Dear Mr President

[Bill from NYC]

Just an opinion here folks.....

 

This stuff can go on here forever.

The conservatives think that a reasonable rescue effort was made.

Dr. K, blzrul and other leftist radicals think that the whole effort sucked.

Wow, what a surprise!

 

If Clinton was in office, the opinions would be almost entirely reversed.

 

If Bush would have sent in Navy Seals immediately and killed the looters, perhaps one innocent would have been killed, and Bush would be declared a "murderer" by the lefties. They might even have taken offense to harsh treatment of looting gang members, I don't know. He waits, now he and his mother are insulted.

Hey, another surprise!

 

Of course, we received the obligitory knock on the door by John Adams, insinuating that we are all puppets, and of course not as brilliant as he is.

Couldn't have seen this coming either!!!

 

At least we are united in our wishes for a full and speedy recovery to the sick, injured, and those devastated in any way.

May God bless them all.

[Terry Tate]

That wasn't the only criticism.  For example, he didn't know of the thousands languishing at the convention center even though the networks had been covering the story there.  Those people were told to go there buy the authorities.  How could the man most responsible to help them not know that?  I don't know the answer but it is a legitimate inquiry.

 

I know someone who had and has more experience and who Bush himself praised in a debate with Al Gore: James Lee Witt.  The hiring of such an inexperienced man is, again, a legitimate inquiry.

And that is an excellent question. Someone obviously dropped the ball, and could've relieved a lot of folks of their misery a lot sooner. Initial reporting is generally the responsibility of local govt, which was immediately and hopelessly overwhelmed. The state and the feds should have immediately coordinated their efforts more closely at that point. From what I've read, the Governor was not initially willing to turn over control of LA Guard forces to the feds; I believe she too was overwhelmed, and made a short-sighted decision. Who's responsibility were those people at that point? Yeah, I don't know either. That results in two separate communications chains of command. I've never seen that work in the military or civilian world.

 

With all the focus on FEMA, I'm curious why the Louisianna EMA (LEMA) isn't getting the same attention. Didn't see the same type of intial CF in Florida last year, haven't seen the same type of CF happening in Mississippi, which was hit directly. Different states devastated by hurricanes, one's was intially a total CF, the rest coping from the start as best as can be expected. One of these things is not like the other...

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

Those people were told to go there buy the authorities.

 

Which authorities? Federal, state, and local, none communicating with the other. My impression was and still is that the local authorities told everyone to go there, but never bothered to tell the feds, thus the feds didn't know because the local guys never bothered to plan to coordinate with the feds.

 

Yes, those things are supposed to be planned beforehand.

 

  How could the man most responsible to help them not know that?

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Nagin?

[Live&DieBillsFootball]

The conservatives think that a reasonable rescue effort was made.

Dr. K, blzrul and other leftist radicals think that the whole effort sucked.

 

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Well, that's a typical response on this board. "The Conservatives are reasonable, and everyone else is a leftist radical." At least we know that you are non-partisan.

[pope zimli]

I won't be surprised if Nagin's local popularity actually increases after all of this.

 

He had the balls to say that it was because of his crazy rants that things actually started getting done in New Orleans.

 

Which is basically like me going outside my apartment around 8pm, screaming about how hot it is outside, and then taking credit when the sun goes down.

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I don't think ANY official, local state or federal, who was involved (or should have been involved) in this fiasco deserves to be President. Unfortunatately only one of those federal officials happens to be president, and his sorry actions in other situations gave pretty fair warning that he would !@#$ up this one.

[Mickey]

Which authorities?  Federal, state, and local, none communicating with the other.  My impression was and still is that the local authorities told everyone to go there, but never bothered to tell the feds, thus the feds didn't know because the local guys never bothered to plan to coordinate with the feds.

 

Yes, those things are supposed to be planned beforehand. 

Nagin? 

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Regardless of whether the feds were never told, it was no secret to anyone watching the news. I get this kind of thing all the time in my cases. A guy will say "there was no warning telling me not to stick my hand in the sausage dicer". I'll ask, "depite the lack of a warning, didn't you already know that sticking your hand in the sausage dicer was a very, very, very bad idea?" Just because the people who should be telling this info to the feds didn't, doesn't mean that they shouldn't have known about it anyway.

 

I am wondering what quality of response can be expected from the locals when they are getting hit with the same problems as the people they are trying to help. How do you get a helo pilot to fly a chopper when he is stuck on his own roof surrounded by water awaiting rescue himself?

