RkFast Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 How are you doing today? 9/12 was pretty rough for me, as I recall. One thing that impressed the hell out of me this morning was hearing all the "man on the street" interviews from the financial district this morning, and hearing the rather overwhelming consensus from Londoners that "Yeah, it's hell...but you have to keep living your life or else the bastards win." I compare that to the typical American "We're all victims, let's wallow in it." reaction over here, and I wonder how England ever lost their empire...or how we'll ever keep ours. You Brits handle this a lot more maturely than my country of retards does... 377602[/snapback] I compare this to the final flight of Concorde. In the UK, it was treated as a marvel and celebration by just about everyone. Even the folks who endured the worst of it, such as those living close to Heathrow said they would "miss it". Here? It was looked down upon, spat at, and told "good riddance". There were even protests (!!) on the day of its final flight, as if to say "...and STAY out". So typical. I always say...we, here could learn a lot about "living" by our friends across the Pond.
Britbillsfan Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 How are you doing today? 9/12 was pretty rough for me, as I recall. One thing that impressed the hell out of me this morning was hearing all the "man on the street" interviews from the financial district this morning, and hearing the rather overwhelming consensus from Londoners that "Yeah, it's hell...but you have to keep living your life or else the bastards win." I compare that to the typical American "We're all victims, let's wallow in it." reaction over here, and I wonder how England ever lost their empire...or how we'll ever keep ours. You Brits handle this a lot more maturely than my country of retards does... 377602[/snapback] For myself, hardly affected at all in real terms (other than some transport issues caused by the false alarm here in Swindon). No one I know personally is dead or hurt in this, as far as I aware, although it is heartbreaking hearing the desperate families trying to get hold of missing sons/daughters/partners, similar to the poor folks who were desperate to find their loved ones in 9/11. Emotionally, I would really like to have a chance to personally deal with those responsible and am seething inside with anger, but I trust the security services to track down these scum and deal with them appropriately. As far as 'taking it on the chin' is concerned, experience of this sort of thing is pretty deeply ingrained on the British, especially London. 'We' have been bombed before, fully expect it to happen again, and we are too stubborn to let it get to us as a nation that much. Experience is a wonderful thing when dealing with the nasty surprises that come up in life, mind you we would certainly prefer not to have had the experiences in the first place. Additionally you Americans tend to be far more optimistic people than us Brits, so tend to do better if things are more or less normal, that is a strength as a people we admire, we are far more pessimistic and half expect something bad to happen, so are probably better able to cope than you guys, IMO, when it does. The end of the Empire came about for several reasons. Not least of which was the realisation that since we had just fought a nasty war against a foreign tyrant to preserve our freedom to then go to the colonies looking for their own freedom and say 'tough' would be a little too much, especially as far as 'the man in the street' was concerned (elements did resist it, but WWII ended the DESIRE for empire). The fact that nationalist figures were appearing in many colonies then it was pretty obvious the Empire could not continue. There were other reasons, but I do not really want to go into a FFS sized post - this one is probably too long as it is.
Britbillsfan Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 I compare this to the final flight of Concorde. In the UK, it was treated as a marvel and celebration by just about everyone. Even the folks who endured the worst of it, such as those living close to Heathrow said they would "miss it". Here? It was looked down upon, spat at, and told "good riddance". There were even protests (!!) on the day of its final flight, as if to say "...and STAY out". So typical. I always say...we, here could learn a lot about "living" by our friends across the Pond. 377623[/snapback] Loved that old bird, noisy as she was. Used to fly directly over my parents place, as a kid always looked up to watch her as she passed. A beautiful plane and I do miss her.
Pete Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 How are you doing today? 9/12 was pretty rough for me, as I recall. One thing that impressed the hell out of me this morning was hearing all the "man on the street" interviews from the financial district this morning, and hearing the rather overwhelming consensus from Londoners that "Yeah, it's hell...but you have to keep living your life or else the bastards win." I compare that to the typical American "We're all victims, let's wallow in it." reaction over here, and I wonder how England ever lost their empire...or how we'll ever keep ours. You Brits handle this a lot more maturely than my country of retards does... 377602[/snapback] watch the documentary "Whats Wrong With This Picture?" by Jason Kessler to see how noble and bravely New Yorkers reacted to 9/11. It is the most amazing documentary I have ever seen and it makes me damn proud to be an American. New Yorkers are incredible people and incredibly resilient. Witness the blackout last summer. Maybe you have retards in your neighborhood but not in my mine
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 Maybe you have retards in your neighborhood but not in my mine 377699[/snapback] But you're in your neighborhood, aren't you?
Alaska Darin Posted July 8, 2005 Posted July 8, 2005 I always say...we, here could learn a lot about "living" by our friends across the Pond. 377623[/snapback] And they from us. It's not a one way street.
Bill from NYC Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 I feel your frustration but where do we drop this big bomb folks keep talking about that will get the terrorists? FYI, terrorist aren't doing this because they want our money. They are doing it because of our presence in the middle east. 377260[/snapback] Sorry Coach, but I don't believe this any more than I believe Hitler propaganda.
