What Does "Due Process" Mean?

[All_Pro_Bills]

2 minutes ago, Niagara Bill said:

Yes we do...pressure has formed to stop the nonsense. This comes from the same pressure that forced Trudeau out...thank goodness, but Canada will do it without destroying our form of government.

Immigration, was out of control. America and Canada must ask itself...why is immigration..legal immigration...is coming from Muslim based countries than the areas of the world that Ellis Island was famous for. Are there no Euros wanting to come here.

The illegal stuff, is easy to see why. 

 

The Liberals in the U.S. and Canada don't want to let in any white Christians into the country that have the capacity of assimilating into the main culture. They want multi-cultural chaos.

[Roundybout]

4 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

I'm not against letting him out of prison but he shouldn't be allowed to comes back to the US.

Too bad. SCOTUS made its ruling. Follow the laws of the nation. 

Just now, All_Pro_Bills said:

The Liberals in the U.S. and Canada don't want to let in any white Christians into the country that have the capacity of assimilating into the main culture. They want multi-cultural chaos.

Ah there it is. The racism finally came out.

[mjt328]

11 hours ago, Roundybout said:

Gee, maybe it's because the prison he was sent to has a 0% rate of people getting out?

 

He was not illegal. He had withholding of removal status, granted by a U.S. immigration judge in 2019, after the judge ruled that deporting him to El Salvador could violate international law due to the real risk of persecution. He also very likely had a pending green card application through his U.S. citizen wife, and was legally residing and working in Maryland at the time of his removal. This was not a gray area. He had a lawful right to be in the U.S., and deporting him violated a standing federal order.

 

You and the rest of the MAGAs are going to face consequences for supporting this. Not sure if it's in this life or the next, but your actions have gone beyond vindictive to straight-up evil. 

 

He broke into this country illegally.

Then due to the insane loopholes in our immigration system, he was granted the legal right to stay in the U.S. for the last 5-6 years.

 

We can argue back and forth about the technical terminology.  But either way, he was not a citizen of the United States. 

Whether a person is on a student visa, work visa, or granted any kind of temporary status by a district judge - that privilege can be revoked.

 

The Alien Enemies Act has historically allowed the President to remove illegal immigrants for any reason, and without any kind of due process.

Meaning that when Trump's administration deported Garcia, they had every right to do so by precedent, regardless of what a federal judge says.

At the same time, the judge had no jurisdiction to order a plane to turn-around after it's already left the United States.

 

Now, this is how Supreme Court cases always work when there is a dispute over the law:

- Party A does something

- Party B says "no you can't do that"

- Party A says "yes I can"

Then the Supreme Court makes a ruling on which side is correct. 

 

In this particular case, the Supreme Court ruled that Trump absolutely can use the Alien Enemies Act to deport individuals like Garcia.  However, he should have gone through some kind of process hearing before deportation.  Kind of a win/lose for both sides.  To be clear, this is a slight change from the way the immigration procedure has been interpreted in the past regarding (particularly regarding the Alien Enemies Act).  So you can't just go back and retroactively accuse the administration of defying what is really a new Supreme Court ruling.

 

Furthermore, Garcia is now in the custody of El Salvador.  He is also a citizen of that country.  The idea that the United States Supreme Court can just order the President to retrieve a foreign citizen from another country's prison is absolutely preposterous.  We can't even do that with American citizens being held as hostages.

 

And finally, I think it's disgusting that people can't discuss things like this on an Internet message board without getting threats.  Once upon a time it was OK that people disagreed on issues.  At the end of the day, we could just voice our opinions and be civil.  Now everyone on the other side has to be seen as evil, and deserving of "consequences."  

[Andy1]

5 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

The Liberals in the U.S. and Canada don't want to let in any white Christians into the country that have the capacity of assimilating into the main culture. They want multi-cultural chaos.

What are you talking about? References? America has been multicultural since the beginning. If you don’t like it, there are plenty of “pure” options to move to. And as a reminder, the vast majority of immigrants from Mexico south are Christian. 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

31 minutes ago, Trump_is_Mentally_fit said:

You agree the administration is in violation of the law and due process. 

It’s certainly possible.  
 

I think the Admin should follow the SC directive to the letter. At the same time, we have to recognize that El Salvador is a sovereign nation and may have their own way of handling this matter. 

