Kelly the Dog Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 how many times do we havfta go over the fact that marvin lewis didnt WANT to come to buffalo! Tough to hire a coach who doesnt want the job... 459173[/snapback] Then why didnt he talk Vince Lombardi out of the grave, huh? Jesus, some people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
d_wag Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 how many times do we havfta go over the fact that marvin lewis didnt WANT to come to buffalo! Tough to hire a coach who doesnt want the job... 459173[/snapback] pure speculation........lewis was quoted as snubbing the bills AFTER they decided to go with williams........it's far from shocking that a guy who didn't get the job comes out swinging and bitter....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bills_fan Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 oh i wasnt accusing you, i was echoing a general sentiment among the board...posey is a solid LB and i dont know why everyone is in a hurry to get rid of him... He is a very solid LB. No question. But, with the limited amount of cap space available, and having Crowell (if he plays well) in the wings and Nate to re-sign, he may be the victim of a numbers game, same as Trey Teague. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Typical TBD Guy Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 I found this disturbing fact on another message board: Worst records since 2001: New Orleans: 33-34 Chicago: 30-37 Bills: 27-40 Cincy: 27-40 Cleveland: 26-41 Arizona: 22-45 Detroit: 17-50 Nice company, eh? 459149[/snapback] Wait a minute. Only 7 of 32 NFL teams have had a below .500 record since 2001? Does that seem inaccurate to anyone else here? Someone clarify, please. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 This is an assumption that we're supposed to accept as fact. Why? Because you say so? 458791[/snapback] yes Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 Wait a minute. Only 7 of 32 NFL teams have had a below .500 record since 2001? Does that seem inaccurate to anyone else here? Someone clarify, please. 459196[/snapback] The games weren't all played in a 67 game season. Sometime they had winning years, sometimes they had losing years. But on balance it appears only seven teams had more losing years than winning years. I know others strongly disagreee, but IMHO, that more than anything is an indictment of the front office. That said, do I care about water that's gone under the bridge? Mabye, but I expect the Bills to win ever Sunday, and sometimes I'm not disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ans4e64 Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 excellent post Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 Well, first of all you can toss the 3-13 record in his first year. That was the remnants of the late John Butler's spend all the cap money on aging veterans with diminishing skills and pay the rest to QB's who were to short or too disinterested (Flutie/Johnson). With the high pick in that draft we get Mike Williams who to date has been good but not great, but has been developing and will be a pro bowl player in the next couple of seasons. Later in that draft TD drafts Terrance McGee who is a pro bowl return specialist and developing as an excellent CB. I know many of you on this board do not remember or are too young and immature to think backs of the teams under Bill Pollian that went 2-14, 4-12 and 4-12 before maturing into the team that won the AFC East from 1988 to 1991 and went to four straight Super Bowls. 458703[/snapback] A good post, just a couple of corrections. Terrance McGee was picked in the 2003 draft (1st of 2 round 4 selections), same year as McGahee. Polian went 4-12, 7-8 (6-6 in real games), and 12-4 his 1st 3 years. It also didn't hurt him to inherit Jim Kelly, Bruce Smith, and Andre Reed, although he might have had a hand in the Smith & Reed selections before he was GM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dave mcbride Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 A good post, just a couple of corrections.Terrance McGee was picked in the 2003 draft (1st of 2 round 4 selections), same year as McGahee. Polian went 4-12, 7-8 (6-6 in real games), and 12-4 his 1st 3 years. It also didn't hurt him to inherit Jim Kelly, Bruce Smith, and Andre Reed, although he might have had a hand in the Smith & Reed selections before he was GM. 459324[/snapback] polian was THE reason kelly finally signed with buffalo. he gets credit for that. a gm with less intestinal fortitude (stew barber?) would have traded kelly to oakland, who coveted him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Jokeman Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 Thats a pretty good track record to start. 458794[/snapback] 1996 Jonathan Ogden (4) 1997 Peter Boulware (4) 1998 Duane Starks (10) 1999 Chris McCalister (10) 2000 Jamal Lewis (5)/Travis Taylor (10) 2001 Todd Heap (31) 2002 Ed Reed (24) 2003 Terrel Suggs (10) /Boller (19) 2004 none 2005 Mark Clayton (22). 6 of the 11 were taken within the top 10 picks of the draft, in comparison Donahoe has had 1 pick in the top 10 in his tenure. Say what you want but I always feel the cream of the crop usually rises to the top. In terms of the coaching staffs, I have always felt the best choice in 2001 that Dom Capers would have been a favorable choice. As he's a proponent of the 3-4 defense and his OC Chris Palmer had a working history with RJ and Drew Bledsoe which might have lead to better results in the first few years under TD. Granted they struggled in Houston (I know Palmer recenly saw the axe) but there's no telling what they would have done here with a veteran team vs starting completely from scratch. I think TD has done a good job here not great. While the team's wheels seem to be perveriably spinning as a below average team in terms of record at least it's been enjoyable. While I predicted a 6-10 season this year I still haven't written this team off yet as we're 1 win better than last year's squad which was 1 win away from the playoff and in this parity driven league only time will tell who's the best team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATBNG Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 Wait a minute. Only 7 of 32 NFL teams have had a below .500 record since 2001? Does that seem inaccurate to anyone else here? Someone clarify, please. 459196[/snapback] I have the 49ers in there at 32-35, as well as the Redskins at 28-38. List doesn't appear to be exhaustive - seems like the poster just went through "bad teams" in his mind and figured out their records. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AJ1 Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 Wait a minute. Only 7 of 32 NFL teams have had a below .500 record since 2001? Does that seem inaccurate to anyone else here? Someone clarify, please. 459196[/snapback] All things being equal, all teams should be .500 over the long haul. Obviously, there have been 7 truly bad teams in the last 4 years, the Bills being one of that number. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
