Jersey banning smoking in cars?

[GG]

my understanding is this greatly expands the ability of government to collect private information. (computer records, business records, purchase records, library records, all with a gag order). This needs to be obtained with a court order, but without probable cause. Also it isn't discriminate information, it is everybody's information.

 

I was once mistakenly arrested and interrogated overnight for something I wasn't involved in. It turned out there wasn't a crime commited at all (so how could there be probable cause to search my person, effects, and documents.) The 4th Amendment is very important to me.

390184[/snapback]

 

I think it's helpful to actully read the text of the act, and not rely on preconceived notions fueled by partisan rantings. PATRIOT 215 is an amendment to the law that was already on the books since 1978, and allows FBI to do things that people were screaming they should hare been allowed to do pre-9/11.

 

You do remember the political indignancy of several missed opportunities by FBI to tie some of the hijackers together? A big part of that was that FBI didn't have the authority to follow the leads.

 

I found this to be a very interesting take - Make sure to read the last paragraph

[Reuben Gant]

The above does sound like a very interesting story.

Btw, wrt arrests, probable cause is needed for the ARREST, not the search. Search incident to a lawful arrest is perfectly legal.

I am NOT judging what happened to you; whereas I do not know any of the facts, just trying to offer a possible explanation. 

390190[/snapback]

It was kind bizarre really. It was for assault and stalking. I did not know the person, and in the end it turned out the person was never assaulted or stalked.

I fit a fictitious description. Of course they found no corraborating evidence, because I didn't know what the hell they were talking about. The police in the end were extremely apologetic, and perhaps overeager to do their jobs. But for the time that they thought they had their man were some of the scariest of my life.

Of course this doesn't have anything to do with the GWOT, but there was no warrant in this case, I was pulled out of a car.

[Reuben Gant]

I think it's helpful to actully read the text of the act, and not rely on preconceived notions fueled by partisan rantings.  PATRIOT 215 is an amendment to the law that was already on the books since 1978, and allows FBI to do things that people were screaming they should hare been allowed to do pre-9/11.   

 

You do remember the political indignancy of several missed opportunities by FBI to tie some of the hijackers together?  A big part of that was that FBI didn't have the authority to follow the leads. 

 

I found this to be a very interesting take - Make sure to read the last paragraph

390205[/snapback]

Good Link. And you make a good point. The trick pony here is that the FBI, an organization designed to investigate crime is now charged with counter-terrorism, that is uncommitted crime. I don't have a good answer for you, I want to be safe, but don't know enough about counter-terrorism to see why these are clearly needed.

[Bill from NYC]

It was kind bizarre really. It was for assault and stalking. I did not know the person, and in the end it turned out the person was never assaulted or stalked.

I fit a fictitious description. Of course they found no corraborating evidence, because I didn't know what the hell they were talking about. The police in the end were extremely apologetic, and perhaps overeager to do their jobs. But for the time that they thought they had their man were some of the scariest of my life.

Of course this doesn't have anything to do with the GWOT, but there was no warrant in this case, I was pulled out of a car.

390209[/snapback]

 

Persons are constantly arrested and searched without a warrant. Probable cause is sufficient for arrests, for instance.......A woman enters a police station and states that her husband assaulted her. She has a black eye. The woman is photographed, and a complaint report is filed. Guess who is getting arrested? Her statement serves as probable cause, even though the detective didn't witness the assault. There is no need for a warrant. The search will be conducted incident to the lawful arrest.

 

Just curious.....did the person who you were charged with assaulting have any visible injuries?

[Reuben Gant]

 

Just curious.....did the person who you were charged with assaulting have any visible injuries?

390238[/snapback]

I was never sure. I never saw the person. I imagine yes, and that they were self inflicted. Because I was repeatedly asked why I had been punching said person in the face. I love that question. Why were you punching her in the face? The police called the same week with regrets and said they were dropping the case, and I learned much later that this person was not mentally well.

 

My story checked out. I have never raised my hand against a woman, btw.

[BigAL]

Lets not interupt you then. You think its bad now? Wait till about four or five more attacks on our soil. Then, after that, they'll start profiling, OH, MY GOD, PROFILING!!!! NO, NO

 

 

389910[/snapback]

So who do you profile when they start importing blue eyed blonde haired Chechen muslims to do the suicide attacks? It's only a matter of time.

