Jim Monos w/ critical comments on Bills front office, coaching, roster moves

[Jrb1979]

13 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

If people wonder why I defend Sean McDermott. Here’s Whaley and Jim Monos to tell you why.

 

Sean McDermott built everything. King McDermott. I’ve been saying it for a while. I never knew this video existed.
 

Listen at 1:15 in. Monos talks about McDermott tearing everything down. It’s relevant today as McDermott just fired Eric Ciano who was hired during the Whaley/Monos era.
 

 

Nobody denies he's done great things for this team. He also has his faults too. The whole front office has faults and that's what Monos was pointing out.  

Instead of talking about those, many dismiss it cause it was from a guy who was a failure. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, Jrb1979 said:

Nobody denies he's done great things for this team. He also has his faults too. The whole front office has faults and that's what Monos was pointing out.  

Instead of talking about those, many dismiss it cause it was from a guy who was a failure. 

Yes, no franchise is perfect. But people need to respect what McDermott has done a little more IMO. Firing him for not making a Super Bowl is insane. 
 

I actually believe he is the reason Allen had a chance to develop into what he is. Ultimately Allen’s work ethic and determination got him to where he’s at but McDermott’s organizational structure allowed Allen to develop.

Edited February 16 by Buffalo_Stampede

[davefan66]

38 minutes ago, 5ths the charm said:

Other than a few picks (like Josh) most if the 1st 2nd and 3rd round picks have been mediocre to poor.  That's on Beane.

The product on the field speaks for itself.

 

That’s s Beane. That’s McD.

 

 

[T.E.]

16 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

In what alternative universe did these Drought era "rosters that were better than the current Bills one, but simply lacked the QB" exist?  

 

 

 

I'm going to assume you're under 30 if this seems like a wild statement. There were 3-4 teams that would've been legitimate SB contenders with Allen on the roster, with more talent than we have now.

Edited Sunday at 03:22 PM by T.E.

[FireChans]

2 hours ago, SoTier said:

 

In what alternative universe did these Drought era "rosters that were better than the current Bills one, but simply lacked the QB" exist?  

 

 

 

2014 team probably goes to the SB with Allen that year.

Edited February 16 by FireChans

[Buffalo716]

7 minutes ago, FireChans said:

2014 team probably goes to the SB with Allen that year.

Jim Schwartz also had a defense that wilted when we needed it most

 

It had zero Gap control and got abused when it needed to step up against the raiders 

 

I have zero faith that even Josh Allen is propelling that team to a super bowl... It didn't want to stuff the run when it mattered, the raiders went for like a 140 in the biggest game of the year

Edited February 16 by Buffalo716

[LABILLBACKER]

2 hours ago, ghostwriter said:

Say what you want, but the way Beane aggressively traded up for Josh Allen is enough to cover his sins but I agree with Monos to a degree.

I agree the good will Beane gets and earned from landing Josh is deserved. But it should not be taken for granted nor does it last forever.  I don't know who really makes the picks in the first 3 rounds?  I used to think it was McD, then Beane or some combination of both.  Now I have no clue.  

 

Picks must improve, especially on defense.  Brandon knows we must have a game wrecking Dlineman  who after 8 seasons he's failed to find.  Are we destined to continue getting to a certain threshold only to stop and go no further?  

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

2 hours ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Yes, no franchise is perfect. But people need to respect what McDermott has done a little more IMO. Firing him for not making a Super Bowl is insane. 
 

I actually believe he is the reason Allen had a chance to develop into what he is. Ultimately Allen’s work ethic and determination got him to where he’s at but McDermott’s organizational structure allowed Allen to develop.

 

McDermott is a coach that thought Nathan Peterman was good enough to start in the NFL. Multiple times. 

 

We went into Josh Allen's rookie season with a QB depth chart of: 

 

1) Peterman

2) Allen

3) No one. We didn't have a 3rd QB on the roster

 

It's almost like we were intentionally sabotaging Allen's career/development. 

 

Obviously none of us will ever know how much of Allen's development was his own vs coaching, but my money would be on Allen and not the coaches. 

[SoTier]

47 minutes ago, T.E. said:

I'm going to assume you're under 30 of this seems like a wild statement. There were 3-4 teams that would've been legitimate SB contenders with Allen on the roster, with more talent than we have now.

