Jonathan Martin and Incognito Bullygate back in the news

[Brand J]

Over the top racial and offensive jokes turned into “bullying” (a term his mother used) after Martin stepped away from the team because he needed some time away from football.
 

Martin’s regret is not shutting down the Wells Report, explaining to the team where his headspace was, and allowing the “bullying” narrative to continue its track. 

[uticaclub]

12 hours ago, Malazan said:

Also, Incognito is f'ing crazy. There's plenty of incidents with his behavior that are bats**t.

Not a bad quality in an offensive lineman

[Mr. WEO]

1 hour ago, shrader said:

I honestly don’t care one way or the other about this. But we do need to remember that this Wells report was paid for by the same organization where the only thing that came out of investigating Dan Snyder for being Dan Snyder was the blackballing of a guy who coached a completely different team. Their reports say whatever the NFL wants them to say. 

 

Martin concurs with what the Wells report reported.  The OPs linked article nowhere says Matins claim was "built on a lie".  It's just him saying he should have handled it differently.  Not sure how many here read the article.  The facts aren't in dispute. 

 

The NFL investigation into Snyder was flawed, but it did result in him stepping down as day to day operations person.  A subsequent and parallel House Committee investigation confirmed financial and workplace improprieties resulting in criminal investigation. He was gone not long after that.  So saying the "only thing that happened" was a coach was blackballed is not correct.

[Bermuda Triangle]

12 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

It’s sort of tough to defend Incognito when you have that voicemail. Maybe that was meant to be “tough love”

and part of football culture, but it sounds bad:

 

"Hey, wassup, you half-n----- piece of s---. I saw you on Twitter, you been training 10 weeks. I'll s--- in your f---ing mouth. I'm going to slap your f---ing mouth, I'm going to slap your real mother across the face [laughter]. F--- you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you."

Is Incognito claiming that the voicemail is fake too?  Or "taken out of context"?

[BarleyNY]

13 hours ago, Malazan said:

 

2 of them, actually.

 

Also, Incognito is f'ing crazy. There's plenty of incidents with his behavior that are bats**t.

The texts came out when my son was in the year of little league baseball when the kids first started pitching. It was brutal. Walk after walk after walk. I sat in my lawn chair and read every text released. My take away was that Incognito was definitely messed up. He was a big POS with his extreme partying, hookers and dangerous behavior. I’m surprised he’s still alive.

 

While his treatment of Martin wouldn’t be tolerated in any workplace, I don’t think he was malicious nor do I think he was bullying him. That was how he treated his friends and he considered Martin a friend. It did seem to be a big stressor for Martin though. Lotta stress added to an already stressful job - and Martin did not seem to understand that Incognito’s intentions were founded in friendship and not malicious. There probably just needed to be a discussion about appropriate behavior and then an adherence on Incognito’s part since it was a work environment. There was no need for it to have gotten to where it did - unless Incognito refused to change his behavior and he never got that chance. 

[Coach Tuesday]

12 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

It’s sort of tough to defend Incognito when you have that voicemail. Maybe that was meant to be “tough love”

and part of football culture, but it sounds bad:

 

"Hey, wassup, you half-n----- piece of s---. I saw you on Twitter, you been training 10 weeks. I'll s--- in your f---ing mouth. I'm going to slap your f---ing mouth, I'm going to slap your real mother across the face [laughter]. F--- you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you."

I went to college in the 90s and had plenty of fraternity brother friends and this was how they all talked to each other.  Not defending it but it was the norm.

[boyst]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

I don't agree. I played and coached a reasonably high level of competitive sport without ever using the threat of slapping someone's mother to motivate them. 

I think it's different sports that are entirely the factor to such behavior.

 

In soccer, for the majority of the behaviour it is a false gentleman's drama. Things are exaggerated to the point of a few words than the flop. Of course this is a vast generalization, but there is no FAFO in soccer. The players don't fight, there is no punishment for bad behavior on an athletes and for the most part players behave.

 

It is similar in baseball; and if you've ever been around a highly competitive or professional locker room you'll know no other sports teams behave like baseball. Swimmers maybe close, but my experience was only college swimmers.

 

Football players, American Football players, are dynamite. They're primed to explode for 6-10 seconds of action like a powder keg and that is a big part of the reason I think certain personality types do better at it than others. The abusive words, behavior, and all around punishment is about the most severe in sports.

 

Only wrestling is above football in my experience. Where players, coaches, and even athletes themselves abuse everything. Everything is motivation because the margins are so thin that the edge of competitiveness of the athlete is razor thin. .5 lbs, or just one more breath can separate first from second.

 

Soccer players are better conditioned and healthier than most other sports, and by no means am I taking a shot at them. I don't have to... Honestly, playing soccer is bad enough. 😝

[DapperCam]

The title of this thread seems wrong. All the events that were considered bullying all still happened. Nothing about the facts changed.

