thenorthremembers Posted Sunday at 11:43 PM Posted Sunday at 11:43 PM 1 hour ago, Roundybout said: How is social security NOT welfare? Social security is not welfare because it's literally calculated based on the amount of money you've earned while you worked. People paid to have it. It's not free or totally dependent on other people's tax dollars. If you're talking about Supplemental Security Income, then yes that's closer to welfare. However looking back at your original post it didn't say SSI, it said Social Security. Again not welfare.
The Frankish Reich Posted yesterday at 12:51 AM Posted yesterday at 12:51 AM 1 hour ago, thenorthremembers said: Social security is not welfare because it's literally calculated based on the amount of money you've earned while you worked It is, but it isn't actuarially sound. You can generally expect to get back way more than what you paid in, even accounting for inflation/time value of money. So is it welfare? Well, it's called Old Age Insurance, but it's more like an Old Age Transfer Payment.
IrishLass Posted yesterday at 12:57 AM Posted yesterday at 12:57 AM 2 hours ago, Roundybout said: How is social security NOT welfare? It is not need-based. It comes from taxes calculated based on what you've earned throughout your working life and have paid into the system toward retirement. That seems like a pretty basic thing for you to not know. 1
The Frankish Reich Posted yesterday at 01:01 AM Posted yesterday at 01:01 AM 1 minute ago, IrishLass said: It is not need-based. It comes from taxes calculated based on what you've earned throughout your working life and have paid into the system toward retirement. That seems like a pretty basic thing for you to not know. Whoever said "welfare" needs to be needs-based? We talk about the Scandinavian "welfare state" all the time, and the vast majority of those programs - old age state pensions, medical care, childcare, etc. - aren't need-based. If you want to say SS isn't need-based, well, then just say that. One man's welfare is another man's "transfer payment."
thenorthremembers Posted yesterday at 01:03 AM Posted yesterday at 01:03 AM (edited) 25 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: It is, but it isn't actuarially sound. You can generally expect to get back way more than what you paid in, even accounting for inflation/time value of money. So is it welfare? Well, it's called Old Age Insurance, but it's more like an Old Age Transfer Payment. It's based on a standardized calculation and you would have had to have pay into the system to get out of it. Where as programs like SNAP benefits, real welfare are only available to low or no income people. It's absolutely not welfare. Do you also consider your tax return welfare? Edited yesterday at 01:17 AM by thenorthremembers
IrishLass Posted yesterday at 01:03 AM Posted yesterday at 01:03 AM Just now, The Frankish Reich said: Whoever said "welfare" needs to be needs-based? We talk about the Scandinavian "welfare state" all the time, and the vast majority of those programs - old age state pensions, medical care, childcare, etc. - aren't need-based. If you want to say SS isn't need-based, well, then just say that. One man's welfare is another man's "transfer payment." Well if you need it explained in even SIMPLER terms: welfare is for the poor. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted yesterday at 01:21 AM Posted yesterday at 01:21 AM (edited) 19 minutes ago, IrishLass said: Well if you need it explained in even SIMPLER terms: welfare is for the poor. So, is SS for the poor? Despite the fact that every working person paid into it under an implied contract with OUR government. And the fact that to a point (165k I think) the more you make, the more you pay in. As far as loss of democracy, first would be the loss of control of the pursestrings by congress. And the overtaking of those pursestrings by the prez and an unelected billionaire. in fact, the new overwhelming power of several billionaires. In short, oligarchy. But don't worry, they care deeply about the working man - people who shower after work rather than before work...😀 Edited yesterday at 01:31 AM by Joe Ferguson forever
IrishLass Posted yesterday at 02:40 AM Posted yesterday at 02:40 AM 1 hour ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: So, is SS for the poor? Despite the fact that every working person paid into it under an implied contract with OUR government. And the fact that to a point (165k I think) the more you make, the more you pay in. Roundabout is the one calling social security "welfare." I am telling him it is NOT welfare. We've paid into it. There are people who DON'T pay into it and DON'T receive social security.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted yesterday at 02:44 AM Posted yesterday at 02:44 AM 1 minute ago, IrishLass said: Roundabout is the one calling social security "welfare." I am telling him it is NOT welfare. We've paid into it. There are people who DON'T pay into it and DON'T receive social security. except for disability which is rampant in Vance's neighborhood an in many maga hoods. Why isn't musk looking for waste and fraud there? Lots to be found and arrests to be made.
SectionC3 Posted yesterday at 02:45 AM Posted yesterday at 02:45 AM Just now, Joe Ferguson forever said: except for disability which is rampant in Vance's neighborhood an in many maga hoods. Why isn't musk looking for waste and fraud there? Lots to be found and arrests to be made. Exactly. So far, no fraud found, no prosecutions, no arrest, and no indication as to what specifically DOGE has cut (aside from humans).
IrishLass Posted yesterday at 02:49 AM Posted yesterday at 02:49 AM 4 minutes ago, Joe Ferguson forever said: except for disability which is rampant in Vance's neighborhood an in many maga hoods. Why isn't musk looking for waste and fraud there? Lots to be found and arrests to be made. They should definitely look into waste and fraud there.
SectionC3 Posted yesterday at 02:50 AM Posted yesterday at 02:50 AM Just now, IrishLass said: They should definitely look into waste and fraud there. They should also take anyone who lives in a trailer and spends snap on Doritos off of welfare, social security, etc., right? Because that's fraud, is it not? They're able bodied, they can work the fields now that the illegals are out of here, and maybe they should stop watching the couch grow into their *ss, turn of Fox News, and get to work. 1
Joe Ferguson forever Posted yesterday at 02:53 AM Posted yesterday at 02:53 AM (edited) 9 minutes ago, IrishLass said: They should definitely look into waste and fraud there. why do you think it hasn't been done. I have a theory! firstly, they'd likely catch some of JD's family or at least friends. Also the states they'd find the most offenders in are MAGA strongholds. Think Alabama, Louisiana, Arkansas, Tennessee, Georgia, Mississippi, Kentucky etc... 8 minutes ago, SectionC3 said: They should also take anyone who lives in a trailer and spends snap on Doritos off of welfare, social security, etc., right? Because that's fraud, is it not? They're able bodied, they can work the fields now that the illegals are out of here, and maybe they should stop watching the couch grow into their *ss, turn of Fox News, and get to work. Yup. sick of giving hand outs to people who complain about the government giving handouts. Edited yesterday at 02:59 AM by Joe Ferguson forever
IrishLass Posted yesterday at 03:02 AM Posted yesterday at 03:02 AM 11 minutes ago, SectionC3 said: They should also take anyone who lives in a trailer and spends snap on Doritos off of welfare, social security, etc., right? Because that's fraud, is it not? They're able bodied, they can work the fields now that the illegals are out of here, and maybe they should stop watching the couch grow into their *ss, turn of Fox News, and get to work. Again, you're talking about welfare and social security as if they're similar things. They're not.
Joe Ferguson forever Posted yesterday at 03:09 AM Posted yesterday at 03:09 AM 5 minutes ago, IrishLass said: Again, you're talking about welfare and social security as if they're similar things. They're not. I think he's equating disability to SS. Many of the con artists do in fact, live in trailers. It's not an opulent life but then again, they don't need to work.
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