If Coy Wire is SOOOOOO BAD,

[grabowr30045]

Wire made some great plays against the run yesterday. I got to give him credit for being a great open field tackler. On the other hand, his pass coverage techniques are still relatively weak. He's strong on special teams and that's whats going to keep him on the roster for the season opener.

[IBTG81]

I would like to have Wire (for his special teams play) only if we keep 5 safeties. Otherwise, God forbid something happen to Milloy, we're SCREWED if he's the backup.

[grabowr30045]

He's very good on special teams. Don't overlook that. He's a key component in the success of April's strategies. On the hand, you're absolutley right. If Milloy gets injured, we'll be bringing back Izell Reese.

[stevewin]

if youre going to knock him for making tackles in the defensive backfield, you have to knock the D-line and the LBs in front of him that let the runner through. he's supposed to be in the backfield, so that's where he'll tackle.

Just to restate my position, and what I think other people were trying to say, is not finding fault with tackles necessarily because they are in the DBackfield - but rather because they are eventually made by him many yards down the field from where he should have initially made them. I cannot tell you how many times in his career I have seen him run willy nilly up on a play, then due to over-pursuit/bad angle/bad instinct, completely whiff on where the intiial contact and tackle should be made - then (when he doesn't miss the play altogether) - make the tackle from behind many yards downfield past where the initial tackle should have been made (many times assisted by other defenders having in the interim slowed or stopped the carriers progress)

 

He's GREAT on special teams, and every team needs a guy who is the clear cut special teams leader. he's that guy. i think his play on ST is part of what brings the rest of the ST squad up.

I'm not trying to be a jerk - but can you cite evidence on why he is a GREAT special teams player? Actual plays on the field - being captain does not count. What games and specific plays led you to this conclusion? I personally cannot even ever remeber him making a great or even good open field tackle on STs. Were you aware that he was not even in the top 4 in ST tackles last year?

[stevewin]

I got to give him credit for being a great open field tackler. On the other hand, his pass coverage techniques are still relatively weak. He's strong on special teams and that's whats going to keep him on the roster for the season opener.

420392[/snapback]

Wire is simply an awful open field tackler. IMO he is worse at that than he is in coverage . How in the world did you ever come to the conclusion that he was a "great open field tackler". Have you ever watched him?

[stevewin]

He's a key component in the success of April's strategies.

Why exactly do you think that?

[grabowr30045]

Because I think he has great run response instincts. Don't get me wrong, I'm not defending him, but I do think he is strong on special teams. He made some great open field tackles yesterday.

[DrDawkinstein]

stevewin, are you my girlfriend in disguise? ive watched so much football over the last 3 years and you want specific special team plays?

 

no, im not able to recall specific plays where he shined. but i watch this team closely with a very critical eye, and im no football fool(havent missed a homegame in 18 years), and i believe that wire has shown me that he is a very good ST player. he doesnt have to lead the team in tackles to be a good force on ST. we both know stats are just stats

 

and he is a good tackler.

 

maybe we've been watching different games. yeah, i think he (and clements) lost the jax game for us last year (but i blame clements more). yeah, he cant cover and does not deserve to be a starting safety. thats why he isnt one.

 

i dont even really like the guy. as i said earlier, i believe we wouldnt win a game if he was our starting SS. i just cant believe anyone is expecting this much from backup players. who are we going to keep with his spot that would make us a better team? George Wilson?

 

i will say this: he's a better tackler/coverage guy than Kurt Schulz EVER was.

[CoachChuckDickerson]

I'm not trying to be a jerk - but can you cite evidence on why he is a GREAT special teams player?  Actual plays on the field - being captain does not count.  What games and specific plays led you to this conclusion?  I personally cannot even ever remeber him making a great or even good open field tackle on STs.  Were you aware that he was not even in the top 4 in ST tackles last year?

420407[/snapback]

 

FYI, you don't become Captain of the special teams if you don't make plays on special teams. Last time I checked we were the best in the league.

 

Wire is simply an awful open field tackler.  IMO he is worse at that than he is in coverage .  How in the world did you ever come to the conclusion that he was a "great open field tackler".  Have you ever watched him?

420412[/snapback]

 

You seem to be running around the original question. If he sucks so bad and can't tackle, how did he lead the team in tackles the past 2 games? I have watched him and he is always around the ball, either making the tackle or "piling on".....and FYI, "piling on" does not count as a tackle in the stats.

[Sound_n_Fury]

He led the team in tackles for 2 games in a row? Honestly, some of you guys joke that he "piles on". Seems like we got a lot of that going on here with no proof in the puddin.

