nick in* england Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 So TKO is done for the year. "Big Deal," I say. The TDB crowd looks on at the crazy Brit, perplexed. Here's why I think losing Takeo is not as big a blow as it seems: because we had to make a major change, and now our hand has been forced. Let's face it Messers Spikes, Fletcher and Posey have not really been able to gobble up the run so far this season and Messers Schobel, Adams, Edwards, Anderson, Bannan, Denney and Kelsay haven't done too much to help that. So that leaves Co-ordinator Gray with some stark schoices to make in terms of how to use his personnel. With Spikes in the line up it gives Gray too much choice - he can big blitz but rely on Spikes quickness to save him if it all goes horribly wrong. The backups for Spikes can't do the same so it should force Gray to play a little more conservatively and a little more Run D focused - let the backfield take care of it's own business. And what does losing Spikes mean for the team as a whole? I for one think the D could do with a LOT less 'Leaders' (aka mouthpieces) on the field and more guys who will just go out and play. Addition by subtraction in this case. And anyway we need a leader Spikes will do it from the sideline in civvies. Also - how does it change the offence? It doesn't. Losman needs to get better. The recievers need to make plays. The Line needs to block the pass. And Willis needs to continue in Sunday's vein. This team can still challenge for the AFC East. The challenge that presented itself the past 2 weeks remains the same without Spikes. Look at NE's injuries - at some point (according to Michael Smith anyways) they will have to add up to some losses at some point. Coach Whyche believes Harrison, not Bruschi is the key to the Pats D. Factor in that they have only 3 healthy DBs and a rickety left side of the OL right now you're looking at an opportunity to knock the champs down. The Jets have lost 2 critical Offensive leaders in Pennington and Fiedler - you really think Brooks Bollinger can take the Jets to the top? Me either. This team needs to stop what they are doing. Take a deep breath. Take two deep breaths. And go out and play football each and every Sunday (bar the bye week for the pedants) until February.
RunTheBall Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 I'm sorry, but losing one of the best linebackers in the league, a proven playmaker, to a season ending injury is in no way addition by subtraction. This one is going to hurt. RTB
ajzepp Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 I'm sorry, but losing one of the best linebackers in the league, a proven playmaker, to a season ending injury is in no way addition by subtraction. This one is going to hurt. RTB 457584[/snapback] Yep....
KD in CA Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 I'm sorry, but losing one of the best linebackers in the league, a proven playmaker, to a season ending injury is in no way addition by subtraction. This one is going to hurt. RTB 457584[/snapback] Amazingly though, I remember people making the same argument that losing Phat Pat wasn't going to hurt either.
ajzepp Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Amazingly though, I remember people making the same argument that losing Phat Pat wasn't going to hurt either. 457600[/snapback] I was hoping it wouldn't hurt as much as it has, but I'm still glad we didn't dish out that kind of green for him. He was a very good player, and we're worse off without him here, but we'll find someone else.
Gavin in Va Beach Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Amazingly though, I remember people making the same argument that losing Phat Pat wasn't going to hurt either. 457600[/snapback] While Buffalo may be last against the run, Minnesota isn't far behind at #30. Phat Pat ain't exactly helping the Vikes out there...
ganesh Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Amazingly though, I remember people making the same argument that losing Phat Pat wasn't going to hurt either. 457600[/snapback] I don't think you can comnpare Pat Williams and TKO in the same page...two different players... BTW Pat Williams was run over by Willie parker in the season finale....I think he is over the hill and may be he has one more year left in the tank...I don't think the bills wanted to give him a 3 or 4 year contract for getting 1 good year out of him.....that will tie the salary cap again for 3-4 years....when you will have to cut the player after the 1st or 2nd year.
d_wag Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Amazingly though, I remember people making the same argument that losing Phat Pat wasn't going to hurt either. 457600[/snapback] are those the same people who said we didn't need corey simon?
nobody Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Seems like the D may have peaked and is now on the decline. Having Pat and Sam the last few years probably slowed the runners down enough that the linebackers had an easier time stopping them. Now the runners are blasting through so when they hit the linebackers they are going full speed and can't be stopped as easily.