 

Wrong again, dude.  I was a season ticket holder during part of the Drought.  Most of those seasons, the best part of Bills games was the tailgating.  So, what were those "3-4 teams that would've been legitimate SB contenders" that had "more talent than we have now"? 

 

 

 

[Buffalo716]

12 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

McDermott is a coach that thought Nathan Peterman was good enough to start in the NFL. Multiple times. 

 

We went into Josh Allen's rookie season with a QB depth chart of: 

 

1) Peterman

2) Allen

3) No one. We didn't have a 3rd QB on the roster

 

It's almost like we were intentionally sabotaging Allen's career/development. 

 

Obviously none of us will ever know how much of Allen's development was his own vs coaching, but my money would be on Allen and not the coaches. 

No, 100 years of football history shows it's always better to sit a rookie and let him learn then throw him to the fire 

 

You can develop a lot of quarterbacks.. you can ruin them just as fast by throwing them to the fire 

 

Sean McDermott did what any smart coach would do.. try to keep his rookie quarterback off the field learning as much as possible so he didn't have to get thrown to the wolves 

 

Plenty of quarterbacks are ruined before they ever have a chance because of terrible circumstances.. Josh sitting another 10 games would have been more beneficial.. but Sean also feels the heat of potentially getting fired 

 

But sitting a rookie quarterback is always 100% the correct thing to do because it never makes them worse.. learning the pro game from the sidelines while working on your weaknesses has been tried and true for quarterbacks for 70 years .. first round picks used to sit all the time back in the day

 

Sean wanted to prolong his quarterback getting thrown to the fire on a subpar roster

 

Josh Allen is not Josh Allen if he gets drafted by the Jets lol they would have ruined him... Sean McDermott has been a calming influence since day one and Josh has got to grow

 

Tom Brady is not Tom Brady unless he got belichick and the Patriot Way 

 

100% Sean McDermott gets credit for helping develop Josh Allen and being a calming influence allowing him to reach his potential

 

To think current MVP Josh Allen .. is the same in 32 situations across the NFL is insane lol the Buffalo Bills deserve credit

Edited February 16 by Buffalo716

[Stenbar]

23 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Wrong again, dude.  I was a season ticket holder during part of the Drought.  Most of those seasons, the best part of Bills games was the tailgating.  So, what were those "3-4 teams that would've been legitimate SB contenders" that had "more talent than we have now"? 

 

 

 

I would go in early to watch Moorman punt the football pregame...Lol...He was awesome to watch

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

44 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

No, 100 years of football history shows it's always better to sit a rookie and let him learn then throw him to the fire 

 

You can develop a lot of quarterbacks.. you can ruin them just as fast by throwing them to the fire 

 

Sean McDermott did what any smart coach would do.. try to keep his rookie quarterback off the field learning as much as possible so he didn't have to get thrown to the wolves 

 

Plenty of quarterbacks are ruined before they ever have a chance because of terrible circumstances.. Josh sitting another 10 games would have been more beneficial.. but Sean also feels the heat of potentially getting fired 

 

But sitting a rookie quarterback is always 100% the correct thing to do because it never makes them worse.. learning the pro game from the sidelines while working on your weaknesses has been tried and true for quarterbacks for 70 years .. first round picks used to sit all the time back in the day

 

Sean wanted to prolong his quarterback getting thrown to the fire on a subpar roster

 

Josh Allen is not Josh Allen if he gets drafted by the Jets lol they would have ruined him... Sean McDermott has been a calming influence since day one and Josh has got to grow

 

Tom Brady is not Tom Brady unless he got belichick and the Patriot Way 

 

100% Sean McDermott gets credit for helping develop Josh Allen and being a calming influence allowing him to reach his potential

 

To think current MVP Josh Allen .. is the same in 32 situations across the NFL is insane lol the Buffalo Bills deserve credit

 

I agree it's the correct move to have Allen sit his rookie year.

 

My point is that it's criminal malpractice to have him sit behind NATHAN PETERMAN without a single other QB on the roster. He was supposed to sit on the bench and learn from the worst QB in NFL history?

 

Peterman was an unmitigated disaster in week 1 and was benched (permanently) at halftime. 

 

We threw Allen to the wolves by the 2nd half of week 1 in his rookie season. It's incredible he turned out the way he did.