[Roundybout]

20 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

 

 

 

Furthermore, Garcia is now in the custody of El Salvador.  He is also a citizen of that country.  The idea that the United States Supreme Court can just order the President to retrieve a foreign citizen from another country's prison is absolutely preposterous.  We can't even do that with American citizens being held as hostages.

 

 

Nonsense. As Bukele even said, we have a contract to send people to his gulag. It then follows we can have him removed back to the US for a proper hearing and trial. 

 

You guys keep deflecting from the main issue - Trump is ignoring the Supreme Court. 

22 minutes ago, mjt328 said:

And finally, I think it's disgusting that people can't discuss things like this on an Internet message board without getting threats.  Once upon a time it was OK that people disagreed on issues.  At the end of the day, we could just voice our opinions and be civil.  Now everyone on the other side has to be seen as evil, and deserving of "consequences."  

 

This isn't a disagreement, this is people rubbing their hands and cheering gleefully that Trump, in defiance of SCOTUS, single-handedly sent a man to his death without any kind of trial, process, or hearing. 

 

It's evil. Plain and simple. 

[AlBUNDY4TDS]

1 minute ago, Roundybout said:

 

Nonsense. As Bukele even said, we have a contract to send people to his gulag. It then follows we can have him removed back to the US for a proper hearing and trial. 

 

You guys keep deflecting from the main issue - Trump is ignoring the Supreme Court. 

 

This isn't a disagreement, this is people rubbing their hands and cheering gleefully that Trump, in defiance of SCOTUS, single-handedly sent a man to his death without any kind of trial, process, or hearing. 

 

It's evil. Plain and simple. 

Did u feel this way regarding Biden and student loan forgiveness? No end of story. Your all up in arms because orange man bad. 

[LeviF]

The Biden admin handed out asylum, parole, SSNs, and work auths like they were candy, knowing full well that it would be logistically impossible to give them all some kind of day in court prior to removal. The admin then surrendered the fate of these people to the whims of the "We're Going to Deport Them All" party by losing an election. 

 

Btw, deporting them all to a 3rd world supermax is the moderate-left option.

[Niagara Bill]

24 minutes ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

The Liberals in the U.S. and Canada don't want to let in any white Christians into the country that have the capacity of assimilating into the main culture. They want multi-cultural chaos.

I think you have misunderstood Canada. While you have in general hit the mark, we are more complicated wiyh English/French and perhaps surprisingly to you, less tolerant towards Muslim religion, more concerned about cultural change. Trudeau is gone and forced out due to 1. Immigration from Muslim countries in particular and 2. over spending. 

Unfortunately, the chaos in the US, trump destruction of 150 years of friendship and trust is pushing people away from conservative views. Canada dies not want or need a revolution. 

You know, in the Reagan, Clinton era, the joining of 2 countries would have been possible. Today Canada hated Trudeau, but  distrust trump more than even Trudeau. When our election occurs this month, regardless of the winner, Canada will likely head to Europe, Asia, China, India for trade, even South America. Trade opportunities gave already begun. Canada will cut our trade with US by 50%. Oil is already heading to China, LNG is heading to Europe effective June. 

Even a trade deal will not change that, we already have a deal that Trump ignored.

[Trump_is_Mentally_fit]

43 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

It’s certainly possible.  
 

I think the Admin should follow the SC directive to the letter. At the same time, we have to recognize that El Salvador is a sovereign nation and may have their own way of handling this matter. 

Do you think the President and his minions should be held accountable for shipping this man to that hell hole?

 

 

[Roundybout]

34 minutes ago, AlBUNDY4TDS said:

Did u feel this way regarding Biden and student loan forgiveness? No end of story. Your all up in arms because orange man bad. 

If you still think it’s “orange man bad” you’re even more out of touch than previously thought. 
 

I also don’t know why you guys keep spamming “but muh student loans” because Biden changed his plan after SCOTUS shut it down. 

33 minutes ago, LeviF said:

The Biden admin handed out asylum, parole, SSNs, and work auths like they were candy, knowing full well that it would be logistically impossible to give them all some kind of day in court prior to removal. The admin then surrendered the fate of these people to the whims of the "We're Going to Deport Them All" party by losing an election. 

 

Btw, deporting them all to a 3rd world supermax is the moderate-left option.

 

 

 

In what universe is that the “moderate left” option

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

14 minutes ago, Trump_is_Mentally_fit said:

Do you think the President and his minions should be held accountable for shipping this man to that hell hole?