Chilly Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 So TKO is done for the year. "Big Deal," I say. The TDB crowd looks on at the crazy Brit, perplexed. Here's why I think losing Takeo is not as big a blow as it seems: because we had to make a major change, and now our hand has been forced. Let's face it Messers Spikes, Fletcher and Posey have not really been able to gobble up the run so far this season and Messers Schobel, Adams, Edwards, Anderson, Bannan, Denney and Kelsay haven't done too much to help that. So that leaves Co-ordinator Gray with some stark schoices to make in terms of how to use his personnel. With Spikes in the line up it gives Gray too much choice - he can big blitz but rely on Spikes quickness to save him if it all goes horribly wrong. The backups for Spikes can't do the same so it should force Gray to play a little more conservatively and a little more Run D focused - let the backfield take care of it's own business. And what does losing Spikes mean for the team as a whole? I for one think the D could do with a LOT less 'Leaders' (aka mouthpieces) on the field and more guys who will just go out and play. Addition by subtraction in this case. And anyway we need a leader Spikes will do it from the sideline in civvies. Also - how does it change the offence? It doesn't. Losman needs to get better. The recievers need to make plays. The Line needs to block the pass. And Willis needs to continue in Sunday's vein. This team can still challenge for the AFC East. The challenge that presented itself the past 2 weeks remains the same without Spikes. Look at NE's injuries - at some point (according to Michael Smith anyways) they will have to add up to some losses at some point. Coach Whyche believes Harrison, not Bruschi is the key to the Pats D. Factor in that they have only 3 healthy DBs and a rickety left side of the OL right now you're looking at an opportunity to knock the champs down. The Jets have lost 2 critical Offensive leaders in Pennington and Fiedler - you really think Brooks Bollinger can take the Jets to the top? Me either. This team needs to stop what they are doing. Take a deep breath. Take two deep breaths. And go out and play football each and every Sunday (bar the bye week for the pedants) until February. 457560[/snapback] We already lost Fletcher in the Bucs game - that didn't work too good. Why would losing Spikes help? He's not CHris Watson you know.
SouthernMan Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 So TKO is done for the year. "Big Deal," I say. The TDB crowd looks on at the crazy Brit, perplexed. Here's why I think losing Takeo is not as big a blow as it seems: because we had to make a major change, and now our hand has been forced. Let's face it Messers Spikes, Fletcher and Posey have not really been able to gobble up the run so far this season and Messers Schobel, Adams, Edwards, Anderson, Bannan, Denney and Kelsay haven't done too much to help that. So that leaves Co-ordinator Gray with some stark schoices to make in terms of how to use his personnel. With Spikes in the line up it gives Gray too much choice - he can big blitz but rely on Spikes quickness to save him if it all goes horribly wrong. The backups for Spikes can't do the same so it should force Gray to play a little more conservatively and a little more Run D focused - let the backfield take care of it's own business. And what does losing Spikes mean for the team as a whole? I for one think the D could do with a LOT less 'Leaders' (aka mouthpieces) on the field and more guys who will just go out and play. Addition by subtraction in this case. And anyway we need a leader Spikes will do it from the sideline in civvies. Also - how does it change the offence? It doesn't. Losman needs to get better. The recievers need to make plays. The Line needs to block the pass. And Willis needs to continue in Sunday's vein. This team can still challenge for the AFC East. The challenge that presented itself the past 2 weeks remains the same without Spikes. Look at NE's injuries - at some point (according to Michael Smith anyways) they will have to add up to some losses at some point. Coach Whyche believes Harrison, not Bruschi is the key to the Pats D. Factor in that they have only 3 healthy DBs and a rickety left side of the OL right now you're looking at an opportunity to knock the champs down. The Jets have lost 2 critical Offensive leaders in Pennington and Fiedler - you really think Brooks Bollinger can take the Jets to the top? Me either. This team needs to stop what they are doing. Take a deep breath. Take two deep breaths. And go out and play football each and every Sunday (bar the bye week for the pedants) until February. 457560[/snapback] Me thinks Nick has had a little too much "tea" today. Losing a star player is NEVER a positive, no matter how rose-coloured your glasses. Now, be a good lad and pass the cream. Cherio.
Gavin in Va Beach Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Everyone is missing Nick's point here. He isn't arguing that losing Spikes is inconsequential, but rather that it's going to force the coaching staff to be more innovative in its defensive calls rather than depending on the idea that Spikes will make a play when needed. Losing Spikes will necessitate rethinking the defensive philosophy and making adjustments that may not have been made had Spikes not been injured, and I think we can all agree the defense was in need of adjustments. At least I think that's Nick's point...
nick in* england Posted September 28, 2005 Author Posted September 28, 2005 Everyone is missing Nick's point here. He isn't arguing that losing Spikes is inconsequential, but rather that it's going to force the coaching staff to be more innovative in its defensive calls rather than depending on the idea that Spikes will make a play when needed. Losing Spikes will necessitate rethinking the defensive philosophy and making adjustments that may not have been made had Spikes not been injured, and I think we can all agree the defense was in need of adjustments. At least I think that's Nick's point... 457692[/snapback] Thanks for getting it Gavin. Sure losing Spikes hurts. But losing Spikes while we are struggling forces the coaches to do something different, and that might be a good thing.