[erynthered]

So who do you profile when they start importing blue eyed blonde haired Chechen muslims to do the suicide attacks?  It's only a matter of time.

390363[/snapback]

 

 

They're already recruiting woman and children. When they adapt, we have to adapt. Since no-one does anything about the profiling issue, they will continue to use the same ones until we do something about it. Like I said, wait for about 4 or 5 hits here in the states.

 

 

Once my application for Profiling Tsar gets approved, I'll let you know what I'd do with the blue eyed Chechen Muslims if they started doing Homicide bombings here in the states.

[VABills]

They're already recruiting woman and children. When they adapt, we have to adapt. Since no-one does anything about the profiling issue, they will continue to use the same ones until we do something about it. Like I said, wait for about 4 or 5 hits here in the states.

Once my application for Profiling Tsar gets approved, I'll let you know what I'd do with the blue eyed Chechen Muslims if they started doing Homicide bombings here in the states.

390383[/snapback]

Can't be any worse then a drunk redheaded irishman.

[GG]

So who do you profile when they start importing blue eyed blonde haired Chechen muslims to do the suicide attacks?  It's only a matter of time.

390363[/snapback]

 

I'll give you my opinion when you find a blue eyed, blonde haired Chechen muslim.

[Alaska Darin]

So who do you profile when they start importing blue eyed blonde haired Chechen muslims to do the suicide attacks?  It's only a matter of time.

390363[/snapback]

Blond, Blue eyed Chechen Muslims. It's really not that hard.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

I'll give you my opinion when you find a blue eyed, blonde haired Chechen muslim.

390396[/snapback]

 

Plenty of blonde-and-blue Muslims in the Balkans.

[GG]

Plenty of blonde-and-blue Muslims in the Balkans.

390420[/snapback]

 

A bit of a distance from Chechnya.

 

If radicals do succeed in recruiting from the Balkans, then it's a different story and would also mean a major coup for the radicals. Balkans are far more western-inclined in their history and culture.

[Crap Throwing Monkey]

A bit of a distance from Chechnya. 

 

If radicals do succeed in recruiting from the Balkans, then it's a different story and would also mean a major coup for the radicals.  Balkans are far more western-inclined in their history and culture.

390427[/snapback]

 

A bit of a distance from Indonesia, too. So what the hell does geography have to do with it?

 

Lest you forget, the London bombers seem to have been recruited from Yorkshire, which I would submit is far more western-inclined than Chechnya or the Balkans. And the Serbs, Croats, and the like have as much if not more reason to be pissed off at NATO members than Chechnyans or your average resident of Leeds. I would be amazed if Islamic terrorist groups weren't actively recruiting in the Balkans.

[GG]

A bit of a distance from Indonesia, too.  So what the hell does geography have to do with it? 

 

Not much, other than the initial supposition that we should be weary of blue eyed blonde bombers from Chechnya. I imagine they'll come in the same numbers as blue eyed blonde bombers from Indonesia.

 

 

Lest you forget, the London bombers seem to have been recruited from Yorkshire, which I would submit is far more western-inclined than Chechnya or the Balkans.  And the Serbs, Croats, and the like have as much if not more reason to be pissed off at NATO members than Chechnyans or your average resident of Leeds.  I would be amazed if Islamic terrorist groups weren't actively recruiting in the Balkans.

390436[/snapback]

 

They are very active in the Balkans, as I imagine is western intelligence. It doesn't help that old Europe continues to look down upon new Europe, but overall the inclination for Balkan countries is to becom more western, as they're probably a little weary of totalitarian thought.

[stuckincincy]

A bit of a distance from Indonesia, too.  So what the hell does geography have to do with it? 

 

Lest you forget, the London bombers seem to have been recruited from Yorkshire, which I would submit is far more western-inclined than Chechnya or the Balkans.  And the Serbs, Croats, and the like have as much if not more reason to be pissed off at NATO members than Chechnyans or your average resident of Leeds.  I would be amazed if Islamic terrorist groups weren't actively recruiting in the Balkans.

390436[/snapback]

 

The question is: Do they smoke cigarettes in New Jersey?