Elijah Moore Visiting the Bills today

[White Linen]

2 minutes ago, Billy Claude said:

 

 

61 receptions on 102 targets (59.8% reception rate) and you can't argue the low catch percentage was because he was going deep since he only got 538 yards for 8.8 ypc. 

 

 

 

How would low catch percentage tell you he wasn't going deep, because of the yards and ypc?  I'm sure there's advanced stata but I don't think that's the indicator.

 

Without looking anything up, couldn't low catch rate and low YPC, also be aligned with bad QB play?

[NickelCity]

EFF FIVE

[Bruffalo]

47 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

You’d have to be an idiot not to try to resurrect your career with Josh Allen. 

 

For real, it should be an easy decision for someone as young as Moore. Sign a two year deal, get inflated stats because Allen's gonna Allen, go off and sign/fleece another team with a Gabe Davis level contract.

 

I like Moore a lot in the draft process, so I don't see much reason not to. He's got great upside. 

Edited yesterday at 09:04 PM by Bruffalo

[Warriorspikes51]

he’s shown he can win downfield when used that way.

[TBBills Fan]

41 minutes ago, Cash said:

 

Me.

I guess that settles it then

[Billy Claude]

14 minutes ago, White Linen said:

 

How would low catch percentage tell you he wasn't going deep, because of the yards and ypc?  I'm sure there's advanced stata but I don't think that's the indicator.

 

Without looking anything up, couldn't low catch rate and low YPC, also be aligned with bad QB play?

 

Maybe, but Moore was 4th in yards per catch among Brown receivers with at least 20 receptions last season (Jeudy 13.7, Tillman 11.7, and Cooper (CLE only) 10.4).  He was even behind one of their tight ends, Jordan Atkins at 9.4.  If Moore was going deep he wasn't catching very many of them.

 

Plus there's still the issue that he's an entitled primadonna like Diggs without the production to justify it.

 

[BillsFanForever19]

28 minutes ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Moore is available because he was one of the worst regular WR in the league last year.    He never developed past mediocre and then last year he was a bad thing waiting to happen when thrown the ball.    A 44 passer rating?   I didn't even know that was possible.   MVS was much more likely to hit and he was clearly washed.

 

But when Tyrell Shavers is your WR5 you can't do worse with anyone who got any volume of regular snaps at boundary WR last year.     

 

I didn't know about the passer rating. And I certainly don't claim to be an Elijah Moore expert. But how much of that is on him and how much of that is on the QB's in Cleveland last year?

 

I just see a guy who's got 4.35 speed, just turned 25 years old, and averages 541 yards a season (538 last season). And a guy who's never had a good QB, after spending '21 and '22 with the Jets and '23 and '24 with the Browns.

 

Though I respect your assessment. But like you said, if the option is Shavers or a guy who has produced and has blazing speed - I'd take him to at least see if he works out on Camp. If for nothing else to have someone who could stretch the field.

[transient]

21 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

 

For real, it should be an easy decision for someone as young as Moore. Sign a two year deal, get inflated stats because Allen's gonna Allen, go off and sign and fleece another team with a Gabe Davis level contract.

 

I like Moore a lot in the draft process, so I don't see much downside here. He's got great upside. 

...there is the little matter of "Everybody eats". It's not like he'd be a featured piece of the offense, just another mouth to feed.

[The Firebaugh Kid]

23 minutes ago, Bruffalo said:

 

For real, it should be an easy decision for someone as young as Moore. Sign a two year deal, get inflated stats because Allen's gonna Allen, go off and sign and fleece another team with a Gabe Davis level contract.

 

I like Moore a lot in the draft process, so I don't see much downside here. He's got great upside. 

I wanted that boy since the draft that year also. He has real talent. This is a perfect place for him. 

[Bruffalo]

4 minutes ago, transient said:

...there is the little matter of "Everybody eats". It's not like he'd be a featured piece of the offense, just another mouth to feed.

If Moore ends up with the Bills he will likely have a career year. I'd bet on it if I wasn't morally against that kind of thing. 