 

Martin is just trying to be a scam artist crypto bro, which requires you to have an “alpha male” persona. So he’s doing what he can to distance himself from the bullying event because it makes him look weak to that audience.

 

If Incognito told me he was going to kill me I might believe him, dude has more than one screw loose.

[FireChans]

2 hours ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Maybe it is. But I promise you if you said that in a locker room in this country it would go off. You'd have a mass brawl in seconds. 

 

I think your mistake there was watching Guy Ritchie movies. 

 

I'll be honest, I'm not sure I ever watched one.

 

I almost wrote Guy Pearce but caught myself at the last second.

[BisonBilly]

This is so upsetting.  So many of these incidents are just fake!!! This needs to stop! 

[FireChans]

27 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

The texts came out when my son was in the year of little league baseball when the kids first started pitching. It was brutal. Walk after walk after walk. I sat in my lawn chair and read every text released. My take away was that Incognito was definitely messed up. He was a big POS with his extreme partying, hookers and dangerous behavior. I’m surprised he’s still alive.

 

While his treatment of Martin wouldn’t be tolerated in any workplace, I don’t think he was malicious nor do I think he was bullying him. That was how he treated his friends and he considered Martin a friend. It did seem to be a big stressor for Martin though. Lotta stress added to an already stressful job - and Martin did not seem to understand that Incognito’s intentions were founded in friendship and not malicious. There probably just needed to be a discussion about appropriate behavior and then an adherence on Incognito’s part since it was a work environment. There was no need for it to have gotten to where it did - unless Incognito refused to change his behavior and he never got that chance. 

Tbh, I don't think Richie was the kind of guy to have a frank discussion and work towards positive change.

 

We didn't hear much about him in Buffalo, but I have a sneaking suspicion he was also probably the same vulgar, slightly unhinged fella. Maybe Wood was a positive influence on him or maybe he got better, but with the stories of his other outbursts post-Bills, I don't think he changed.

 

What I think spoke the most volumes about the saga was how much Pouncey went to bat for Richie.  Now, that doesn't mean Richie did nothing wrong, but there was a clear tacit approval of Richie's behavior by his contemporaries, which to me either pointed to the behavior being not that egregious (to them) or the entire locker room hated Martin and didn't care.

[BarleyNY]

Just now, FireChans said:

Tbh, I don't think Richie was the kind of guy to have a frank discussion and work towards positive change.

 

We didn't hear much about him in Buffalo, but I have a sneaking suspicion he was also probably the same vulgar, slightly unhinged fella. Maybe Wood was a positive influence on him or maybe he got better, but with the stories of his other outbursts post-Bills, I don't think he changed.

 

What I think spoke the most volumes about the saga was how much Pouncey went to bat for Richie.  Now, that doesn't mean Richie did nothing wrong, but there was a clear tacit approval of Richie's behavior by his contemporaries, which to me either pointed to the behavior being not that egregious (to them) or the entire locker room hated Martin and didn't care.

I think you are right that Incognito wouldn’t have changed his behavior, but maybe he’d have realized that he was going to have to cut Martin out of it. Pouncey is a total POS too. He’s shown to be cut from the same cloth as Incognito. 

[UConn James]

3 minutes ago, DapperCam said:

The title of this thread seems wrong. All the events that were considered bullying all still happened. Nothing about the facts changed.

 

Martin is just trying to be a scam artist crypto bro, which requires you to have an “alpha male” persona. So he’s doing what he can to distance himself from the bullying event because it makes him look weak to that audience.

 

If Incognito told me he was going to kill me I might believe him, dude has more than one screw loose.

The article smacked of a guy who I wouldn’t trust as far as I could throw him. Started how many business partnerships that he left in very short order? He seems like a very confused personality.  Paraphrasing… that his commodity is building relationships and confidence? Stay the hell away from JM having anything to do with your money.

[Gugny]

14 hours ago, YoloinOhio said:

 

https://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/43707519/jonathan-martin-miami-dolphins-nfl-bullying-wells-report-bullygate

Yeah, Eric. Your brother also wanted to decapitate his dead father and brought an arsenal to the funeral home.

 

Not sure is that was before or after his run in with the CIA at the gym. 
 

But please … tell us how someone else ruined his reputation. 
 

 

[Jauronimo]

19 minutes ago, FireChans said:

I'll be honest, I'm not sure I ever watched one.

 

I almost wrote Guy Pearce but caught myself at the last second.

Lock, Stock, and Two Smoking Barrels is an excellent movie.  Maybe start there and end there.  I thought Layer Cake was a Ritchie movie but I was wrong.

 

The Man from UNCLE was another solid movie.  S*atch is wildly overrated but its fine. Its basically Lock Stock but produced by Hollywood.  I watched the Covenant on a flight and it exceeded my expectations.  

