The type of wide receiver Josh needs

[Buffalo Barbarian]

Gotta keep em separated 🎶🎶💃💃

 

 

[Doc Brown]

6 minutes ago, Logic said:

I just checked the WR thread from pre-draft last year to see what I was advocating for. 

At the time, I proposed trading our 1st and 2nd in that draft plus our 1st and 2nd this year if need be in order to get into range for Harrison, Nabers, Odunze, etc.

People called me crazy. They probably still would. Who knows if it would've been enough anyway.

I'd still make that move. Having Mack Hollins lead our team in touchdown catches did not talk me down from my crazy perch.

The general consensus was if we wanted a potential #1 WR moving up for BTJ was the most realistic from where we were drafting.  Sadly, a lot of us were right.

[Buffalo Barbarian]

1 hour ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

 

There's a lot of debate about what type of guy Josh needs... A big physical freak like DK... A Jamar Chase etc

 

Look what Josh did with John Brown.. arguably our offense , passing wise has never been the same since Brown left 

 

He was much better than Gabe, reliable hands good route runner and burner 

 

DeSean Jackson mold is the exact type guy we need to get Josh.. whether it's in the draft or getting a chase like guy 

 

I made a thread here years ago about wide receiver nuance in the route running.. about how the best have varied speeds in the route running.. they don't just all run full speed throughout the route that's easy to actually stop 

 

Need nuance, change of pace, leverage 

 

Watch DeSean Jackson in the clip up top.. going through multiple speeds in his route... Setting up and leveraging the safety just to go from 12 miles an hour to 22 in an instant 

 

That's real savvy route running with great speed 

 

A prime DeShaun Jackson would turn Josh unstoppable... I definitely would take Chase over DK because of route saviness and I hope we get get Josh a savvy route runner with some Wheels because that will take our offense and josh to another level

 

 

 

 

Josh was at his best with Brown and Beasley.

 

What players do you think we can get or draft like them ?

 

 

[Thurman#1]

He doesn't need any of them. They came within a dropped pass of the Super Bowl and the offense was really productive this year.

 

Who would fit best when they try to improve?

 

A route-runner, smooth, with good top speed, IMO. A Diggs type without the neediness, I think.

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Thurman#1

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

The most important player to Josh was early prime Beasley. A reliable guy that could extend drives and give him the easy out when plays broke down 

[Doc Brown]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

 

Josh was at his best with Brown and Beasley.

 

What players do you think we can get or draft like them ?

 

 

He was at his best in 2020 with Diggs, Brown, and Beasley.  A heavy emphasis on Diggs.

[Allen2Moulds]

Actually you can see by my handle, who I would've loved. Eric Mould was such a complete and underrated player

 

 

I will also add that it makes me sick, we didn't make a move to land Thomas. Bash me for criticizing Beane, but that was a really big miss. 

 

[Buffalo716]

58 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

 

Josh was at his best with Brown and Beasley.

 

What players do you think we can get or draft like them ?

 

 

Luther burden III

 

Missouri 

 

Production fell this year but he is a natural hands catcher.. super explosive off the line creating instant separation .. offers yac.. plays bigger than his size.. not 4.3 fast like Jackson... Probably 4.43 but like Odell he goes up

 

Matthew golden 

 

Texas 

 

Super savvy route runner for a guy with his electric speed, fights for balls at the top, creates quick separation but he shows a higg IQ in his route saviness

 

Both could probably be had late first into the mid-second

48 minutes ago, Allen2Moulds said:

Actually you can see by my handle, who I would've loved. Eric Mould was such a complete and underrated player

 

 

I will also add that it makes me sick, we didn't make a move to land Thomas. Bash me for criticizing Beane, but that was a really big miss. 

 

I don't know if you could say Eric moulds is really underrated 

 

He's always considered one of the top five wide receivers in bills history.. has 9,995 yards and was a dominant football player 

 

He had some consistency issues but Hall of Fame talent

Edited 3 hours ago by Buffalo716

[TBBills Fan]

1 hour ago, st pete gogolak said:

And we passed on Jackson . . . to pick a receiver!

A big bodied receiver. 

 

Oh man that is quite similar to this past year. Yikes 

[Low Positive]

52 minutes ago, Logic said:

In retrospect, I don't think there's a single Bills fan who wouldn't have been okay giving up an additional high pick or two to move up five spots for this guy.

Would've given Josh a locked-in high end #1 with size, speed, and explosiveness for the next decade. 

I get that Beane felt the roster needed to be rebuilt with depth last offseason and was thus hesitant to give up draft capital, but no one can convince me that Coleman plus, say, Dewayne Carter and another mid round pick would be worth more to this team's championship pursuits than a bona fide alpha WR1.

It takes two teams to trade. People keep talking about this like Beane can just trade up if we wants to, without taking other teams into account. Take a look at the picks between when Jacksonville traded back with Minnesota and when they picked Thomas Jr. and find a trade partner that wasn't filling a glaring need.

 

17 Minnesota Vikings Dallas Turner DE Alabama

18 Cincinnati Bengals Amarius Mims OT

19 Los Angeles Rams Jared Verse †DE

20 Pittsburgh Steelers Troy Fautanu OT

21 Miami Dolphins Chop Robinson DE

22 Philadelphia Eagles Quinyon Mitchell CB

23 Jacksonville JaguarsBrian Thomas Jr. †WR

 

Cincinnati has been trying to build an OL for years and had to address it there. Same goes with Pittsburgh. The rams had just lost Aaron Donald and needed pass rush in the worst way. The Eagles were rebuilding a secondary in a single draft and would have never moved from there with the best CB in the draft on the board. That leave the Fins. They probably would never trade with us. For all we know, Beane was trying to get up to take Thomas Jr.. 

