BADOLBILZ Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Bills projected 2006 first round pick (If they don't use their first rounder in the supplemental for another Roscoe) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sfladave Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 YIKES they have the Bills picking 4th! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frez Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Pick number 4? I hope we are trading up to get him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Bills projected 2006 first round pick (If they don't use their first rounder in the supplemental for another Roscoe) 377836[/snapback] Welcome to year six in the rebuilding process! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Frez Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Welcome to year six in the rebuilding process! 377839[/snapback] This stuff takes time you know........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lori Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 YIKES they have the Bills picking 4th! 377837[/snapback] They're basing the draft order on Dan Pompei's predictions. That was their first mistake..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bill from NYC Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 They're basing the draft order on Dan Pompei's predictions. That was their first mistake..... 377849[/snapback] If we only had Travis for one more year, we would be able to make an even trade for this guy! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Rich Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 The 4th pick is probably not high enough to get Ferguson. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 He'll be gone long before we're picking at #32. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Welcome to year six in the rebuilding process! 377839[/snapback] I find it hard to believe a knowledgeable fan would make a comment like this. Donahoe made an unexpected detour that put asses in seats, sold craploads of tickets and merchandise and got people excited about the team again. No, it didn't work out the way everyone hoped...and yes, many people were oh, so smart to predict that Bledsoe wasn't the answer...but please don't portray that move as if it was part of Donaho'es three-year plan coming in. It wasn't, and any knowledgeable fan knows it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 I find it hard to believe a knowledgeable fan would make a comment like this. Donahoe made an unexpected detour that put asses in seats, sold craploads of tickets and merchandise and got people excited about the team again. No, it didn't work out the way everyone hoped...and yes, many people were oh, so smart to predict that Bledsoe wasn't the answer...but please don't portray that move as if it was part of Donaho'es three-year plan coming in. It wasn't, and any knowledgeable fan knows it. 378077[/snapback] I was - along with Simon and a few others. However getting Bledsoe also had a domino effect on other free agent signings (Spikes is the prime example), so in hindsight it wasn't a terrible move. SoCal ain't knowledgeable - at least in that he's proven time and time again that his hatred of Tom Donahoe is so great that it clouds his judgement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 I was - along with Simon and a few others. However getting Bledsoe also had a domino effect on other free agent signings (Spikes is the prime example), so in hindsight it wasn't a terrible move. SoCal ain't knowledgeable - at least in that he's proven time and time again that his hatred of Tom Donahoe is so great that it clouds his judgement. 378078[/snapback] To some extent I honestly don't care if it was a mistake of Billy Joe Hobert proportions. It was not a part of this three year plan, and to keep being critical of it in that vain is just silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 To some extent I honestly don't care if it was a mistake of Billy Joe Hobert proportions. It was not a part of this three year plan, and to keep being critical of it in that vain is just silly. 378079[/snapback] I understand what TD is trying to accomplish, what has worked and what hasn't worked. It is not an exact science. Fine. Quit feeding everyone the "butts in the seats" nonsense. I grew up in Buffalo, there is not a whole lot to do on Sundays in the winter, unless you ski. Take a guess what attendance would be if this team were in LA or Orange County. Right. And why would you care what attendance was, or how many shirts they sell. I don't give a damn. I show up one time a year to see a game and expect a good, consistent product on the field. Maybe a playoff appearance once in a while. If this is all about NFL style "Money Ball", which it may be, then I'll just spend more time in the water. The below teams have all had at least one playoff appearance since 2000. ================================== Oakland Denver Tennessee Baltimore Miami Indy Pittsburg New England New York Cleveland Kansas City San Diego Guess who's not on the list. =================================== Cinci Bungles Houston Texans (expansion team) Jacksonville Buffalo Given enough time, even the Jerry Jones' of the world figure it out every now and then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IDBillzFan Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 I understand what TD is trying to