 

IMO Allen developed into an MVP QB despite McDermott/Daboll/Dorsey and not because of them. Not even the Jets would have put Allen in a worse position in his rookie season. 

[Buffalo716]

5 minutes ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

I agree it's the correct move to have Allen sit his rookie year.

 

My point is that it's criminal malpractice to have him sit behind NATHAN PETERMAN without a single other QB on the roster. He was supposed to sit on the bench and learn from the worst QB in NFL history?

 

Peterman was an unmitigated disaster in week 1 and was benched (permanently) at halftime. 

 

We threw Allen to the wolves by the 2nd half of week 1 in his rookie season. It's incredible he turned out the way he did.

 

IMO Allen developed into an MVP QB despite McDermott/Daboll/Dorsey and not because of them. Not even the Jets would have put Allen in a worse position in his rookie season. 

A rookie quarterback sitting doesn't need to learn from the quarterback ahead of him lol 

 

In fact being around the game for 30 years at a high level.. most starting quality quarterbacks do not want anything to do with helping a young guy improve in the NFL.. because that ultimately makes them lose their job 

 

Brett favre wanted nothing to do with helping Aaron Rodgers 

 

It was up to the Green Bay coaches to get Aaron Rodgers ready 

 

Just like it was up to the Bills coaches, and our offensive coordinator, and our quarterback coach to get Josh ready 

 

Not Nathan Peterman 

 

Now can you say we went into the season with a terrible starter.. but at the end of the day so do a handful of NFL teams 

 

And you could never convince me that the Jets would have developed Josh Allen better or he'd be better off in other situations... Just like you could never tell me Tom Brady would have been better off if he was drafted by the browns or the bills 

 

We absolutely get credit because it takes an entire organization to develop a quarterback something we didn't have for 20 years.. a top-down commitment

 

Edited February 16 by Buffalo716

[appoo]

There have been 50 some Super Bowls. Lose me with these “trends” on when coaches win a SB.  Quite literally zero statistical significance 

[appoo]

Beane’s picks:

 

2018

1st - Josh Allen: god tier pick 

1st - Tremaine Edmunds: great pick 

2019

1st - Ed Oliver: Great pick 

2nd - Cody Ford: Bust

 

2020

1st - Stefon Diggs: elite tier 

2nd - AJ Epenesa: good pick (consider the round)

2021

1st - GR: Good pick (he’s been productive and will earn a good contract. He’s good for picking at the end of the first)

2nd - Boogie Basham - Bust

2022 -

1st - Elam: Bust

2nd Cook: God tier pick 

 

2023

1st - Kincaid: Good pick 

2nd - Torrance: Elite Tier for 2nd round 

 

2024 - TBD

 

3 busts in Boogie, Ford and Elam. The rest are good to God tier.

 

Considering where the bills draft this is likely among the very best in the NFL.  And the lower in the draft you go the better it is.

 

Beane is in elite company as a drafter

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

A rookie quarterback sitting doesn't need to learn from the quarterback ahead of him lol 

 

In fact being around the game for 30 years at a high level.. most starting quality quarterbacks do not want anything to do with helping a young guy improve in the NFL.. because that ultimately makes them lose their job 

 

Brett favre wanted nothing to do with helping Aaron Rodgers 

 

It was up to the Green Bay coaches to get Aaron Rodgers ready 

 

Just like it was up to the Bills coaches, and our offensive coordinator, and our quarterback coach to get Josh ready 

 

Not Nathan Peterman 

 

Now can you say we went into the season with a terrible starter.. but at the end of the day so do a handful of NFL teams 

 

And you could never convince me that the Jets would have developed Josh Allen better or he'd be better off in other situations... Just like you could never tell me Tom Brady would have been better off if he was drafted by the browns or the bills 

 

We absolutely get credit because it takes an entire organization to develop a quarterback something we didn't have for 20 years.. a top-down commitment

 

 

My point is that we went into the season with such a bad starter that raw rookie Josh was QB1 by halftime of week 1. Mahomes got to sit for a year behind Alex Smith. 

 

How much success have the QB coach/OC/HC that "developed" Allen had outside of Josh Allen?

 

Dorsey has been fired (twice) as an OC.

Daboll is 11-30-1 as HC after a lucky 7-2 start with Daniel Jones winning a bunch of 1 score games.  

