A Few Thoughts About The Game....

[Bill from NYC]

1) First, I wish to thank each and every TBDer for being so nice to us. We met up with some old friends, and had a chance to make new ones. It was great, and thanks again to all! (Cindy, JR said to remind you that I gave him the money for the shirt. )

 

2) Most of the WNY media seems to be talking about Moulds, but the primary reason (imo) that Kelly was more effective was that he was able to get the football to Evans.

 

3) As pumped as I am, we need to beat the jests in order to contend.

 

4) Kelsay looked good when it counted.

 

5) To all those who think that Gandy is an adequate LT, I urge you to watch the tape of this game. He was (again, imo) dreadful. Let's grab one of the many LTs said to be available in the 06 draft. Please.

 

6) Willis didn't have a great statistical game, but he kept the offense on the field.

 

7) Big Sam looked a little better. Maybe he is coming around?

 

8) Sorry to throw flames (NOT the intention) , but Bob DiCescare (sic) wrote a great article in the Buffalo News today about with a reference to Drew. Yes, I do wish that he was still our qb, but I AM moving on.

 

9) Once again, thanks to all at 1/5. You guys have no idea what this trip means to us. I even got Badolbilz to commit to finding us a LT in the off season. That is going to be great!

 

10) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[dave mcbride]

1) First, I wish to thank each and every TBDer for being so nice to us. We met up with some old friends, and had a chance to make new ones. It was great, and thanks again to all! (Cindy, JR said to remind you that I gave him the money for the shirt.  )

 

2) Most of the WNY media seems to be talking about Moulds, but the primary reason (imo) that Kelly was more effective was that he was able to get the football to Evans.

 

3) As pumped as I am, we need to beat the jests in order to contend.

 

4) Kelsay looked good when it counted.

 

5) To all those who think that Gandy is an adequate LT, I urge you to watch the tape of this game. He was (again, imo) dreadful. Let's grab one of the many LTs said to be available in the 06 draft. Please.

 

6) Willis didn't have a great statistical game, but he kept the offense on the field.

 

7) Big Sam looked a little better. Maybe he is coming around?

 

8) Sorry to throw flames (NOT the intention) , but Bob DiCescare (sic) wrote a great article in the Buffalo News today about with a reference to Drew. Yes, I do wish that he was still our qb, but I AM moving on. 

 

9) Once again, thanks to all at 1/5. You guys have no idea what this trip means to us. I even got Badolbilz to commit to finding us a LT in the off season. That is going to be great! 

 

10) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

472050[/snapback]

 

fwiw, gandy apparently had a really banged up elbow and was essentially playing with one good arm. you can't block a guy like taylor with one good arm. the 2 best linemen were out, though, so my guess is that he felt he had to gut it out.

[Simon]

To all those who think that Gandy is an adequate LT, I urge you to watch the tape of this game. He was (again, imo) dreadful.

I'm beginning to think that your expectations for NFL LT's are simply not in line with reality. Anybody who is not Orlando Pace or Jon Ogden sucks (and I've seen both Pace and Ogden completely abused at times). The fact of the matter is that all LT's get beat sometimes, every single one of them. And yesterday Gandy was injured and played most of the game with only one arm against the likes of Vonnie Hollliday, JTaylor and at times I think I also saw future HOF'er Kevin Carter flipped to his side. And yet I only noticed him give up a single sack (his very first of the entire year actually) and do a fair job holding ground in the rungame even though he was working with only one good arm. Yet he was dreadful? Again?!

If you want to lament the horrid play of a Bills OTackle, you need go no farther than the atrocious outing from Greg Jerman. He completely stunk it up just like he's done every time I've seen him on the field since the Bills made the mistake of bringing him in. The fact that he's on an NFL roster is shocking to me, but the fact that he is Mike Williams' primary back-up is simply horrifying.

