Crap Throwing Monkey Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 It isn't like they are sticking submersible pumps anywhere they can... They are proabbly pumping it to specific locations that can be localized. The pumps are in action during normal events... Those normal operations have to hold certain amounts of contaminents. I don't know the NO area... But, there has to be tremendous dreging operations on a continual basis... And certain spoil areas? Anyway, it will not be pretty. Bib, you hit the nail on the head with dealing with soil contaminents... Those soil contaminents are contained with the spoil area. ??? 423625[/snapback] I still say take down the levees on the river side and let the flood from all the upstream rainfall from today and tomorrow wash all the contaminants out of the city. Quickest way to clean it. ] Of course, it might get rid of all those pesky things like roads and building at the same time...but I never said it was a perfect plan.
ExiledInIllinois Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 I still say take down the levees on the river side and let the flood from all the upstream rainfall from today and tomorrow wash all the contaminants out of the city. Quickest way to clean it. ] Of course, it might get rid of all those pesky things like roads and building at the same time...but I never said it was a perfect plan. 423631[/snapback] What was the elevation of NO when it was first settled? My understanding that historically with the constant upkeep of the river that through the years it (NO) has been getting deeper and deeper away from sea level? Some people are blaming the people for living there, being too close. The way the delta is "building" NO has been making the best of the situation. The time has come to trash the city and build anew? What a crappy situation to be in? Kinda like your neighbors always building higher than you through the years... Who is gonna flood? In this case, your neighbor is the river!
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 What was the elevation of NO when it was first settled? My understanding that historically with the constant upkeep of the river that through the years it (NO) has been getting deeper and deeper away from sea level? Some people are blaming the people for living there, being too close. The way the delta is "building" NO has been making the best of the situation. The time has come to trash the city and build anew? What a crappy situation to be in? Kinda like your neighbors always building higher than you through the years... Who is gonna flood? In this case, your neighbor is the river! 423656[/snapback] I honestly don't know. Nor do I think it really matters in the high-level view. River deltas evolve. Building permanent structures on rapidly (in geologic terms) evolving land is invariably going to lead to situations where such structures become less permanent as the land moves, no matter if it moves up or down. Look how much archaeology is done underwater at the mouth of the Nile, after all...
JÂy RÛßeÒ Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 I still say take down the levees on the river side and let the flood from all the upstream rainfall from today and tomorrow wash all the contaminants out of the city. Quickest way to clean it. ] Of course, it might get rid of all those pesky things like roads and building at the same time...but I never said it was a perfect plan. 423631[/snapback] And looters...
Fake-Fat Sunny Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 This may actually clue us in that being dependent for the most part on one source for energy production is not the best idea. In addition to the fossil fuels we are addicted to (be it over-dependence on some rich guy in Saudi Arabia or some rich guy in Texas) being too depedent on one source for energy production. There seems to be many different sources out there our government does not subsidize nearly at the level of the oil depletion allowance subsidy or the Price-Anderson Act where the government insulates the nuke industry from the free market. We need a level playing field to encourage competition. It will probably take awhile in any case to ramp up energy production so if our government wants to encourage a quicker fix then investing in energy conservation would yield more immediate benefits while making things more efficient in the long term.
Just Jack Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 What was the elevation of NO when it was first settled? My understanding that historically with the constant upkeep of the river that through the years it (NO) has been getting deeper and deeper away from sea level? Some people are blaming the people for living there, being too close. The way the delta is "building" NO has been making the best of the situation. The time has come to trash the city and build anew? What a crappy situation to be in? Kinda like your neighbors always building higher than you through the years... Who is gonna flood? In this case, your neighbor is the river! 423656[/snapback] I don't think they told us exact elevations, but I remember from elementary school (can't remember if it was covered under science or history) that sediment from the Mississippi flows down to NO and changes the land mass as it settles when it hits the Gulf.
cåblelady Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 Depends on the context. Stopping a flood? Not really. Dropped on your head? Then you may disagree... 423563[/snapback]
Ghost of BiB Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 It isn't like they are sticking submersible pumps anywhere they can... They are proabbly pumping it to specific locations that can be localized. The pumps are in action during normal events... Those normal operations have to hold certain amounts of contaminents. I don't know the NO area... But, there has to be tremendous dreging operations on a continual basis... And certain spoil areas? Anyway, it will not be pretty. Bib, you hit the nail on the head with dealing with soil contaminents... Those soil contaminents are contained with the spoil area. ??? 423625[/snapback] You reminded me of something I didn't think about. Dredge spoils are almost always high in heavy metals. They could probably reduce the degree to which they have to clean by comparing new soil tests against known backgrounds, which are probably high anyway. It's still going to be awfully expensive. I don't know how this works for a hurricane, but contamination is the responsibility, cradle to grave of the generator. If methyl-ethyl-death washes out of your tank farm and into downtown NO, it's YOUR problem. If you are a big company, you can spend years and millions fighting liability in court.