 

 

Minions is your characterization, not mine.  I’ll move past that for the sake of efficiency. 
 

I think the point of the SC is accountability (even when the decisions go against my preferred agenda, unlike most liberals).  I also think significant legal questions exist as it relates to “facilitate” and the SC ruling on the judge potentially exceeding her authority.  
 

Sounds to me like the system is working. 

[4th&long]

10 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

Minions is your characterization, not mine.  I’ll move past that for the sake of efficiency. 
 

I think the point of the SC is accountability (even when the decisions go against my preferred agenda, unlike most liberals).  I also think significant legal questions exist as it relates to “facilitate” and the SC ruling on the judge potentially exceeding her authority.  
 

Sounds to me like the system is working. 

That's begat you are an idiot. 

[Big Blitz]

 

See, this is a slippery slope.  
 

 

Ban just the scary guns….
 

Making you bake the cake, they just want to love…..

 

Absolutely no slippery slope in those scenarios.  

[Trump_is_Mentally_fit]

53 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said:

 

 

Sounds to me like the system is working. 

They sent a person to a death camp. 

 

MAGA's true colors, I just hope everyone realizes this is how you people think 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

30 minutes ago, 4th&long said:

That's begat you are an idiot. 

 

4th's list of fave "Begat" songs:

 

"Begat of You" by Kelly Clarkson

"Begat" by the Beatles

"Begat the Night" by 10,000 Maniacs

"Begat you Loved Me" by Celine Dion

 

 

 

 

[LeviF]

1 hour ago, Roundybout said:

 

In what universe is that the “moderate left” option

 

[leh-nerd skin-erd]

5 minutes ago, Trump_is_Mentally_fit said:

They sent a person to a death camp. 

 

MAGA's true colors, I just hope everyone realizes this is how you people think 

I understand you are situationally outraged (currently on a 4 years on/4 years off cycle), but I'm not sure why you're attacking me here when we agree.  

 

As for how people think of me, here's your guy, skipping death camps and going right to incinerating a family of 10.  Your response...Give me more Joe!

 

https://www.cnn.com/2021/08/29/asia/afghanistan-kabul-evacuation-intl/index.html

 

Ten members of one family – including seven children – are dead after a US drone strike targeting a vehicle in a residential neighborhood of Kabul, a relative of the dead told CNN.

The US carried out what it called a defensive airstrike in Kabul, targeting a suspected ISIS-K suicide bomber who posed an “imminent” threat to the airport, US Central Command said Sunday.

The Pentagon has said the strike resulted in secondary explosions, and those explosions may have been what killed the civilians.

The youngest victims of Sunday’s airstrike were two 2-year-old girls, according to family members.

[Joe Ferguson forever]

1 hour ago, Roundybout said:

n what universe is that the “moderate left” option

That's easy.  In the white supremacist universe.

[Big Turk]

"Due process" is a constitutional guarantee that protects individuals from arbitrary or unfair treatment by the government. It appears in both the Fifth Amendment (applying to the federal government) and the Fourteenth Amendment (applying to state governments), and it essentially ensures that the government must follow fair procedures before depriving a person of life, liberty, or property.

 

There are two types of due process:

Procedural due process – requires fair and proper legal procedures (e.g., notice and a hearing) before the government can take away someone's rights.

 

Substantive due process – protects certain fundamental rights from government interference, even if procedures are followed.

 

Are illegal immigrants guaranteed due process?

 

Yes, illegal (or undocumented) immigrants are guaranteed due process under the U.S. Constitution.

This has been upheld in multiple Supreme Court cases. One key ruling is Zadvydas v. Davis (2001), where the Court stated that "once an alien enters the country, the legal circumstance changes, and they are entitled to due process protections, even if their presence is unlawful."

 

Another important case is Plyler v. Doe (1982), where the Court struck down a Texas law that denied public education funding for children of undocumented immigrants. The Court reaffirmed that the protections of the Fourteenth Amendment apply to all “persons” — not just citizens or lawful residents.

 

So, even if someone has "no basis to be here," once they are physically present in the U.S., they are still considered a “person” under the Constitution, and they must be treated fairly under the law — which includes due process protections in immigration proceedings, such as hearings before a judge and the right to appeal.

 

Edited April 17 by Big Turk