Edited yesterday at 09:04 PM by Bruffalo

[BADOLBILZ]

3 minutes ago, BillsFanForever19 said:

 

I didn't know about the passer rating. And I certainly don't claim to be an Elijah Moore expert. But how much of that is on him and how much of that is on the QB's in Cleveland last year?

 

I just see a guy who's got 4.35 speed, just turned 25 years old, and averages 541 yards a season (538 last season). And a guy who's never had a good QB, after spending '21 and '22 with the Jets and '23 and '24 with the Browns.

 

Though I respect your assessment. But like you said, if the option is Shavers or a guy who has produced and has blazing speed - I'd take him to at least see if he works out on Camp. If for nothing else to have someone who could stretch the field.

 

 

I think you have to experience him over the course of time to see why he sucks.    I'd sum it up that he's a very small target......you have to put it right on him..... with no contested catch ability and no YAC ability.    Not what you expect from a 4.35 guy.   Having Jameis as your QB will hurt your passer rating (8 interceptions were Moore targets last year) but he's never been a positive passer rating guy.  

[Goin Breakdown]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

It's cool only if he's is proven right. 

 

The closest thing he's had to hits at WR since he took over the Bills war room 7 drafts ago are Shakir and Davis.   Who have accounted for just 2 seasons of over 800 yards in their combined 7 with Buffalo.

 

That's not cool.  

 

The last time there was such justified angst about him not acquiring WR talent was the 2019 draft when he just kept passing on WR in favor of guys like Cody Ford and Devin Singletary.    AJ Brown and DK Metcalf went after Ford.   Terry McLaurin went right after Singlecontract.   Deebo Samuel went 2 picks before Cody Ford.

 

For such a bad WR draft it produced some of the biggest playmakers in the game at WR.  

 

And Beane missed entirely.  

 

Which then lead to having to build a  top 3 WR corps of free agents and a high priced veteran who required a 1st round pick to acquire.

 

Even a Darius Slayton from that 2019 "bad" WR draft would be valuable on this deep threat bereft roster.   

You're right. I heard a caller today break down some stats about Beane's  average WR draft value and it was basically the fifth round. There is something up. He's said stuff like "football Isn't a track meet" and now he's comparing wanting a WR to football not being fantasy football as if anyone who wants simply to be better is doing it for selfish and mindless fantasy sports. Kind of condescending towards his own fam base. 

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, BADOLBILZ said:

 

 

Moore is available because he was one of the worst regular WR in the league last year.    He never developed past mediocre and then last year he was a bad thing waiting to happen when thrown the ball.    A 44 passer rating?   I didn't even know that was possible.   MVS was much more likely to hit and he was clearly washed.

 

But when Tyrell Shavers is your WR5 you can't do worse with anyone who got any volume of regular snaps at boundary WR last year.     

42.4 according to PFF, and for a fast guy with some quicks, he was 94th out of 98 receivers in YAC. https://www.pff.com/nfl/players/elijah-moore/84302

[jkeerie]

2 hours ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Exactly. There's no way that I'd believe that Beane got on the horn and got on Moore in house that fast. This is what makes it even more odd that he crashed out on them. He was already doing what they were actually talking about. In essence he agreed with them that they need a little more help. Why not just say that ya know?  I don't believe Beane had placed much value in the WR class this year. That's cool. 

I think the reason Beane "crashed out" was that Beane explained the draft in his post draft presser.  He said that had there been a WR at a position of value as opposed to those players he drafted in rounds 4 thru 7 he would have grabbed one.  There wasn't.  So...he hears the radio guys griping about him not drafting a WR and accusing him of devaluing the position, and he defended himself.  These same radio guys thought he drafted the wrong Josh and griped about that in 2018.  So he started out with a trip down memory lane.  He's built a winning roster.  He realized that in each instance for not advancing to the Super Bowl, it was the defense that let the team down, not the lack of a WR.  First off...why can't we give Beane the benefit of the doubt?  Secondly, do your homework and listen to the pressers and the way he already addressed the questions beforehand.  

 

BTW, they talked about the radio interview on NFL Live and as much as they would have liked the Bills to add speed at WR (Mina Kimes especially), by and large they could not argue with Beane's approach to the draft noting the defensive woes during the playoffs.