accomplish, what has worked and what hasn't worked. It is not an exact science. Fine. Quit feeding everyone the "butts in the seats" nonsense. I grew up in Buffalo, there is not a whole lot to do on Sundays in the winter, unless you ski. Take a guess what attendance would be if this team were in LA or Orange County. Right. And why would you care what attendance was, or how many shirts they sell. I don't give a damn. I show up one time a year to see a game and expect a good, consistent product on the field. Maybe a playoff appearance once in a while. If this is all about NFL style "Money Ball", which it may be, then I'll just spend more time in the water. The below teams have all had at least one playoff appearance since 2000. ================================== Oakland Denver Tennessee Baltimore Miami Indy Pittsburg New England New York Cleveland Kansas City San Diego Guess who's not on the list. =================================== Cinci Bungles Houston Texans (expansion team) Jacksonville Buffalo Given enough time, even the Jerry Jones' of the world figure it out every now and then. 378085[/snapback] The reason this line of thinking makes sense to you is because you're judging TD on one thing: winning or losing. And that works fine for the guy who goes to one game a year and expects to see a decent product. To me, though, that's a good way to judge a coach, but a lousy way to judge a GM because the GM's responsibilities go beyond just winning or losing. It also goes toward profitability and I'd be willing to bet at the end of the year when the accountant is sitting at OBD with his green visor and calculator, if the amount of money the team made exceeded a particular number, TD probably got a piece of it. Getting to the playoffs is likely the equivalent of what some people in sales would call "blue sky." In other words, "This is what I need you to do and if you do this, you'll get X number of dollars. However, if you do this AND we get to the playoffs, the payoff doubles...or triples. Blue sky, baby." The reason people like me don't agree with you is because you're convinced that your standard of successful accomplishment of a GM is the only one that matters. And it may...to you. But to those of us who dedicates every waking moment of the NFL season to being obsessed about the team from one week to the next, your judgement of TD is flawed to the point where I'd be willing to bet you wouldn't back off even if we did make the playoffs this year because the response would be "Great. Once in the last gzillion years. Real impressive." Can't help you with that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TigerJ Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 Some in the national media obviously expect a huge setback with Losman starting. I think a modest setback is possible, but I would be extremely disappointed if Buffalo picked higher than the middle of the first round. I will also be very disappointed if by the end of the season JP Losman doesn't look like a solid NFL starter. Obviously, i9f the Bills take that huge step backward and Gandy in particular stinks, then Marcus McNeill is something of a no brainer pick, but I'm more optimistic at this point than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadBuffaloDisease Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 The Bills picking 4th next year? I assume that means the Bills trade Clements for that pick. Otherwise it's a projection of biblical stupidity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nanker Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 The reason this line of thinking makes sense to you is because you're judging TD on one thing: winning or losing. And that works fine for the guy who goes to one game a year and expects to see a decent product. To me, though, that's a good way to judge a coach, but a lousy way to judge a GM because the GM's responsibilities go beyond just winning or losing. It also goes toward profitability and I'd be willing to bet at the end of the year when the accountant is sitting at OBD with his green visor and calculator, if the amount of money the team made exceeded a particular number, TD probably got a piece of it. Getting to the playoffs is likely the equivalent of what some people in sales would call "blue sky." In other words, "This is what I need you to do and if you do this, you'll get X number of dollars. However, if you do this AND we get to the playoffs, the payoff doubles...or triples. Blue sky, baby." The reason people like me don't agree with you is because you're convinced that your standard of successful accomplishment of a GM is the only one that matters. And it may...to you. But to those of us who dedicates every waking moment of the NFL season to being obsessed about the team from one week to the next, your judgement of TD is flawed to the point where I'd be willing to bet you wouldn't back off even if we did make the playoffs this year because the response would be "Great. Once in the last gzillion years. Real impressive." Can't help you with that. 378087[/snapback] Okay, I'll bite. If it isn't the Won/Lost record, then: What's your definition of success for a GM? Filling the seats with fannies? Free beer would do that. Getting out of "Cap Jail?" Hell, a full roster of FAs, Castoffs and Rookies would do that. Drafting "Blue Chip and HOF" potential players from the lower positions in the draft? JB was pretty good at that. Hiring a NFL