As much as we miss Takeo, Vilarial and eventually probably even Ron Edwards, there is no other injured Bill that I am as desperate to see back on the field as I am to see Big Mike. If there's minimum risk of him further aggravating the injury, I think he's a better option on one leg at 3/4 speed than Jerman is at this point.

Cya

[ganesh]

6) Willis didn't have a great statistical game, but he kept the offense on the field.

 

 

472050[/snapback]

 

I think that was the telling stat of the day....If Losman gets that kind of

production from the RB with the play calling, he plays as good as Holocomb

with our horrible Offensive Line.

[RI Bills Fan]

I think that was the telling stat of the day....If Losman gets that kind of

production from the RB with the play calling, he plays as good as Holocomb

with our horrible Offensive Line.

472110[/snapback]

 

Not until he learns the meaning of touch and how to check down on a play. Losman is right where he needs to be, learning by watching. The one thing that KH can show him that he can't learn on the field is the effect a calm and efficient QB can have on a team's success.

[Dawgg]

I disagree to a certain extent. Jonas Jennings, when he wasn't injured, was an adequate LT. He was beaten a few times, but not nearly as often as Gandy. Gandy has been manhandled by opposing defenses and is simply not an adequate solution at the LT position. Jerman was worse, but that doesn't mean Gandy was a whole lot better.

 

TMQ said it best:

 

"During the past five drafts, the Bills have invested eight No. 1 and No. 2 picks in the glamour positions of quarterback, running back and wide receiver; against only one first- or second-round pick invested in blockers. "

 

I'm beginning to think that your expectations for NFL LT's are simply not in line with reality. Anybody who is not Orlando Pace or Jon Ogden sucks (and I've seen both Pace and Ogden completely abused at times). The fact of the matter is that all LT's get beat sometimes, every single one of them. And yesterday Gandy was injured and played most of the game with only one arm against the likes of Vonnie Hollliday, JTaylor and at times I think I also saw future HOF'er Kevin Carter flipped to his side. And yet I only noticed him give up a single sack (his very first of the entire year actually) and do a fair job holding ground in the rungame even though he was working with only one good arm. Yet he was dreadful? Again?!

If you want to lament the horrid play of a Bills OTackle, you need go no farther than the atrocious outing from Greg Jerman. He completely stunk it up just like he's done every time I've seen him on the field since the Bills made the mistake of bringing him in. The fact that he's on an NFL roster is shocking to me, but the fact that he is Mike Williams' primary back-up is simply horrifying.

As much as we miss Takeo, Vilarial and eventually probably even Ron Edwards, there is no other injured Bill that I am as desperate to see back on the field as I am to see Big Mike. If there's minimum risk of him further aggravating the injury, I think he's a better option on one leg at 3/4 speed than Jerman is at this point.

Cya

472095[/snapback]

[Kelly the Dog]

I disagree to a certain extent.  Jonas Jennings, when he wasn't injured, was an adequate LT.  He was beaten a few times, but not nearly as often as Gandy.  Gandy has been manhandled by opposing defenses and is simply not an adequate solution at the LT position.  Jerman was worse, but that doesn't mean Gandy was a whole lot better.

 

TMQ said it best:

 

"During the past five drafts, the Bills have invested eight No. 1 and No. 2 picks in the glamour positions of quarterback, running back and wide receiver; against only one first- or second-round pick invested in blockers. "

472123[/snapback]

Give me some for instances. Give me more than a few specific plays where Gandy has been manhandled. He got humiliated on that one play but I didnt see him getting abused the whole game. I didn't see him getting manhandled in the previous four games. I continually see pass rushers and run stuffers coming up the middle on us in all four games however. Is he blowing people up or pancaking his opponent? No. Frankly, I think he's been by far our best OL to date in five games. Which isn't saying much at all, but everything is relative.

[Simon]

He was beaten a few times, but not nearly as often as Gandy. Gandy has been manhandled by opposing defenses and is simply not an adequate solution at the LT position.