Alaska Darin Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Sorry Coach, but I don't believe this any more than I believe Hitler propaganda. 377818[/snapback] Me neither.
erynthered Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Me neither. 377823[/snapback] Yup, mark me down for another.
VABills Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Sorry Coach, but I don't believe this any more than I believe Hitler propaganda. 377818[/snapback] It's always about power and money. He who controls the oil has both. These radicals want it and they know they have no chance of overthrowing the regimes in power if they have western backing. They still may not be able but there is no chance as is.
Jon in Pasadena Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Sorry if it's already been discussed but I found this article rather interesting, considering recent events. Check the date.
Bill from NYC Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 For all we know the perpertrators may not even have been from the middle east. I think it was north Africans that were responsible for the train bombings in Spain. Also, I would be wary of blanket statements about "Islamics". There is a sizeable muslim population in London and there are bound to be muslims among the dead and injured. 377266[/snapback] First of all chicot, I am sincerely glad that you are OK. I will try to be as clear as I can.... Although both of our great countries have far too many weak kneed, apologetic liberals, I sincerely believe that at some point these pansy asses will be drowned out by people who are sick and tired of watching their families, friends, neighbors and co-workers killed by Islamic Fundamentalists. KRC understood me correctly (thank you very much). I truly believe that many "law abiding" muslims were successfully brainwashed into thinking that US Imperialism and Jews are the cause of their various woes and secretly (and sometimes openly) celebrate the death of our loved ones. I predict that some day, great nations like ours will have little choice other than to inflict true and massive harm to countries that sympathize with these murderers, and I am not talking of the firecrackers which we dropped on Iraq. Perhaps it will take this for "law abiding Islamics" to step up and stop funding and supporting terrorist scum. It could forcibly create a need for them to fight this scum, as we ourselves must. Make no mistake, apologists or not, we are NOT going to lose to these evil killers. On another note, I want to give a HUGE shoutout to the uniformed London Police Officer who thought to commandeer a bus, empty it out, fill it with injured civilians, steer it to a hospital, and save lives. This was a brave, quick thinking hero, and this is a story that I will forever cherish. This great man, for a small salary, will live forever with the memory of carnage, death and suffering. He has my respect, affection, sympathy and admiration. This man is a hero to the entire civilized world.
Nanker Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Sorry if it's already been discussed but I found this article rather interesting, considering recent events. Check the date. 377840[/snapback] The Islamo-fascists hate non-believers. They hate us now, they have hated us since their inception and will continue to hate us forever. They want all Jews dead (just like Herr Hitler did). They want all Christians, Hindus, Buddhists, Atheists and Scientologists dead. DEAD. DEAD. DEAD. Maybe the Saudi Royal family--who are mostly responsible for propagating this Aids-like social disease that is militant Islam--can be made to reign it in if dozens of car bombs begin mysteriously going off in Mecca, Medina and Riyhad. Maybe it'll take the fertilizer bombings of a handful of mosques and the assasination of the top 50 millitant mullahs to make them start thinking outside the mosque. Perhaps, but we'll never know. These extremists are intent on conquering the world and establishing one world religion.
RkFast Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Once again, I challenge the notion that that only a very small group of Muslim "extremists" harbor such strong hatred. The ill feelings towards the West and sympathy for the Islamfascists runs much deeper in the Muslim Community than many would like to believe. http://www.newsday.com/news/nationworld/wo...dnews-headlines Here is another article with "outrage" by the Muslim community. But as usual, has the "yeah, but America is worse" part thrown in and what I like to call the "sympathetic to their (extremists) cause" clause. Notice the typical "conspiracy" stuff, too. Some quotes from the article.... Across the city and country, many of England's 1.6 million Muslims expressed outrage during Friday's prayers over the bomb attacks the day before, noting that Islam teaches peace. At the same time, many Muslims wondered whether the obscure al-Qaida offshoot that claimed responsibility had really carried out the bombings. "Maybe the French did it because they didn't get the [2012] Olympics and England did," said Aftab Ahmad, 27, a waiter who attended the Central Mosque prayer service. "Why do they always say Muslims do attacks like this?" "You can blame Tony Blair and George Bush, too, and all the leaders who are making Muslims angry by fighting in Iraq," said another worshiper, Libyan-born chef Mohamad Ahmad, 29. Some Muslims thought it was possible that al-Qaida followers might have committed the bombings. But few thought that would jeopardize the popularity of the group's leader, Osama bin Laden. "A fair number of Muslims have an inveterate passion for Osama because he upholds Islamic beliefs and stands up to the West," said Adanak Malik, 35, a filmmaker who said he was "indifferent" to Bin Laden. "Even Muslims who condemn violence can relate to that."