420230[/snapback]

 

Let's look at the second half replay:

 

 

Chicago Bears at 10:28, (1st play from scrimmage 10:18)

 

1-10-CHI 19 (10:18) 20-T.Jones left end pushed ob at CHI 24 for 5 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

2-5-CHI 24 (9:56) 18-K.Orton pass to 12-J.Gage to CHI 28 for 4 yards (33-J.Greer).

 

3-1-CHI 28 (9:19) PENALTY on CHI-69-F.Miller, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at CHI 28 - No Play.

 

3-6-CHI 23 (8:54) 18-K.Orton pass to 12-J.Gage to CHI 42 for 19 yards (42-J.Leonhard).

 

1-10-CHI 42 (8:19) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete to 87-M.Muhammad.

 

2-10-CHI 42 (8:13) 18-K.Orton pass to 87-M.Muhammad pushed ob at BUF 48 for 10 yards (33-J.Greer).

 

1-10-BUF 48 (7:56) 20-T.Jones right guard to BUF 43 for 5 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

2-5-BUF 43 (7:21) 18-K.Orton pass to 88-D.Clark to BUF 32 for 11 yards (57-J.Stamer).

 

1-10-BUF 32 (6:40) 18-K.Orton pass to 48O-G.Reid to BUF 16 for 16 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

1-10-BUF 16 (5:53) 20-T.Jones left end to BUF 14 for 2 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

2-8-BUF 14 (5:07) 18-K.Orton pass incomplete to 87-M.Muhammad.

 

3-8-BUF 14 (5:02) 18-K.Orton pass to 84-B.Wade to BUF 2 for 12 yards (26-R.Baker).

 

1-2-BUF 2 (4:15) 18-K.Orton pass to 88-D.Clark for 2 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

 

 

 

Chicago Bears at 11:21

 

1-10-CHI 30 (11:21) 29-A.Peterson left tackle to CHI 31 for 1 yard (97-J.Bannan).

 

2-9-CHI 31 (10:47) 15-K.Kittner pass to 16-M.Bradley to CHI 41 for 10 yards (33-J.Greer).

 

1-10-CHI 41 (10:12) 15-K.Kittner pass to 81-R.Johnson to BUF 29 for 30 yards (33-J.Greer).

 

1-10-CHI 41 (9:48) 29-A.Peterson left end to CHI 46 for 5 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

2-5-CHI 46 (9:27) 29-A.Peterson left tackle to CHI 47 for 1 yard (53-M.Haggan).

 

3-4-CHI 47 (8:51) 15-K.Kittner pass incomplete to 16-M.Bradley.

 

4-4-CHI 47 (8:47) (Punt formation) 6-G.Lindstrom punts 35 yards to BUF 18

 

 

 

Chicago Bears at 3:29

 

1-10-50 (3:29) 11-J.Blake pass incomplete to 16-M.Bradley.

 

2-10-50 (3:25) 11-J.Blake pass to 16-M.Bradley to BUF 33 for 17 yards (42-J.Leonhard, 33-J.Greer).

 

P11 1-10-BUF 33 (2:46) 29-A.Peterson right guard to BUF 24 for 9 yards (55-A.Crowell).

 

2-6-BUF 29 (2:00) 11-J.Blake pass incomplete to 81-R.Johnson.

 

3-6-BUF 29 (1:56) 29-A.Peterson right tackle to BUF 8 for 21 yards (27-C.Wire).

 

1-8-BUF 8 (1:45) 29-A.Peterson right guard to BUF 3 for 5 yards (26-R.Baker, 57-J.Stamer).

 

2-3-BUF 3 (1:37) 29-A.Peterson right guard for 3 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

[stevewin]

FYI, you don't become Captain of the special teams if you don't make plays on special teams. Last time I checked we were the best in the league.

420428[/snapback]

So you are not judging him based on anything you saw - just based on the fact that he was captain of STs for some of the games? I've said before - I was captain of all three sports I played in HS - that had little to do with how good I was at them.... The fact is Wire was not even in the top 4 in ST tackles last year.

 

You seem to be running around the original question. If he sucks so bad and can't tackle, how did he lead the team in tackles the past 2 games?

I answered that in my first post

[stevewin]

stevewin, are you my girlfriend in disguise?  ive watched so much football over the last 3 years and you want specific special team plays? 

 

no, im not able to recall specific plays where he shined.  but i watch this team closely with a very critical eye, and im no football fool(havent missed a homegame in 18 years), and i believe that wire has shown me that he is a very good ST player. he doesnt have to lead the team in tackles to be a good force on ST.  we both know stats are just stats

 

and he is a good tackler.

 

maybe we've been watching different games. yeah, i think he (and clements) lost the jax game for us last year (but i blame clements more). yeah, he cant cover and does not deserve to be a starting safety. thats why he isnt one.