I don't view Gandy as a long-term solution either, but to say that a guy who has given up 1 single sack in 5 games (and that one when he was playing with one arm) and is averaging 1 penalty every 2.5 games "has been manhandled" is simply not in line with reality.

[Bill from NYC]

I'm beginning to think that your expectations for NFL LT's are simply not in line with reality. Anybody who is not Orlando Pace or Jon Ogden sucks (and I've seen both Pace and Ogden completely abused at times). The fact of the matter is that all LT's get beat sometimes, every single one of them. And yesterday Gandy was injured and played most of the game with only one arm against the likes of Vonnie Hollliday, JTaylor and at times I think I also saw future HOF'er Kevin Carter flipped to his side. And yet I only noticed him give up a single sack (his very first of the entire year actually) and do a fair job holding ground in the rungame even though he was working with only one good arm. Yet he was dreadful? Again?!

If you want to lament the horrid play of a Bills OTackle, you need go no farther than the atrocious outing from Greg Jerman. He completely stunk it up just like he's done every time I've seen him on the field since the Bills made the mistake of bringing him in. The fact that he's on an NFL roster is shocking to me, but the fact that he is Mike Williams' primary back-up is simply horrifying.

As much as we miss Takeo, Vilarial and eventually probably even Ron Edwards, there is no other injured Bill that I am as desperate to see back on the field as I am to see Big Mike. If there's minimum risk of him further aggravating the injury, I think he's a better option on one leg at 3/4 speed than Jerman is at this point.

Cya

472095[/snapback]

 

Simon, Jennings was able to dominate Jason Taylor last year.

Yes, my expectations for a LT are high. I think that the Buffalo Bills fans are entitled to have a good LT on the roster of their favorite team, IF wining football games is the goal, rather than waiting for little Roscoe Parrish to "return."

 

Recently, I was looking at the SI Football edition. In it, they listed the starters at every position on every team. While looking at the cold weather teams, I noticed that our OL was one of the few that sucked, and none was as horrid as ours.

Sure, we have McNally, but so did the hapless Giants 2 years ago as they went down the tubes. They lost McNally, but they drafted Chris Snee, and signed McKenzie as a ufa to play RT (better than Fat Mike at approx. half the cost). Now, they have a good line., even without McNally!!! Yeah, it can happen.

Cinci is stocked on the line. The Ravens are talented, and we have their fat, plodding castoff. Look at the Chiefs. Even the Skins have more up front than we do, as do the dreaded jests. How about Pitt?

 

As for Jerman, there was little point in bringing up this dolphin castoff. He is as awful as awful can be. Why is he on the Bills; this reject from a garbage football team? Why is our OL so bad?

Because either TD screwed up and mis-judged the talent of these sub-par players OR, he would rather chase qbs and skinny wideouts in order to sell tickets.

 

Take your pick my friend, but I am not seeing any good news.

[Coach Tuesday]

If you want to lament the horrid play of a Bills OTackle, you need go no farther than the atrocious outing from Greg Jerman. He completely stunk it up just like he's done every time I've seen him on the field since the Bills made the mistake of bringing him in. The fact that he's on an NFL roster is shocking to me, but the fact that he is Mike Williams' primary back-up is simply horrifying.

472095[/snapback]

 

Can you imagine how awful MacFarland must be???

[Bill from NYC]

Can you imagine how awful MacFarland must be???

472148[/snapback]

 

A very sad thought indeed.

[Simon]

I am failing to see where Jonas Jennings or Roscoe Parrish have anything to do with Mike Gandy's performance thus far.

I'm also failing to see where you've shown Gandy's failings outside of the one sack that I already mentioned that he's given up on the entire year.

The Bills OLine isn't nearly as horrid as you want to make it out to be and the problems it does have are primarily Bennie Anderson and the fact that the entire right side has been fighting injuries most of the year. The problem is not with Mike Gandy who has been just fine every time I've seen him this year.

 

 

Simon, Jennings was able to dominate Jason Taylor last year.