 

[OldTimer1960]

1 hour ago, Alphadawg7 said:

I have always said Lee Evans played for the wrong Bills era, he would be insane with Allen

Great Lee Evans call.   He was so good but held back being on struggling teams.

[GASabresIUFan]

Ladd McConkey

 

In this draft, Emeka Egbuka.

[Buffalo716]

2 minutes ago, GASabresIUFan said:

Ladd McConkey

 

In this draft, Emeka Egbuka.

Egbuka is good but he's still going to be better in the slot and we have a bunch of those 

 

He has very limited exposure on the boundary and a small catch radius compared to his peers 

 

He's perfect for a rhythm offense like the dolphins

 

Edited 3 hours ago by Buffalo716

[BullBuchanan]

Tyreek Hill could be a FA if you're willing to overpay a prima donna on the downside of his career with off the field concerns.

[Doc Brown]

Just now, BullBuchanan said:

Tyreek Hill could be a FA if you're willing to overpay a prima donna on the downside of his career with off the field concerns.

Something tells me you're not a used car salesman.

[BullBuchanan]

Just now, Doc Brown said:

Something tells me you're not a used car salesman.

I am not. There's something about small, fast receivers that oddly have all the pros and cons of red sportscars though.

[The Frankish Reich]

Too much worry about what type of receiver he needs. The answer is "an elite receiver." That was Diggs in his prime, Cooper in his prime, but not Cooper now or Shakir or anyone else currently on the team. Unless Keon Coleman has another gear he's been hiding.

[Buffalo716]

11 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said:

Too much worry about what type of receiver he needs. The answer is "an elite receiver." That was Diggs in his prime, Cooper in his prime, but not Cooper now or Shakir or anyone else currently on the team. Unless Keon Coleman has another gear he's been hiding.

Elite wide receiver is such a nondescript term... People thought diggs went from elite to not in one year lol

 

There are elite route runners, elite speedsters, elite hands guys..  football's not x + y = z.. guys get it done differently 

 

Now what I think you're trying to say is you just want a Hall of Fame type player.. which any team all 32 would take 

 

Yes give me Randy Moss they don't grow on trees.. you need to be able to develop a 22-year-old kid and turn him great

 

Elite is subjective.. and changes yearly based on statistics.. what doesn't change is pure talent and hard work

Edited 3 hours ago by Buffalo716

[JohnNord]

2 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

 

 

There's a lot of debate about what type of guy Josh needs... A big physical freak like DK... A Jamar Chase etc

 

Look what Josh did with John Brown.. arguably our offense , passing wise has never been the same since Brown left 

 

He was much better than Gabe, reliable hands good route runner and burner 

 

DeSean Jackson mold is the exact type guy we need to get Josh.. whether it's in the draft or getting a chase like guy 

 

I made a thread here years ago about wide receiver nuance in the route running.. about how the best have varied speeds in the route running.. they don't just all run full speed throughout the route that's easy to actually stop 

 

Need nuance, change of pace, leverage 

 

Watch DeSean Jackson in the clip up top.. going through multiple speeds in his route... Setting up and leveraging the safety just to go from 12 miles an hour to 22 in an instant 

 

That's real savvy route running with great speed 

 

A prime DeShaun Jackson would turn Josh unstoppable... I definitely would take Chase over DK because of route saviness and I hope we get get Josh a savvy route runner with some Wheels because that will take our offense and josh to another level

 

 

If you look at the current WR’s there’s two traits that are missing:

 

- vertical speed

- separation (route running)

 

The Bills need to add 2 receivers with these attributes.  
 

Shakir, Samuel, and Coleman have their strengths but mostly in the intermediate areas.  

 

 

 

 

 

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

Elite wide receiver is such a nondescript term... People thought diggs went from elite to not in one year lol

 

There are elite route runners, elite speedsters, elite hands guys..  football's not x + y = z.. guys get it done differently 

 

Now what I think you're trying to say is you just want a Hall of Fame type player.. which any team all 32 would take 

 

Yes give me Randy Moss they don't grow on trees.. you need to be able to develop a 22-year-old kid and turn him great

Not really… over the past few years we’re seeing more WR’s contribute as rookies. 

[Buffalo716]

4 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

If you look at the current WR’s there’s two traits that are missing:

 

- vertical speed

- separation (route running)

 

The Bills need to add 2 receivers with these attributes.  
 

Shakir, Samuel, and Coleman have their strengths but mostly in the intermediate areas.  

 

 

 

 

 

Not really… over the past few years we’re seeing more WR’s contribute as rookies. 

Yeah, but again it's all subjective 

 

People thought Odell Beckham was going to be the best wide receiver of his era and I knew he was going to fall off a cliff because wear and tear 

 

Having a good three years is different than having a good 12 years 

 

If you're drafting a wide receiver in the top 15-20  yeah he should be special lol

 

But you need to be able to turn second round picks third round picks with really good talent and make better at the NFL level... 

 

It's one thing to develop a player with traits and make him consistently great.. it's another thing to just take a kid top 15

 

And even then that doesn't always work because Sammy Watkins was supposed to be the best draft prospect at wide receiver in 15 years and look what happened... We got the best prospect and he busted

Edited 3 hours ago by Buffalo716