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

Regardless of whether the feds were never told, it was no secret to anyone watching the news.  I get this kind of thing all the time in my cases.  A guy will say "there was no warning telling me not to stick my hand in the sausage dicer".  I'll ask, "depite the lack of a warning, didn't you already know that sticking your hand in the sausage dicer was a very, very, very bad idea?"  Just because the people who should be telling this info to the feds didn't, doesn't mean that they shouldn't have known about it anyway.

 

The difference being that the bozo who sticks his hand in the sausage dicer doesn't have a chain of command to answer to. There is a way things like this are supposed to work, which is: state and federal resources deploy to assist local resources, and local resources in turn direct state and federal resources as to their needs. What you're saying, in effect, is that federal resources should deploy not according to local information, but to what they glean off CNN, completely ignoring state and local direction. That ain't the way it works. Frankly, it shouldn't be the way it works, and I suspect if that's the way it did work, you'd be just as ready to B word about how the feds are heavy-handed in ignoring the responsible state and local authorities.

 

I am wondering what quality of response can be expected from the locals when they are getting hit with the same problems as the people they are trying to help.  How do you get a helo pilot to fly a chopper when he is stuck on his own roof surrounded by water awaiting rescue himself?

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I suspect it would be awfully poor...since pilots stuck on their roofs should have been flying their helicopters out of the emergency zone in preparation, if anyone had had the good sense to PLAN an evacuation instead of giving a half-assed last-minute order for one. A few pilots - or bus drivers - caught in flood waters while their helicopters - or busses - wait under ten feet of water isn't the problem, it's merely symptomatic of the larger problem: a lack of even the most rudimentary planning at the level at which it's supposed to occur.

 

And I'll give you a hint at what that level is: not federal or state. Geez, why do you think the appropriately named "first responders" are invariably municipal services???

[Mickey]

The difference being that the bozo who sticks his hand in the sausage dicer doesn't have a chain of command to answer to.  There is a way things like this are supposed to work, which is: state and federal resources deploy to assist local resources, and local resources in turn direct state and federal resources as to their needs.  What you're saying, in effect, is that federal resources should deploy not according to local information, but to what they glean off CNN, completely ignoring state and local direction.  That ain't the way it works.  Frankly, it shouldn't be the way it works, and I suspect if that's the way it did work, you'd be just as ready to B word about how the feds are heavy-handed in ignoring the responsible state and local authorities.

I suspect it would be awfully poor...since pilots stuck on their roofs should have been flying their helicopters out of the emergency zone in preparation, if anyone had had the good sense to PLAN an evacuation instead of giving a half-assed last-minute order for one.  A few pilots - or bus drivers - caught in flood waters while their helicopters - or busses - wait under ten feet of water isn't the problem, it's merely symptomatic of the larger problem: a lack of even the most rudimentary planning at the level at which it's supposed to occur. 

 

And I'll give you a hint at what that level is: not federal or state.  Geez, why do you think the appropriately named "first responders" are invariably municipal services???  

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What I would expect is that if CNN and every other network is showing a thousands of people without food and water at the convention center that FEMA would know that and respond with something along the lines of "holy cow, we need to check that out immediately" as opposed to what acutally happened which was along the lines of "golly Mr. Koppel, nobody told us". Mind you that the appropriate procedures under the Stafford Act (see the section of it I pasted in the FactCheck thread) authorizing the feds to direct all relief efforts including state and local authorities had been completed.

 

The notion that first responders might be overwhelmed or incapacitated by the same emergency they are being relied upon to mitigate has actually been a major issue and led to the Disaster Mitigation Act. That was essentially and amendment to the Stafford Act to increase federal capability to help in disasters before they occur rather than to simply come in after and help. Of course, to increase that capability, federal authority had to be increased as well. The model most people are using here is one that, I believe based on my research so far, no longer applies. The changes are due to the recognition that relying on first responders is not sufficient and thus the feds need to get involved as soon as it is known that a disaster is on the way. As stated in the Federal Response Plan:

 

"The Federal Response Plan (FRP) outlines how the Federal Government implements the Robert T. Stafford Disaster Relief and Emergency Assistance Act, as amended, to assist State and local governments when a major disaster or emergency overwhelms their ability to respond effectively to save lives; protect public health, safety, and property; and restore their communities. The FRP describes the policies, planning assumptions, concept of operations, response and recovery actions, and responsibilities of 25 Federal departments and agencies and the American Red Cross, that guide Federal operations following a Presidential declaration of a major disaster or emergency."