Yes, my expectations for a LT are high. I think that the Buffalo Bills fans are entitled to have a good LT on the roster of their favorite team, IF wining football games is the goal, rather than waiting for little Roscoe Parrish to "return."

 

Recently, I was looking at the SI Football edition. In it, they listed the starters at every position on every team. While looking at the cold weather teams, I noticed that our OL was one of the few that sucked, and none was as horrid as ours.

Sure, we have McNally, but so did the hapless Giants 2 years ago as they went down the tubes. They lost McNally, but they drafted Chris Snee, and signed McKenzie as a ufa to play RT (better than Fat Mike at approx. half the cost). Now, they have a good line., even without McNally!!! Yeah, it can happen.

Cinci is stocked on the line. The Ravens are talented, and we have their fat, plodding castoff. Look at the Chiefs. Even the Skins have more up front than we do, as do the dreaded jests.    How about Pitt?

 

As for Jerman, there was little point in bringing up this dolphin castoff. He is as awful as awful can be. Why is he on the Bills; this reject from a garbage football team? Why is our OL so bad?

Because either TD screwed up and mis-judged the talent of these sub-par players OR, he would rather chase qbs and skinny wideouts in order to sell tickets.

 

Take your pick my friend, but I am not seeing any good news.

472146[/snapback]

[MDH]

Recently, I was looking at the SI Football edition. In it, they listed the starters at every position on every team. While looking at the cold weather teams, I noticed that our OL was one of the few that sucked, and none was as horrid as ours.

 

472146[/snapback]

 

You must realize that the only reason you think so highly of these other team's OLine is because you don't watch them week in and week out every single play? Looking at pretty stats and saying, "that oline is good" or watching them when they play the Bills (who can't get a decent rush on anybody using just 4 rushers) isn't a good way of evaluating a line. Get MW back in the lineup, a QB that can make quick reads and sound play calling and you'll see the sacks drop (has anybody seen crossing pattern on the three step drop this year?) This line is nowhere near as bad as people want to make it sound. I'm not contending they are world beaters, I'd say they're average.

 

The fact that you single out Gandy, who has been a gem of a find for us thus far, signals to me that (like Simon said) your expectations are through the roof. Only a handful of teams will have players like Ogden and it’s a lucky break when they pan out to be HoFers. If you’re going to single anybody out (of our actual starters, not the backups) I’d say it should be Teague. The guy has been abused often this year.

[Kelly the Dog]

On another note, it was great to meet you at the tailgate, Bill. Thanks for the beer and the confab. Now we can go back on never agreeing.

[Bill from NYC]

You must realize that the only reason you think so highly of these other team's OLine is because you don't watch them week in and week out every single play?  Looking at pretty stats and saying, "that oline is good" or watching them when they play the Bills (who can't get a decent rush on anybody using just 4 rushers) isn't a good way of evaluating a line.  Get MW back in the lineup, a QB that can make quick reads and sound play calling and you'll see the sacks drop (has anybody seen crossing pattern on the three step drop this year?)  This line is nowhere near as bad as people want to make it sound.  I'm not contending they are world beaters, I'd say they're average. 

 

The fact that you single out Gandy, who has been a gem of a find for us thus far, signals to me that (like Simon said) your expectations are through the roof.  Only a handful of teams will have players like Ogden and it’s a lucky break when they pan out to be HoFers.  If you’re going to single anybody out (of our actual starters, not the backups) I’d say it should be Teague.  The guy has been abused often this year.

472174[/snapback]

 

I singled out Gandy because he sucks. Is he playing as poorly as Teague, Jerman, or even Anderson? No. These players suck almost beyond words.

 

The fact remains that Gandy, a castoff from an OL that boasts a shrunken, aged Ruben Brown, is a sub-par performer at one of the most vital positions on the football field. Do you look forward to watching him against Abraham and Seymour?