 

i dont even really like the guy. as i said earlier, i believe we wouldnt win a game if he was our starting SS. i just cant believe anyone is expecting this much from backup players.  who are we going to keep with his spot that would make us a better team? George Wilson?

 

i will say this: he's a better tackler/coverage guy than Kurt Schulz EVER was.

420426[/snapback]

I think a lot of people say they "watch" him - but in reality I don't think think they actually do as much as they think. I actually have "watched" him - since the 2nd game of his rookie season I became intent on *actually* watching him on every play - just because I kept seeing how awful he was and other people kept making excuses for him. He is only a good tackler if you define tackling as stopping a stationary target. In space against a moving target he is horrible in run support - for the same reasons that he is bad in coverage - poor angles, overpursuit, and bad instincts - w/o the speed or ability to overcome/compensate. When people say he is a great tackler it is just something that is not supported with reality - it simply isn't true.

[Sound_n_Fury]

LOL! You are so desperate to prove a point that you are wrong about YOU DOCTORED THE STATS TO TRY AND MAKE A POINT!!! You are pathedic.

 

The actual stats per NFL.com are as follows:

 

Chicago Bears at 10:18

1-10-CHI21 (10:18) T.Jones left end pushed ob at CHI 24 for 3 yards (C.Wire).

2-5-CHI24 (9:56) K.Orton pass to J.Gage to CHI 28 for 4 yards (J.Greer).

3-1-CHI28 (9:19) PENALTY on CHI-F.Miller, False Start, 5 yards, enforced at CHI 28 - No Play.

3-6-CHI23 (8:54) K.Orton pass to J.Gage to CHI 42 for 19 yards (J.Leonhard).

1-10-CHI42 (8:19) K.Orton pass incomplete to M.Muhammad. Play Challenged by CHI and Upheld. (Timeout #1 by CHI.)

2-10-CHI42 (8:13) K.Orton pass to M.Muhammad pushed ob at BUF 48 for 10 yards (J.Greer).

1-10-BUF48 (7:56) T.Jones right guard to BUF 43 for 5 yards (C.Wire).

2-5-BUF43 (7:21) K.Orton pass to D.Clark to BUF 32 for 11 yards (J.Stamer).

1-10-BUF32 (6:40) K.Orton pass to G.Reid to BUF 16 for 16 yards (C.Wire).

1-10-BUF16 (5:53) T.Jones left end to BUF 14 for 2 yards (C.Wire).

2-8-BUF14 (5:07) K.Orton pass incomplete to M.Muhammad.

3-8-BUF14 (5:02) K.Orton pass to B.Wade to BUF 2 for 12 yards (R.Baker).

1-2-BUF2 (4:15) K.Orton pass to D.Clark for 2 yards, TOUCHDOWN.

D.Brien extra point is GOOD, Center-P.Mannelly, Holder-B.Maynard.

420447[/snapback]

 

 

Huh??? Here's the source. What's doctored?

 

Appended:

Deleted your post I see....hummmm

[Typical TBD Guy]

Stevewin, to say the least, seems very passionate about the quality of the backup safeties on his team and especially astute at judging tackling protocol. So unless he's insane (you're not insane, are you stevewin? ), I'm inclined to believe him.

 

However, Wire is the only current backup SS on the team. Leonhard and Baker play FS, and neither is physically built to play run support in the way that Jerry Gray wants our SS's to play it. So unless some good free agent SS pickups are proposed that are equally strong on special teams, I'm going to have to side with the Wire Apologists on keeping the whipping boy fan favorite around.

[cåblelady]

If Milloy gets injured, we'll be bringing back Izell Reese.

420398[/snapback]

 

He's available now, ya know.

[jarthur31]

He led the team in tackles for 2 games in a row? Honestly, some of you guys joke that he "piles on". Seems like we got a lot of that going on here with no proof in the puddin.

420230[/snapback]

 

I don't know where you've been but Wire sux in coverage. He seems lost out there and nobody is fooled. I can't seem to remember reading any threads where his tackling was absolutely horrid but yes he's missed his share just like anybody esle.

[Dennis in NC]

Quick, don't think, spend 90 minutes shopping for shoes or watch Coy Wire's career highlight film?

420320[/snapback]

I'll take the shoes, Bob!

 

Or take the Wire highlight film if he is in some other team's uniform.

 

People that defend Wire's play have probably not watched him try to play the game.

[Rico]

1-10-BUF16 (5:53) T.Jones left end to BUF 14 for 2 yards (C.Wire).

I'm watching the replay right now, CW made a very nice tackle on this play.

Alright, Coy, he made a play!