seq004 Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 I would answer but I don't have my list of 20 other GM's that can give the team and fans a better recond than 27-40 and a waste of 5 years plus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATBNG Posted September 29, 2005 Share Posted September 29, 2005 All things being equal, all teams should be .500 over the long haul. Obviously, there have been 7 truly bad teams in the last 4 years, the Bills being one of that number. 459350[/snapback] No, Kelso is right...the list is not exhaustive. There are at least two other teams (SF and Washington) that had losing records since the start of 2001, and there are probably a few more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 Anyway, let me answer on behalf of everyone else here: 458716[/snapback] 1) Please don't presume to speak for me. 2) Lots of names being thrown around here, all of whom are (obvious) known commodities currently holding down jobs. How about this one: pick someone else for the Bills GM job that is a quality football guy that could be lured out of his current position to come here? I hear the crickets chirping... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 2. I'm sick of being patient, there is no reason we shouldn't be in the playoffs this year. 458746[/snapback] Geez, I didn't realize we were mathematically eliminated after week 3!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BillnutinHouston Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 Perhaps, but when you're GM, all of your decisions must be brilliant at the time of the move, have immediate perfect results, and look great in retrospect. All players and positions must be all-pros, or working as the best cohesive unit in the league based on stats, but none of them can be overpaid, although they have to be signed early before they hit free agency. You have to be dead on in your choices of coaches, out of all the great coaches that don't happen to have coaching jobs, and you cannot overstep your job title and be a Hitler because you're an ego-maniac, although if anything happens to go wrong it's your duty to jump in and make the tough, perfect decisions because the buck stops here. 458784[/snapback] Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chalkie Gerzowski Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 Bill Cowher Reid Joe Banner....as in, it has been a banner season in Pennsylvania.... Banner is like that guy Theo Horshack of the Red Sawx......except he doesn't have age on his side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redneckmoose22 Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 Back to the original topic of, "name someone who'd be better than TD" Howard the Duck Rocky with Bullwinkle as the Special Teams coach. C'mon........... need we say more........ this cow is dead, and so is TD's GM abilities. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tcali Posted September 30, 2005 Share Posted September 30, 2005 there are some good points here, but there are some problems with your argument as well. the so-called salary cap mess that he inherited was largely a myth, created in part by dumping guys that gregg williams didn't want and thereby accelerating their bonus numbers into 2001. i will also argue to my dying day that a flutie-led team in 2001 would have produced at least 6 victories. you may sneer at such a small prize, but my view is this: i find it physically painful to view a 3-13 season. the following year they went 8-8, and it was fun -- games actually meant something. sure they didn't go anywhere, but at least they were an entertaining unit. and football, believe it or not, is entertainment: nothing more, nothing less. of course, i don't blame the decision to go with johnson all on donohoe. he rightly gave the coach authority, and williams -- a really lousy head coach in retrospect -- made the wrong decision. lest you argue that johnson was the right decision, let me ask you this: who is still in the league? flutie or johnson? and for which organization is flutie playing for? flutie didn't have a great year in 2001 with SD, but raising that issue also raises the issue of his poor receiving corps. he had a great rapport with moulds and price, and made them look fantastic in the games he played in in 2000. as for the players let go before the 2001 season - holocek, henry jones, and especially ted washington (what a horrible move that was) -- if they had been on that team, you can bet the record would have been better. did they do that well elsewhere? except for washington, no, but i betcha that if they had stayed in buffalo, their performances would have been just fine given their leadership of the team. again, these were gregg williams' choices too, and he was a guy who pushed a scheme instead of building a scheme around the players he had. but donohoe did hire williams. the other inarguable issue with donohoe is his qb history. o'donnell was actually an ok player, but he got booted out after 95 when donohoe made no effort to resign him. the other qbs taken by him under his watch were stewart and jim miller (who donohoe was a bigtime champion of). in buffalo, he (and williams, tis true) chose the execrable johnson. he followed that with DB, probably the definition of a big talent mediocrity. we'll see with losman, of course, but donohoe's history at the position isn't all that great. he is *very* good at certain things: finding great linebackers, productive if not great defensive linemen, secondary guys who can tackle and cover, and bruising running backs. i'll also say that he's good at finding coaches, notwithstanding the williams debacle. cowher is basically a legend at this point, and i really like mularkey. he is also good at placing a dollar value on players -- he doesn't overpay them, but pays the guys who perform fairly. hence, you don't see a lot of holdouts. my one problem with this, though, is that you sometimes have to overpay to remain decent. he should have kept woodson in pitt (he says today that not keeping him was one of his biggest regrets), and this season may show that he perhaps should have overpaid for pat williams since there was no effective plan to replace him. finally, he's good at trading. indeed there are few better. i'm shocked that he got a third for a middling back like henry, and even more shocked that he did so given the substance abuse record (although my guess is that 75% of the players have one strike against them). he made a fantastic trade for bettis, and the swapping of firsts with tampa in 2001 was a fantastic move. hell, i even like the denney trade -- finding a serviceable d-line rotation guy in the low 60s is nothing to sneeze at. my point is that he does a lot of things well and other things not so well. he's not a god, and he's not a joke. what he does have to do, though, is oversee a team in buffalo that actually makes the playoffs. 458824[/snapback] Excellent post sir....... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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