Tre White's back-to-back injuries were the begining of the end for the once dominant Bills D

[Special K]

With all the talk of the Eagles strong D-line, the other factor that contributed to the Eagles Defensive dominance of the Chiefs was the lockdown CB play from Slay and Mitchell.

 

The Lockdown version of Tre White pre-injury, coupled with Benford as a future CB1 playing as a CB2 would have allowed the Bills to lockdown the Chiefs WR's in the same manner as the Eagles did on Sunday.

 

Obviously the Bills pass rush is nothing like Philly, but I really would have liked the chance to see if a dominant White and Benford combo could have been the difference to get past the Chiefs.

Edited February 11 by Special K

[Stenbar]

Bad playcalling that gave up a fg with 13 seconds.  Then it was V. Millers knee injury, and Milano's injury. We overcame Tre Whites injury pretty easy. Imo.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

There’s been so much wasted cap space on defense due to injuries and poor signings. Some wasted high picks as well.

[Simon]

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[GunnerBill]

I broadly agree with the premise. In 2021, the year they lost Tre on Thanksgiving, the Bills defense was:

 

1st in the NFL in yards

1st in points 

1st in 3rd down % 

1st in points per drive

 

That D had a prime age elite corner for 2/3s of the season in White (26) and then Milano (27), Johnson (24), Hyde (30) and Poyer (29) fully healthy and in their peak performance window. 

 

Their rankings on defense have gradually worsened as that talent pool has suffered serious injuries (to White, Hyde and Milano) and aged out (Hyde and Poyer).

 

2022: 

2nd in points

6th in yards

7th in 3rd down %

5th in points per drive

 

2023:

4th in points

9th in yards

19th in 3rd down %

7th in points per drive

 

2024:

11th in points

17th in yards

29th in 3rd down %

18th in points per drive

 

I am on record as saying when Frazier stepped away that they would get worse on defense, and there was definitely an impact in that on what happened in 2023 and 2024, but the reality is the defensive performance has declined as the talent pool on defense has declined. They were at a point in 2022 pre-Tre's injury where they had one elite player and four very good ones in the back 7. As that has slowly been chipped away at the impact on performance has been clear. Interestingly the 3rd down drop off also coincides with the departure of Edmunds. And while I totally agreed with the decision to let him walk and he lacked splash impact plays... his length definitely helped on 3rd down where opposing QBs would see him sinking in the middle of the field and go away from him. Bernard makes more plays but to QB surveying the defense on 3rd and medium he isn't the same disincentive to throw in the middle of the field.

[Billzgobowlin]

I think if that's the issue it was only magnified by the lack of Elam living up to his first-round status.  

[H2o]

I agree with much of what GB saying here. The 3rd down % is the most troubling stat imo. Poyer and Hyde also had gone into decline, couple with being the walking wounded. This year they were replaced with Hamlin (not a starter on most teams) and the brittle Taylor Rapp. Daquan is also declining. And yes, I like Bernard and was tired of seeing Edmunds lost on the field also, but Bernard is small out there. Milano's body has begun to fail him. I think it is just a drop off in talent across the board, as well as age catching up with others, and multiple injuries to key players, not just the one that started Tre's exit from Buffalo. So many of these things tied in together and now it's obvious that the defense needs a lot of tweaking to get us where we want to be. 

[Charles Romes]

You really can’t overstate what was lost with the white injury in his prime. He’s old now, can’t run anymore coming off two devastating injuries, and STILL was offered a 9 figure contract by one of the smartest organizations in football, then traded to another top organization who also thought he was worth 9 figures, then saw meaningful snaps with the season on the line in the playoffs against the league MVP quarterback. 

[JohnNord]

6 hours ago, Special K said:

With all the talk of the Eagles strong D-line, the other factor that contributed to the Eagles Defensive dominance of the Chiefs was the lockdown CB play from Slay and Mitchell.

 

The Lockdown version of Tre White pre-injury, coupled with Benford as a future CB1 playing as a CB2 would have allowed the Bills to lockdown the Chiefs WR's in the same manner as the Eagles did on Sunday.

 

Obviously the Bills pass rush is nothing like Philly, but I really would have liked the chance to see if a dominant White and Benford combo could have been the difference to get past the Chiefs.

This can’t be understated enough.  Bills re-signed Tre in 2020 believing they had a foundational piece to their defense for the next five seasons.  They got about 1.5 years out of that deal.  

No one wants to hear this but thanks to coaching and the play of vets like Hyde and Poyer, Bills were able to get by with below average cornerbacks.  But this was quite a drop off from Tre’s play prior to 2021.  

Also Tre’s struggle to recover created a massive need at CB ultimately forcing Buffalo to reach for Kaiir Elam - one of Beane’s biggest draft blunders

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Good news is they don’t have much cap space invested on defense moving forward.

 

Bad news is they’re about to spend a lot of cap space and high draft picks on defense again. 

Hopefully they don’t screw it up.
 

 

[JerseyBills]

Von signing as well.  

If he stays healthy,  we have a SB imo 

[Chaos]

The following all seem to be true

 

• Tre White was awesome
• The 2021 defense was better than the 2024 defense
• Not have Tre White is one reason why the 2021 defense was better than then 2024 defense. 

Calling White's injury "the beginning" seems to conjur the concept that getting worse was inevitible.  Three years is a long time in the NFL.  Entire teams have been rebuilt from non-playoff teams to championship contenders in that time frame. 