caliber coaching staff? "Swing Batter! Swing! STRIKE ONE!" "Swing Batter! Swing!..." Having a three year plan to get into the playoffs that takes (now) five years to execute? Cajoling big name FAs to come to B'Lo to play for the "most knowledgeable fans in football - who by the way don't know enough to know that you don't do the WAVE when the Bills are on offense)?" Taking three years to figure out that the OL is the rockbed of success in the NFL? Well Vinky, vinky do! Maybe it's the number of All Pros on his hand-picked team. Maybe it's the number of cars parked in Hammer's lot. Tons of Zwiegle's hots sold on Sundays in WNY? Square yards of fabric sewn into replica jerseys? Maybe it's related to the nice-ness meter on the radio talk show calls on Sunday nigh. Yes, I for one will be glad to see Whitey with a permanent job-for-life and the Bills eternally out of the Playoffs as long as there's a good story to tell! For the record, I don't HATE TD. His initals are too good for that. But enough already! Let's get into the Playoffs fer Crimminy Sake! And LA, I'm not raggin on you personally. It's just a little too frustratin' to be spoon fed pablum from an organization that should have its act together a little more than it apparently has. Go Bills! And Go Titania! (Or, is that Tit-taina) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
finknottle Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 I find it hard to believe a knowledgeable fan would make a comment like this. Donahoe made an unexpected detour that put asses in seats, sold craploads of tickets and merchandise and got people excited about the team again. No, it didn't work out the way everyone hoped...and yes, many people were oh, so smart to predict that Bledsoe wasn't the answer...but please don't portray that move as if it was part of Donaho'es three-year plan coming in. It wasn't, and any knowledgeable fan knows it. 378077[/snapback] So putting asses in the seats, selling craploads of tickets and merchandise and getting people excited about the team again is a detour, and not part of his plan? Why would you hire a GM who didn't have a plan for marketing the team? Seems to me he might have told Ralph "Year One we gut the team and get a pass; year two we build through the draft, and capwise can afford a splashy move or two to put the asses back in the seats; year three we gell and win it all, baby!" in which case a Bledsoe-like move was part of the plan. If so, it's not necessarily a bad plan; just didn't work out in the long run like we hoped. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
swede316 Posted July 9, 2005 Share Posted July 9, 2005 He'll be gone long before we're picking at #32. I like your thought process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
San-O Posted July 10, 2005 Share Posted July 10, 2005 The reason this line of thinking makes sense to you is because you're judging TD on one thing: winning or losing. And that works fine for the guy who goes to one game a year and expects to see a decent product. To me, though, that's a good way to judge a coach, but a lousy way to judge a GM because the GM's responsibilities go beyond just winning or losing. It also goes toward profitability and I'd be willing to bet at the end of the year when the accountant is sitting at OBD with his green visor and calculator, if the amount of money the team made exceeded a particular number, TD probably got a piece of it. Getting to the playoffs is likely the equivalent of what some people in sales would call "blue sky." In other words, "This is what I need you to do and if you do this, you'll get X number of dollars. However, if you do this AND we get to the playoffs, the payoff doubles...or triples. Blue sky, baby." The reason people like me don't agree with you is because you're convinced that your standard of successful accomplishment of a GM is the only one that matters. And it may...to you. But to those of us who dedicates every waking moment of the NFL season to being obsessed about the team from one week to the next, your judgement of TD is flawed to the point where I'd be willing to bet you wouldn't back off even if we did make the playoffs this year because the response would be "Great. Once in the last gzillion years. Real impressive." Can't help you with that. 378087[/snapback] Nice post. I understand where you are coming from. First thing, I travel from SoCal to see a game once a year, but obviously I have a deep interest and do follow them year round. TD has done a good job overall with the team: ++ Attendance + Cap Hell (we may start to see issues around the corner, remains t/b seen) ++ Marketing ++ Generating interest ? Rebuilding (record does not indicate much progress over J.B and Wade years) -+ Coachs (Even like the MM hire) (Hosed the GW pick and allowed GW to hire a bunch of clowns: Grey excluded) ? Scouting ? The Draft + Trades (really liked the P.P. move) - Record (not yet, and this year probably 8-8 with new QB) John Bulter (R.I.P.), was definitely the benefactor of B. Polian's scouting department and also spent team into cap hell, which he also seemed top have done in San Diego. I think the scouting department pre-TD was considered one of the best in the league by accounts that I recall. Would like to see a playoff appearance and a winner some time soon. How's that? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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