that your job is always up in the air. I bet you cant find a single quarterback who always starts who looks over his shoulder, nor a single qb whose career has been yo-yo'd who doesn't.
Kelly the Dog Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 Sort of a chicken-and-the-egg thing, isn't it? If you've never played qb musical chairs then you don't think about it. But if you go through two years of what he had in Cleveland, then you'ld have to be a bone-head not to be aware that your job is always up in the air. I bet you cant find a single quarterback who always starts who looks over his shoulder, nor a single qb whose career has been yo-yo'd who doesn't. 472332[/snapback] I don't agree. I think the guy who eventually starts doesn't look over his shoulder. The one guy, or, like in Cleveland, the two guys, that do look over their shoulder are the career back-ups. Looking over their shoulder is the sure sign of being a back-up, not being a back-up makes you look over your shoulder, like KH was suggesting. I think if KH had the ability and the mental toughness to be a full time starter in this league, he never would have felt that, he never would have done that, he never would have said that. And that's one of the reasons we cannot count on him taking us anywhere. And why I was thrilled to get him when we did, because he's a terrific back-up and stopgap. These may not be great examples, and may not be great quarterbacks, but I don't think Jim McMahon looked over his shoulder. I don't think Jeff Hostetler looked over his shoulder. I don't think Brad Johnson or Rich Gannon did. They aren't even great or very good players but they are starters and tough. I don't think Joe Montana did when Steve Young was there, he just hated him and fought tooth and nail for his job. Surely, this is just conjecture and not 100% foolproof, and maybe even one of those guys said once that he looked over his shoulder. But overall, how a player deals with pressure is often the difference between equally talented and gifted professionals. Like putting in golf when the tournament is on the line. The best ones are able to tune that extra pressure out. The ones that let their guard down for a second and allow a little pressure to creep in are the ones that often miss the putt and lose.
John from Riverside Posted October 10, 2005 Author Posted October 10, 2005 The way they worked things with the Browns was crazy...... To be honest I liken Holcomb to Frank Riech......very smart......doesn't have a cannon.....accurate passer.......... Isn't that what we were looking for? I mean that was before we drafted the next Brett Farve (I still think JPL is going to be a very good player)
Outkast Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 How many yards did KH throw for in the second half? About 50 you say. Hell, I'll take that. That's only 25 yards less than what JP get's in a whole game.
Fan in San Diego Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 He through some balls low or into the ground.....I attribute that to lack of reps with the starting unit.... One thing Kelly WAS doing that I was impressed with was his ability to see the whole field and his accuracy in getting balls out in front of receivers.... The Lee Evans catch was on....there was also another one where he put it out there were Mould could reach for it and run in stride........ JPL wouldn't make those throws right now.......it is as simple as that.... In the second half I dont know what happened....it seemed like Miami changed up its defensive scheme to get pressure and we never adjusted......I dont blame Holcomb for that..... There was a time when most of us would say a 20 point effort by our offense would have been a sure win......... 472213[/snapback] I agree with your points. It seems Clements cant make the 2nd half adjustments to the defenses 2nd half adjustments.
meazza Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 holcomb will be starting for us till about week 12 and then we'll be mathematically out of the playoffs, but he'll give us some hope sure sucks when you think of how good we could have been
ganesh Posted October 10, 2005 Posted October 10, 2005 In the second half I dont know what happened....it seemed like Miami changed up its defensive scheme to get pressure and we never adjusted......I dont blame Holcomb for that..... 472213[/snapback] That is beautiful...JP stinks up second halfs, but Kelly Holocomb is to be not blamed.... Bottom line the play calling stunk up...both when JP and Holcomb played...
John from Riverside Posted October 11, 2005 Author Posted October 11, 2005 That is beautiful...JP stinks up second halfs, but Kelly Holocomb is to benot blamed.... Bottom line the play calling stunk up...both when JP and Holcomb played... 472426[/snapback] Except for the first game of the season I would say that JPL has been stinking up BOTH halves.....come on man lets face it..... - First throwing touchdown thrown by Holcomb - Longest completion by Holcomb with the run and catch by Evans - Higher QB rating I am not saying Holcomb is the guy.....to me he is the caretaker we were talking about LAST year but didn't have.....