 

You're welcome.

Edited Monday at 04:49 PM by Jauronimo

[FireChans]

8 minutes ago, BarleyNY said:

I think you are right that Incognito wouldn’t have changed his behavior, but maybe he’d have realized that he was going to have to cut Martin out of it. Pouncey is a total POS too. He’s shown to be cut from the same cloth as Incognito. 

Yeah I guess that was door #3 that I neglected to mention.

 

Urban Meyer really had those Florida boys all together.

Just now, Jauronimo said:

Lock, Stock, and Two Smoking Barrels is an excellent movie.  Maybe start there and end there.  I thought Layer Cake was a Ritchie movie but I was wrong.

 

The Man from UNCLE was another solid movie.  ***** is wildly overrated but fine. I watched the Covenant on a flight and it exceeded my expectations.  

 

You're welcome.

@GunnerBill get this rube

[Jauronimo]

2 minutes ago, Gugny said:

Yeah, Eric. Your brother also wanted to decapitate his dead father and brought an arsenal to the funeral home.

 

Not sure is that was before or after his run in with the CIA at the gym. 
 

But please … tell us how someone else ruined his reputation. 
 

 

For science.  Thats a pretty important detail IMO.

 

Not everyone understands the warrior spirit.

[colin]

13 hours ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

It’s sort of tough to defend Incognito when you have that voicemail. Maybe that was meant to be “tough love”

and part of football culture, but it sounds bad:

 

"Hey, wassup, you half-n----- piece of s---. I saw you on Twitter, you been training 10 weeks. I'll s--- in your f---ing mouth. I'm going to slap your f---ing mouth, I'm going to slap your real mother across the face [laughter]. F--- you, you're still a rookie. I'll kill you."

 

that article was awful.  so wordy, and like, what info did it give?  that martin doesn't want people to think he was bullied, that he just made up stories?

 

it seems like martin wants to get rich in crypto, and being looked at as an oversized wimp who got bullied doesn't work with that, but he's not like revealing meaningful info, incognito still looks like a bully and a total psycho (and he has a rap sheet that could fill a book just from what i've heard about him on podcasts spoken by people who actually like him!), and martin is what, admitting he was being conniving and lied and went along w the bully narrative when it happened?

 

it seems martin and the writer are using corporate strategy to rebrand himself without providing any new information.

 

 

[Bermuda Triangle]

22 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Tbh, I don't think Richie was the kind of guy to have a frank discussion and work towards positive change.

 

We didn't hear much about him in Buffalo, but I have a sneaking suspicion he was also probably the same vulgar, slightly unhinged fella. Maybe Wood was a positive influence on him or maybe he got better, but with the stories of his other outbursts post-Bills, I don't think he changed.

 

What I think spoke the most volumes about the saga was how much Pouncey went to bat for Richie.  Now, that doesn't mean Richie did nothing wrong, but there was a clear tacit approval of Richie's behavior by his contemporaries, which to me either pointed to the behavior being not that egregious (to them) or the entire locker room hated Martin and didn't care.

The Pouncey brothers weren't exactly considered to be high-character guys, themselves.

[appoo]

To be clear Martin didn’t fabricate anything. Incognito did everything he was accused of, what Martin regrets is calling it bullying and cooperating with the investigation. In that same article Martin says what Incognito did was very wrong and wished he’d stood up to him.

 

read the article.  It’s an interesting read. There is little defending Incognito.  Heck if nothing else read the text msg that Incognito sent out 

34 minutes ago, BisonBilly said:

This is so upsetting.  So many of these incidents are just fake!!! This needs to stop! 

There was nothing fake about it .

53 minutes ago, boyst said:

I think it's different sports that are entirely the factor to such behavior.

 

In soccer, for the majority of the behaviour it is a false gentleman's drama. Things are exaggerated to the point of a few words than the flop. Of course this is a vast generalization, but there is no FAFO in soccer. The players don't fight, there is no punishment for bad behavior on an athletes and for the most part players behave.

 

It is similar in baseball; and if you've ever been around a highly competitive or professional locker room you'll know no other sports teams behave like baseball. Swimmers maybe close, but my experience was only college swimmers.

 

Football players, American Football players, are dynamite. They're primed to explode for 6-10 seconds of action like a powder keg and that is a big part of the reason I think certain personality types do better at it than others. The abusive words, behavior, and all around punishment is about the most severe in sports.

 

Only wrestling is above football in my experience. Where players, coaches, and even athletes themselves abuse everything. Everything is motivation because the margins are so thin that the edge of competitiveness of the athlete is razor thin. .5 lbs, or just one more breath can separate first from second.

 

Soccer players are better conditioned and healthier than most other sports, and by no means am I taking a shot at them. I don't have to... Honestly, playing soccer is bad enough. 😝

this isn’t junctions boys eras. You don’t speak to people the way Incognito did