McD's track record is tougher to compare since he was a DC before being hired as Bills HC and only has 1 season without Allen. Still, he's the HC that benched Tyrod Taylor for the worst QB in NFL history, and went into a season with the worst QB in NFL history as his QB1. Can't say I trust him when it comes to evaluating/developing QBs. 

 

Josh's developmental plan was to learn from QB1 Nathan Peterman, Ken Dorsey (QB coach), Brian Daboll (OC), and defensive minded Sean Mcdermott (HC). I cannot believe even the Jets would've put Josh in a worse situation.

[SoTier]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

2014 team probably goes to the SB with Allen that year.

 

Like most of the Bills rosters during the Drought era, the 2014 team was good on only one side of the ball with almost all the resources on the defense.  

 

The OL was trash.  There is no way that Allen would be nearly as successful behind the crappy OL whose best player, Eric Wood, was an average Center at best.  He might  make the current roster as a back up, but I doubt that any of the others could make the current Bills.  Freddie Jackson, the Bills featured RB in 2014, would likely not even make the Bills roster.  Sammy Watkins and Robert Woods were decent WRs but not sinificantly better than Cooper/Hollins and Shakir.

 

On defense, the strength was clearly the DL with Mario Williams(AP), Kyle Williams (PB), Marcel Dareus (AP), and Jerry Hughes.  The LBs were ok and the DBs inlcuded 2 good ones (Stephon Gilmore and Aaron Williams) and two JAGs.

 

 

 

[Low Positive]

1 minute ago, DabillsDaBillsDaBills said:

 

My point is that we went into the season with such a bad starter that raw rookie Josh was QB1 by halftime of week 1. Mahomes got to sit for a year behind Alex Smith. 

 

How much success have the QB coach/OC/HC that "developed" Allen had outside of Josh Allen?

 

Dorsey has been fired (twice) as an OC.

Daboll is 11-30-1 as HC after a lucky 7-2 start with Daniel Jones winning a bunch of 1 score games.  

McD's track record is tougher to compare since he was a DC before being hired as Bills HC and only has 1 season without Allen. Still, he's the HC that benched Tyrod Taylor for the worst QB in NFL history, and went into a season with the worst QB in NFL history as his QB1. Can't say I trust him when it comes to evaluating/developing QBs. 

 

Josh's developmental plan was to learn from QB1 Nathan Peterman, Ken Dorsey (QB coach), Brian Daboll (OC), and defensive minded Sean Mcdermott (HC). I cannot believe even the Jets would've put Josh in a worse situation.

I agree with all of this, but I do think that Dorsey is a good QB coach. That's his best role. 

[DabillsDaBillsDaBills]

34 minutes ago, Low Positive said:

I agree with all of this, but I do think that Dorsey is a good QB coach. That's his best role. 

 

I can live with that. Dorsey reached his Peter principle as a good QB coach, but was lousy as OC 

[FireChans]

42 minutes ago, SoTier said:

 

Like most of the Bills rosters during the Drought era, the 2014 team was good on only one side of the ball with almost all the resources on the defense.  

 

The OL was trash.  There is no way that Allen would be nearly as successful behind the crappy OL whose best player, Eric Wood, was an average Center at best.  He might  make the current roster as a back up, but I doubt that any of the others could make the current Bills.  Freddie Jackson, the Bills featured RB in 2014, would likely not even make the Bills roster.  Sammy Watkins and Robert Woods were decent WRs but not sinificantly better than Cooper/Hollins and Shakir.

 

On defense, the strength was clearly the DL with Mario Williams(AP), Kyle Williams (PB), Marcel Dareus (AP), and Jerry Hughes.  The LBs were ok and the DBs inlcuded 2 good ones (Stephon Gilmore and Aaron Williams) and two JAGs.

 

 

 

Um 2014 Sammy Watkins might’ve put up 1700 yards with Josh throwing him the ball.

 

The OL wasn’t great but it wasn’t much worse than the 2022 Bills OL.

 

If there were only 2 good DB’s and 2 JAGs on that team, how many good DB’s and JAGs do we have on ours? are we arguing Damar Hamlin is better than a JAG (spoilers, he’s actually worse lol)

But you’re right. The strength of that team was a DL that could be dominant on their best day and make HoF QBs look silly. When have we ever seen teams like that win a SB, especially with competent QB play. Lmao