Ghost of BiB Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 I spent some time on the FBIS yesterday, reading foreign news articles. There was a lot of Muslim condemnation of the attacks. Unfortunately, many of them read along the lines of "We condemn these attacks - but..." You either agree with the bombers, or you don't. Caveating sympathy is worse than having none.
blzrul Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 I spent some time on the FBIS yesterday, reading foreign news articles. There was a lot of Muslim condemnation of the attacks. Unfortunately, many of them read along the lines of "We condemn these attacks - but..." You either agree with the bombers, or you don't. Caveating sympathy is worse than having none. 377981[/snapback] If "enough is enough" isn't enough well...I don't know what people expect. Should they riot in the streets, thereby perpetuating the feeling that they're savages? link There are tons of Muslims in Europe, it's spreading. If they were all as some people think we are indeed in big trouble. I guess seeing what the Roman Catholics did in their heydey we should be afraid... Religion is so dumb. God is great, but man's interpretation of His will and worship is just pure silly. Scratch that and we'd get on a lot better.
Adam Posted July 9, 2005 Posted July 9, 2005 Perhaps if we back away from what makes them mad they'll stop attacking us......OR they'll find something else to be mad about and we'll have to back away from that and then they'll stop attacking us......OR they'll find something else to be mad about and we'll have to back away from that and then they'll stop attacking us........OR they'll finally just come out and say that they hate us because we are not governed by the laws of Radical Islam. 376453[/snapback] You are correct- making nice with terrorists will not stop them. They are not retaliating, they are trying to exterminate. We must exterminate them first- this is not a political game, and innocent lives will be lost- its a cruel fact of war
chicot Posted July 10, 2005 Posted July 10, 2005 First of all chicot, I am sincerely glad that you are OK. I will try to be as clear as I can.... Although both of our great countries have far too many weak kneed, apologetic liberals, I sincerely believe that at some point these pansy asses will be drowned out by people who are sick and tired of watching their families, friends, neighbors and co-workers killed by Islamic Fundamentalists. KRC understood me correctly (thank you very much). I truly believe that many "law abiding" muslims were successfully brainwashed into thinking that US Imperialism and Jews are the cause of their various woes and secretly (and sometimes openly) celebrate the death of our loved ones. I predict that some day, great nations like ours will have little choice other than to inflict true and massive harm to countries that sympathize with these murderers, and I am not talking of the firecrackers which we dropped on Iraq. Perhaps it will take this for "law abiding Islamics" to step up and stop funding and supporting terrorist scum. It could forcibly create a need for them to fight this scum, as we ourselves must. Make no mistake, apologists or not, we are NOT going to lose to these evil killers. On another note, I want to give a HUGE shoutout to the uniformed London Police Officer who thought to commandeer a bus, empty it out, fill it with injured civilians, steer it to a hospital, and save lives. This was a brave, quick thinking hero, and this is a story that I will forever cherish. This great man, for a small salary, will live forever with the memory of carnage, death and suffering. He has my respect, affection, sympathy and admiration. This man is a hero to the entire civilized world. 377841[/snapback] Thanks Bill. I live in Liverpool so I was relatively unaffected by the bombings. The only way I can see that bombing countries can be justified or logical is if there is a direct link between the government of a country and a terrorist act. Otherwise, who do you bomb? What if the London bombers turn out to be North African? Do you bomb Morocco? Tunisia? What if they turn out to be British born (which seems to be the current theory of the police)? Do you bomb the country their father was born in? The country of their grandfather? Do you bomb London? Why not have vigilantes beating up muslims on the streets of London? After all the terrorists came from their community and they didn't do enough to stop them and beating up people is a lot less severe than dropping bombs on their heads. Should we have bombed Dublin during the height of the IRA bombing campaign? There were plenty of the Irish who sympathized with them (in fact, plenty of Americans too). Perhaps Britain should have bombed Noraid fund raisers in the US - there's plenty of evidence that money from them went directly to the IRA. However, there is a more fundamental reason why this policy should be avoided. Targetting civilians is wrong. It is wrong when terrorists do it, it is wrong when we do it. It is wrong no matter what the cause or justification. If we adopt the methods of the terrorists then we are little better than they are. The only excuse we would have is the old playground retort "well, he started it".
SilverNRed Posted July 10, 2005 Posted July 10, 2005 I spent some time on the FBIS yesterday, reading foreign news articles. There was a lot of Muslim condemnation of the attacks. Unfortunately, many of them read along the lines of "We condemn these attacks - but..." You either agree with the bombers, or you don't. Caveating sympathy is worse than having none. 377981[/snapback] There's your problem right there.....
RkFast Posted July 10, 2005 Posted July 10, 2005 However, there is a more fundamental reason why this policy should be avoided. Targetting civilians is wrong. It is wrong when terrorists do it, it is wrong when we do it. It is wrong no matter what the cause or justification. If we adopt the methods of the terrorists then we are little better than they are. The only excuse we would have is the old playground retort "well, he started it". 378311[/snapback] Name one....ONE time in post Vietnam warfare where civilians were targeted by "us".
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