 

For a look at the entire plan, see Federal Response Plan

 

Here is an interesting passage with regard to authority to act as between state, local and federal officials:

 

"A. Authorities 1. Under the Stafford Act, a Governor may request the President to declare a major disaster or an emergency if an event is beyond the combined response capabilities of the State and affected local governments. Based on the findings of a joint Federal-State-local Preliminary Damage Assessment (PDA) indicating the damages are of sufficient severity and magnitude to warrant assistance under the Act, the President may grant a major disaster or emergency declaration. (Note: In a particularly fast-moving or clearly devastating disaster, the PDA process may be deferred until after the declaration.)

 

2. If an emergency involves an area or facility for which the Federal Government exer-cises exclusive or primary responsibility and authority, the President may unilaterally direct the provision of emergency assistance under the Stafford Act. The Governor of the affected State will be consulted if possible.

 

3. No direct Federal assistance is authorized prior to a Presidential declaration. However, DHS can use limited predeclaration authorities to move Initial Response Resources (IRR) (critical goods typically needed in the immediate aftermath of a disaster (e.g., food, water, emergency generators) and emergency teams closer to potentially affected areas. DHS also can activate essential command and control structures to lessen or avert the effects of a disaster and to improve the timeliness of disaster operations. Additionally, when an incident poses a threat to life and property that cannot be effectively dealt with by the State or local governments, DHS may request the Department of Defense (DOD) to use its resources prior to a declaration to perform any emergency work “essential for the preservation of life and property” under the Stafford Act.

 

4. Following a declaration, the President may direct any Federal agency to use its authorities and resources in support of State and local assistance efforts to the extent that provision of the support does not conflict with other agency emergency missions. This authority has been further delegated to the Secretary of DHS; the DHS Regional Director; and the Federal Coordinating Officer (FCO).

 

5. The Secretary of DHS, on behalf of the President, appoints an FCO, who is responsible for coordinating the timely delivery of Federal disaster assistance to the affected State, local governments, and disaster victims. In many cases, the FCO also serves as the Disaster Recovery Manager (DRM) to administer the financial aspects of assistance authorized under the Stafford Act. The FCO works closely with the State Coordinating Officer (SCO), appointed by the Governor to oversee disaster operations for the State, and the Governor’s Authorized Representative (GAR), empowered by the Governor to execute all necessary documents for disaster assistance on behalf of the State.

 

6. The State must commit to pay a share of the cost to receive certain types of Federal assistance under the Stafford Act. In extraordinary cases, the President may choose to adjust the cost share or waive it for a specified time period. The Presidential declaration notes any cost-share waiver, and a DHS-State Agreement is signed further stipulating the division of costs among Federal, State, and local governments and other conditions for receiving assistance.

 

7. While performing a function under the authority of the Stafford Act, a Federal agency or designated employee of a Federal agency is not liable for any claim based on the exercise or performance of or the failure to exercise or perform that function.

 

8. In addition to a Presidential disaster declaration, several Federal agencies have inde-pendent authorities to declare disasters. For example, the Secretary of Agriculture may declare a disaster in certain situations in which a county has sustained production losses of 30 percent or greater in a single major enterprise, authorizing emergency loans for physical damages and crop losses. The Secretary of Commerce may make a determination of a commercial fishery failure or fishery resource disaster. The Administrator of the Small Business Administration (SBA) may make a disaster declaration based on physical damage to buildings, machinery, equipment, inventory, homes, and other property as well as economic injury.

 

9. Response by agencies to lifesaving and life-protecting requirements under the FRP has precedence over other Federal response activities, except where national security implications are determined to be of a higher priority. If a disaster or emergency affects the national security of the United States, appropriate national security authorities, plans, and procedures will be used.

 

 

I am still looking at all this info when I have the chance and I would be interested in your view if you get a chance to at least browse through the FRP, Stafford Act and such.

 

One last thing on the buses under water. I am looking at that as well. Funny, the authority problem that conservatives are using to shield the administration from blame and liberals are pooh-poohing may have been at play with the buses which apparently were from a school district out side the city of NO such that the mayor would not have been able to commandeer them even if he had thought of it which he pretty clearly did not. You may see a flip-flop on the authority issue when it comes to the buses with liberals arguing that it shields the mayor and conservatives pooh-poohing it.

 

Safe to say there will be plenty of pooh-pooh to go around.