Kelly the Dog Posted October 11, 2005 Posted October 11, 2005 Except for the first game of the season I would say that JPL has been stinking up BOTH halves.....come on man lets face it..... - First throwing touchdown thrown by Holcomb - Longest completion by Holcomb with the run and catch by Evans - Higher QB rating I am not saying Holcomb is the guy.....to me he is the caretaker we were talking about LAST year but didn't have..... 472444[/snapback] 1. Well, no. JP threw a TD, a one yarder. Holcomb threw a two yarder. 2. The play was a 7 yard pass, from the 50 to the 42, the defender fell down by himself, not even a broken tackle, and Evans ran for 42 yards after the catch. As opposed to the first series of JP's career and he threw a perfect 42 yard bomb to Evans which hit him in perfect stride on the run. 3. JP's QB rating was in his first game, and production, and offensive output, was similar to Holcomb's in his first.
Tcali Posted October 11, 2005 Posted October 11, 2005 I don't agree. I think the guy who eventually starts doesn't look over his shoulder. The one guy, or, like in Cleveland, the two guys, that do look over their shoulder are the career back-ups. Looking over their shoulder is the sure sign of being a back-up, not being a back-up makes you look over your shoulder, like KH was suggesting. I think if KH had the ability and the mental toughness to be a full time starter in this league, he never would have felt that, he never would have done that, he never would have said that. And that's one of the reasons we cannot count on him taking us anywhere. And why I was thrilled to get him when we did, because he's a terrific back-up and stopgap. These may not be great examples, and may not be great quarterbacks, but I don't think Jim McMahon looked over his shoulder. I don't think Jeff Hostetler looked over his shoulder. I don't think Brad Johnson or Rich Gannon did. They aren't even great or very good players but they are starters and tough. I don't think Joe Montana did when Steve Young was there, he just hated him and fought tooth and nail for his job. Surely, this is just conjecture and not 100% foolproof, and maybe even one of those guys said once that he looked over his shoulder. But overall, how a player deals with pressure is often the difference between equally talented and gifted professionals. Like putting in golf when the tournament is on the line. The best ones are able to tune that extra pressure out. The ones that let their guard down for a second and allow a little pressure to creep in are the ones that often miss the putt and lose. 472358[/snapback] Rich Gannon wasnt even a very good player....??? League MVP Rich Gannon??? led raiders to 2 staright championship games and then a superbowl in his mid to late thirties Gannon?? ohhh...ok
Kelly the Dog Posted October 11, 2005 Posted October 11, 2005 Rich Gannon wasnt even a very good player....??? League MVP Rich Gannon??? led raiders to 2 staright championship games and then a superbowl in his mid to late thirties Gannon?? ohhh...ok 472528[/snapback] Hence the word "or" between great and very good. I included a list. Some of them were not great or even very good. I would not say that Rich Gannon was a "great quarterback". I would call him a very good quarterback. You may call him great if you wish. I would call McMahon a good quarterback, as well as Hostetler.
jarthur31 Posted October 11, 2005 Posted October 11, 2005 He through some balls low or into the ground.....I attribute that to lack of reps with the starting unit.... One thing Kelly WAS doing that I was impressed with was his ability to see the whole field and his accuracy in getting balls out in front of receivers.... The Lee Evans catch was on....there was also another one where he put it out there were Mould could reach for it and run in stride........ JPL wouldn't make those throws right now.......it is as simple as that.... In the second half I dont know what happened....it seemed like Miami changed up its defensive scheme to get pressure and we never adjusted......I dont blame Holcomb for that..... There was a time when most of us would say a 20 point effort by our offense would have been a sure win......... 472213[/snapback] I wasn't surprised--it's what vets do. JP is very green and is very lost. We are playing for postseason and I hope the rook realizes that.
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