Here are the 2021 Starters



If you look at the front 6 or 7, it seems their 2021 performance was not much different than the 2024 performance.  The difference was in the back 4
 

• Hyde, Poyer and White were perfect fits for the scheme the Bills wanted to run. Might have been genius. Might have been luck. 
• In 2021 this scheme was somewhat novel. In 2024, its fairly common and has been studied
• the committment to the scheme seems fairly absolute
• the idea that Rapp, Hamlin, Benford are going to provide anything close to White/Hyde/Poyer seems to border on the preposterous.

I think the biggest problem is the lack of adaptability.  An absolute committment to the scheme, requires a Don Quixote like search for some very specific talent set. 
Elam did not fit the talent set, (he also may simply not be talented).  This was an unforced error by the Bills.

I am not a football coach and not a GM. I don't have the exact answers.  But it seems to me the Bills should consider some of the following:

• Evaluate what talents/traits  are most commonly available in the draft and free agency. 
• Develop schemes (plural on purpose) that have a deeper pool of players to pull from to fit the schemes
• Retool the balance between "finding players for the scheme" to "fitting the scheme to the players".   Right now it seems to be 99%/1% on finding players for the scheme.  This does not seem sustainable. 

 

 

 

[DallasBillsFan1]

McDermott is on the hot seat this year.

[T master]

8 hours ago, Special K said:

With all the talk of the Eagles strong D-line, the other factor that contributed to the Eagles Defensive dominance of the Chiefs was the lockdown CB play from Slay and Mitchell.

 

The Lockdown version of Tre White pre-injury, coupled with Benford as a future CB1 playing as a CB2 would have allowed the Bills to lockdown the Chiefs WR's in the same manner as the Eagles did on Sunday.

 

Obviously the Bills pass rush is nothing like Philly, but I really would have liked the chance to see if a dominant White and Benford combo could have been the difference to get past the Chiefs.

 

Here's a question . Do you think seeing that Tre's contract was only for 1 season and that he will be a FA this coming season knowing that the Bills will need veteran depth at that position, do you think Beane might consider bringing Tre back as a depth player for a reasonable contract ?

 

He is 30 years old this year but his body although injured has had 2 full seasons mostly off recovering so he hasn't had the beating of play for those 2 seasons, does he have enough in the tank to bring him back as a depth player to pass on some much needed experience or could they change him to the safety position which will be another area of need ?

[Big Turk]

Bills used to have a legit no-fly zone where they held teams under 200 yards passing about half the time which was absurd.  I might argue in hindsight that Tremaine Edmunds leaving was the bigger loss...his wingspan and range in the middle of the field shut down a lot of passing concepts

Edited February 11 by Big Turk

[JP51]

I am going to probably get killed for this... but wondering what folks think... Tre White... depth corner... 30 years old.. signed to a team friendly 1 yr deal... maybe with an option... 1.5mm take the chance that he has recovered after a full year... and bring him in on the cheap as a depth piece...  I would say maybe work him into a safety position but he is too small and not a great tackler... so he would need to be a nickle/Dime guy, or a depth CB... thoughts... 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

2 minutes ago, JP51 said:

I am going to probably get killed for this... but wondering what folks think... Tre White... depth corner... 30 years old.. signed to a team friendly 1 yr deal... maybe with an option... 1.5mm take the chance that he has recovered after a full year... and bring him in on the cheap as a depth piece...  I would say maybe work him into a safety position but he is too small and not a great tackler... so he would need to be a nickle/Dime guy, or a depth CB... thoughts... 

rebuild with youth. I dont think he fits the style of play we want moving forward either.

[uticaclub]

34 minutes ago, DallasBillsFan1 said:

McDermott is on the hot seat this year.

Lol he’s been on the “hot seat” since :13 seconds. McDermott and Beane arent going anywhere until Allen demands a trade.

[TheBeaneBandit]

8 hours ago, Special K said:

With all the talk of the Eagles strong D-line, the other factor that contributed to the Eagles Defensive dominance of the Chiefs was the lockdown CB play from Slay and Mitchell.

 

The Lockdown version of Tre White pre-injury, coupled with Benford as a future CB1 playing as a CB2 would have allowed the Bills to lockdown the Chiefs WR's in the same manner as the Eagles did on Sunday.

 

Obviously the Bills pass rush is nothing like Philly, but I really would have liked the chance to see if a dominant White and Benford combo could have been the difference to get past the Chiefs.

I definitely believe that is what they were hoping for. Throw in the big miss on Elam and here we are. But it's the ever changing NFL you gotta swing again. I think we may have to pay up for a veteran CB this year and draft someone to keep in the pipeline this year. I'm not sold on Benford outside of this system so I'm very on the fence with paying him. Do worry all, we can still grab a DT or safety in free agency as well, go defense heavy in the draft with a WR sprinkled in , and even run it back with Cooper and Hollins. It may seem like a lot but after all the restructuring is over, we're gonna be fine.

[Don Otreply]

It was certainly the start of a bunch of injuries, and guys getting older and slower, it wouldn’t matter if Frazier was still on board, the defense wasn’t going to be able to maintain its level of play, couple this to a scheme that plays soft coverages regularly and you get what we got, time for some retooling on the D, hope Carter comes back healthy and ready to play, he can be a piece of the puzzle to get the D back on track, 🤞