Typical TBD Guy Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Everyone is missing Nick's point here. He isn't arguing that losing Spikes is inconsequential, but rather that it's going to force the coaching staff to be more innovative in its defensive calls rather than depending on the idea that Spikes will make a play when needed. Losing Spikes will necessitate rethinking the defensive philosophy and making adjustments that may not have been made had Spikes not been injured, and I think we can all agree the defense was in need of adjustments. At least I think that's Nick's point... 457692[/snapback] Yeah, that's also how I interpreted Nick's comments. But unfortunately, I have very little faith in Gray's ability to alter his gameplan. Why didn't he make the necessary adjustments last Sunday? And the Sunday before? The reality is that Gray may very well be a mediocre DC who benefited greatly from the talent that he was given. His head coaching prospects are growing dimmer by the week.
MDH Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 This D has played about as poorly as it's capable of in the past two games. It has been a combination of the Bills playing, perhaps, the two best rushing offenses in the league and the D being out of position on several long runs. It goes without saying that this D will not perform as badly in future games as they have in the past two (if they did they'd go down as one of the worst Ds in league history). They will definitely pick it up a notch or two. That being said, when the D does get this thing turned around it's not going to be because of "addition by subtraction". It will be because they've finally gotten their heads out of their asses. This D will never be as good without Takeo as they are with him. If this D ends up being a top 10 D by the end of the year you can rest assured that they would have been top 5 had TKO still been in the lineup. This post almost looks like a setup post so when the D stops being run over someone can say, "see, I told you they'd be better without Takeo!"
MDH Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Yeah, that's also how I interpreted Nick's comments. But unfortunately, I have very little faith in Gray's ability to alter his gameplan. Why didn't he make the necessary adjustments last Sunday? And the Sunday before? The reality is that Gray may very well be a mediocre DC who benefited greatly from the talent that he was given. His head coaching prospects are growing dimmer by the week. 457713[/snapback] Two bad games by the D and suddenly Gray can't coach.
nick in* england Posted September 28, 2005 Author Posted September 28, 2005 This post almost looks like a setup post so when the D stops being run over someone can say, "see, I told you they'd be better without Takeo!" 457715[/snapback] noooooo I love TKO - awesome player and I am devastated I don't get to see him play. Our D DOES have to step up - i'm just offering a suggestion as to why it still CAN even without its best player.
Fan in San Diego Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 I understand your point. This forces Jerry Gray to come up with a new plan becuase it wasn' working before either ! Losing TKO forces him to come up with a new plan. If TKO was here, he would be tempted to stay with the status quo and that wasn't really working . Let's hope Jerry can scheme a good scheme !
IndyMark Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Thanks for getting it Gavin. Sure losing Spikes hurts. But losing Spikes while we are struggling forces the coaches to do something different, and that might be a good thing. 457703[/snapback] I agree with Nick's original post and Gavin's succinct thoughts. Losing TS may serve as the proverbial "blessing in disguise". You know how sometimes people ramp it up when their backs are to the wall and counted out? Maybe this injury will spook some players into playing with a purpose. Not that you should need this type of motivation at the NFL, but humans are humans. Notice also how all of TS teammates said "his attitude will be missed most"...really talent wise I am sure we can compensate (heck look how the last game and half went when he WAS playing)....there should not be a noticeable dropoff from an already poorly performing defense. What type of Bills players do we have, those that will belly up to the bar and pick up any slack or those that will curl up in the fetal position and say they are DOOOOOOOMED without TS. Hopefully, the former.
Typical TBD Guy Posted September 28, 2005 Posted September 28, 2005 Two bad games by the D and suddenly Gray can't coach. 457716[/snapback] Well, not quite. I said that Gray "may very well be a mediocre DC." Key word in there is MAY, which implies that I don't know for certain. In 2001 and 2002, we sucked. Then we got a lot of great players in 2003, and we were good. Now we lost Pat Williams, Spikes, Fletcher partly, and we are back to sucking again (yes, 32nd in the NFL for rushing yds can be called sucking). We'll see for sure whether Gray is a mediocre coach in the next 13 games.
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