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 Jesus Christ... As floodwaters rose around Charity Hospital, the rescuers needed their own rescuing. Charity's backup generator was running out of diesel fuel. Nurses hand-pumped ventilators for patients who couldn't breathe. Doctors canoed supplies in from three nearby hospitals. http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050831/ap_on_...katrina_medical What an absolute nightmare.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 Opinions entitled to are we. 422718[/snapback] There is no try: only DO or DO NOT.
envirojeff Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 There's a good possibility that I may be headed to Pensacola for use in relief efforts. I'm a government employee and volunteered assistance. I'll keep you posted. Jeff
UConn James Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 ABC just had satelite pictures up of where the devastation and flooding is, and if you remember the ones from the tsunami, this looks about as bad. I wonder when that guy from the U.N. is going to call every other country "stingy" b/c they're not donating enough, or for that matter, anything. Oh, that's right. Never. The Navy is sending down four ships with supplies. Americans are expected to take care of their own, in addition to everyone else.
envirojeff Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 ABC just had satelite pictures up of where the devastation and flooding is, and if you remember the ones from the tsunami, this looks about as bad. I wonder when that guy from the U.N. is going to call every other country "stingy" b/c they're not donating enough, or for that matter, anything. Oh, that's right. Never. The Navy is sending down four ships with supplies. Americans are expected to take care of their own, in addition to everyone else. 423816[/snapback] Excellent point! Jeff
BRH Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 I don't think they told us exact elevations, but I remember from elementary school (can't remember if it was covered under science or history) that sediment from the Mississippi flows down to NO and changes the land mass as it settles when it hits the Gulf. 423749[/snapback] At least, it used to. When they built all the levees to protect New Orleans from the Mississippi, it stopped a lot of the sediment from flowing out into the delta and replenishing the islands and marshes that protected the city from hurricanes. As a result New Orleans is some 20 miles closer to the Gulf than it used to be (or, more accurately, the Gulf is 20 miles closer to New Orleans), and those 20 miles make a big difference in both storm strength and the size of the storm surge when it gets to the city.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 Where's all the outpouring of help and sympathy from the Islamic countries WE helped during the Tsunami? What? There is none? I'm shocked.
SilverNRed Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 ABC just had satelite pictures up of where the devastation and flooding is, and if you remember the ones from the tsunami, this looks about as bad. I wonder when that guy from the U.N. is going to call every other country "stingy" b/c they're not donating enough, or for that matter, anything. Oh, that's right. Never. The Navy is sending down four ships with supplies. Americans are expected to take care of their own, in addition to everyone else. 423816[/snapback] Give the UN some credit. I'm sure at some point they'll try to raise money so that they have an opportunity to steal it.
BRH Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 ABC just had satelite pictures up of where the devastation and flooding is, and if you remember the ones from the tsunami, this looks about as bad. 423816[/snapback] I'm not in any way minimizing what happened down there. But that tsunami killed almost a quarter of a million people. A quarter of a million.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 ABC just had satelite pictures up of where the devastation and flooding is, and if you remember the ones from the tsunami, this looks about as bad. I wonder when that guy from the U.N. is going to call every other country "stingy" b/c they're not donating enough, or for that matter, anything. Oh, that's right. Never. The Navy is sending down four ships with supplies. Americans are expected to take care of their own, in addition to everyone else. 423816[/snapback] Damn you beat me to it. This is why, when there's some sort of catastrophe somewhere else in the world I like to say "f*ck 'em". Because you KNOW that when the shoe is on the other foot, we're not getting any help.
Guffalo Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 Damn you beat me to it. This is why, when there's some sort of catastrophe somewhere else in the world I like to say "f*ck 'em". Because you KNOW that when the shoe is on the other foot, we're not getting any help. 423859[/snapback] I hate to agree with JSP, but in this case..... Next time an earthquake splits some multisyllabic, multi vowel country, I would love to see our representative stand up at the podium and tell them that we will give as much aid and supplies as we received during the Katrina disaster.
Pine Barrens Mafia Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 I hate to agree with JSP, but in this case..... Next time an earthquake splits some multisyllabic, multi vowel country, I would love to see our representative stand up at the podium and tell them that we will give as much aid and supplies as we received during the Katrina disaster. 423871[/snapback] Guff, you magnificent bastard! I read your book!
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