If this is fine with you, we can surely agree to disagree. I for one would rather that the Bills field a strong football team than a circus side show full of gadget players who, when healthy, can make a play or two per game.

 

We won yesterday and I am pumped and ready for the jests. Wins however will be fleeting until TD brings us players who can block in the National Football League, the greatness of McNally pixie dust notwithstanding.

[Buftex]

I think that was the telling stat of the day....If Losman gets that kind of

production from the RB with the play calling, he plays as good as Holocomb

with our horrible Offensive Line.

472110[/snapback]

 

 

Except there is one thing you are leaving out. Losman was just not accurate in his last three starts. Holcomb didn't really make any spectacular plays, he just took the plays, for the most part, that were available to him. JP just didn't do that, particularly against the Falcons and Saints. JP, at this time, never would have made that pass to Evans on the opening drive. The game has to slow down for JP quite a bit, for him to become as efficient as Holcomb was yesterday. It will happen, it is just off in the future....

 

To me, Holcomb played exactly the kind of game that I was dreaming Losman would play out of the shoot...nothing spectacular, but efficient, with a few mistakes. JP just has a way to go. The offensive line may be bad, but a QB's play can also alter that perception.

[Campy]

To me, Holcomb played exactly the kind of game that I was dreaming Losman would play out of the shoot...nothing spectacular, but efficient, with a few mistakes.  JP just has a way to go.  The offensive line may be bad, but a QB's play can also alter that perception.

472304[/snapback]

That's a great point buftex.

[BillsWatch]

The fact remains that Gandy, a castoff from an OL that boasts a shrunken, aged Ruben Brown

472280[/snapback]

 

That shows you are not objective ... when someone was "cast off" the team which dared to sign the player you have labelled as washed up, it causes you to slant your view. It is like trying to talk to one of the fanatic LOSers why their golden child was benched.

 

On almost any subject not related to Ruben in some manner you are objective but this is the arrow in the Achilles heal.

[Bill from NYC]

That shows you are not objective  ... when someone was "cast off" the team which dared to sign the player you have labelled as washed up, it causes you to slant your view.  It is like trying to talk to one of the fanatic LOSers why their golden child was benched.

 

On almost any subject not related to Ruben in some manner you are objective but this is the arrow in the Achilles heal.

472389[/snapback]

 

I don't know Glenn. Maybe I wasn't clear.

Ruben was a splendid player, and a great draft selection for the Bills. He also seemed like a good man for the community, etc.

The thing is, when he left he had shed many pounds, and appeared to be through.

Gandy played a lot at Guard in Chicago, right? The thought that he didn't beat out an aged Ruben Brown is scary.

Nothing personal againt RB intended.

[BB2004]

1) First, I wish to thank each and every TBDer for being so nice to us. We met up with some old friends, and had a chance to make new ones. It was great, and thanks again to all! (Cindy, JR said to remind you that I gave him the money for the shirt.  )

 

2) Most of the WNY media seems to be talking about Moulds, but the primary reason (imo) that Kelly was more effective was that he was able to get the football to Evans.

 

3) As pumped as I am, we need to beat the jests in order to contend.

 

4) Kelsay looked good when it counted.

 

5) To all those who think that Gandy is an adequate LT, I urge you to watch the tape of this game. He was (again, imo) dreadful. Let's grab one of the many LTs said to be available in the 06 draft. Please.

 

6) Willis didn't have a great statistical game, but he kept the offense on the field.

 

7) Big Sam looked a little better. Maybe he is coming around?

 

8) Sorry to throw flames (NOT the intention) , but Bob DiCescare (sic) wrote a great article in the Buffalo News today about with a reference to Drew. Yes, I do wish that he was still our qb, but I AM moving on. 

 

9) Once again, thanks to all at 1/5. You guys have no idea what this trip means to us. I even got Badolbilz to commit to finding us a LT in the off season. That is going to be great! 

 

10) GO BILLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

472050[/snapback]

 

Great post. Who else could we put out there at LT?