Edited yesterday at 09:17 PM by jkeerie

[Bleeding Bills Blue]

42 minutes ago, Billy Claude said:

 

 

61 receptions on 102 targets (59.8% reception rate) and you can't argue the low catch percentage was because he was going deep since he only got 538 yards for 8.8 ypc. 

 

 

 

Umm... the Browns had a team comp% below 60.  

[Goin Breakdown]

3 minutes ago, jkeerie said:

I think the reason Beane "crashed out" was that Beane explained the draft in his post draft presser.  He said that had there been a WR at a position of value as opposed to those players he drafted in rounds 4 thru 7 he would have grabbed one.  There wasn't.  So...he hears the radio guys griping about him not drafting a WR and accusing him of devaluing the position, and he defended himself.  These same radio guys thought he drafted the wrong Josh and griped about that in 2018.  So he started out with a trip down memory lane.  He's built a winning roster.  He realized that in each instance for not advancing to the Super Bowl, it was the defense that let the team down, not the lack of a WR.  First off...why can't we give Beane the benefit of the doubt?  Secondly, do your homework and listen to the pressers and the way he already addressed the questions beforehand.  

 

BTW, they talked about the radio interview on NFL Live and as much as they would have liked the Bills to add speed at WR (Mina Kimes especially), by and large they could not argue with Beane's approach to the draft noting the defensive woes during the playoffs.

Yep. I actually have no issues with the draft. defense has been an issue for sure. With this topic, I can see both sides for sure. I really don't think there is a clear right or wrong. Just 2 ideas. 
 

I hope they hit on a couple of these pics for sure. We've had a few top defenses under McD and still failed to get to the superbowl. I have hope though. 
 

as soon as I said "crash out" I regretted it. My bad. I work with kids all day long haha

[Senth]

let him compete.

[jkeerie]

16 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Yep. I actually have no issues with the draft. defense has been an issue for sure. With this topic, I can see both sides for sure. I really don't think there is a clear right or wrong. Just 2 ideas. 
 

I hope they hit on a couple of these pics for sure. We've had a few top defenses under McD and still failed to get to the superbowl. I have hope though. 
 

as soon as I said "crash out" I regretted it. My bad. I work with kids all day long haha

"Crash Out" is mild compared to some takes I've seen posted.   Buffalo Rumblings headline included "expletive-laden."

 

 

[BobbyC81]

8 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

And watch.  If we sign this guy, the exact same people moaning about not doing anything with the WR room and not getting a guy with speed will turn around and say this isn’t the guy.

He isn’t.  He’s another slot receiver that is basically Curtis Samuel 2.0.  He’s not a deep threat.  I know Samuel had to work thru injuries but even when he played, he wasn’t impressive and I wondered if Brady knew how best to use him.   Why would one expect it to be any different with Moore?

[No_Matter_What]

4 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

And to be clear I am not hating on the draft. The most important part of the draft is the premium picks the first two days and I think Beane did as good a job with them as he has since 2018.

 

I am a bit more ciritical of his approach to the vet market in terms of FA and trades but I have no doubt the Bills will win the division and win a playoff game or two as long as Josh is healthy. My worry is that we will end up facing KC having the ball at the end, for a 3rd year in a row and not be able to get it done. And I am less persuaded that just upgrading the defense is the answer there. That isn't how the Bills - Chiefs games are. It won't matter whether we play a 32-29 game or a 20-17 game. The result will come down to the final 3 minutes and I think all of us would rather in that situation the ball be in Josh's hand than in Pat's. And then we gotta make the critical plays. Do we yet have the guys to do it?

I agree that this was and remains a problem, but I just did not see a realistic way how to fix it this off-season. There were two options maybe, trade for DK Metcalf who I am not sure I would be willing to pay and maybe trade up for Golden which would cost quite a lot (and just like with BTJ, we have no idea if there was a trade partner).

 

Drafting a WR in the 4th or later round was extremely unlikely to help us in this department.

 

If anything, fixing defense at least gives us a chance for the game with Chiefs to be different. And it seems that Beane did everything he could in this draft to try it.