Beane/McDermott End of season press conferences (Beane live now, Sean at 2pm)

[VW82]

39 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Hot take - they were very bad against Baltimore too but Lamar and Andrews made crushing unforced errors. And we probably would have given up 4 straight TDs to start the Chiefs game if Mahomes didn't randomly drop the ball.

 

Let's stop with this fantasy that the defense is ever going to perform at a championship level. We're either going to run up the score or it's never going to happen for us.

 

Andrews had the ball punched out from behind by Bernard in what can only be described as an exceptional play. You really going to characterize that as an unforced error?? Lamar thoroughly outplayed Josh outside of two bad plays. Let's at least be real about happened.

 

GoBills tried to say our defense is historically bad, hence my reply to him. We were not an historically bad defense this season. We were just mediocre which is never good enough to win a SB, hence my reply to you.

 

We don't need our defense to perform at a championship level. We just need to be regular good as we have been the last eight years. You're just outing yourself as a McD hater. I get the instinct given how thoroughly he's been outcoached by Reid, but the fact that hasn't generally happened outside of that specific playoff match up would suggest it's more of a final hurdle to clear than some indication that it can't happen period.

Edited Friday at 11:43 PM by VW82

[harmonkillebrew]

3 hours ago, BananaB said:

The don’t need to annihilate anyone. How about we just start with not giving up 7 on almost every opening drive. Then if they gotta make a stop at the end instead of letting the opposing team run out the clock, make a ***** stop. There wasn’t a person watching that game that didn’t believe the game wasn’t over after Kincaid dropped the ball. lol. We had 3 timeouts and 2 minutes left ffs! Some teams would have punted instead of going for it on 4th down. Jones and Dawkins had there end of game congratulations ***** walking off the field with 2 minutes left.  Say what you want about clutch, but our D is the biggest problem. 
 

Last year was the same thing after Bass missed the kick. 3 timeouts and 1:15 on the clock. Game over

yeah that Dawkins - Jones hug was weird given the time left.  Our D sucked.  It needs to be re-hauled, no question.

 

But I'd like to see us still try to get a #1WR.  Amari didn't have it, unfortunately. 

[HappyDays]

7 minutes ago, VW82 said:

You really going to characterize that as an unforced error??

 

Mostly yes. Defenders are always going to punch at the ball. He made a big mistake trying to run horizontally instead of running vertically away from the defenders or just going down, and then he just got careless with the ball.

 

Either way it's undebateable that our defensive scheme and play calling and overall play was not remotely good enough in either game. We forced two punts over two games. The Chiefs once again had historically elite efficiency against us. It's the same story we see in every single playoff run. I'm honestly at a loss that anybody could think it is going to change at this point.

 

I know we can get past KC but it's not going to happen through the defense. 40 points per game. That should be the goal.

[VW82]

3 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

 

Mostly yes. Defenders are always going to punch at the ball. He made a big mistake trying to run horizontally instead of running vertically away from the defenders or just going down, and then he just got careless with the ball.

 

Either way it's undebateable that our defensive scheme and play calling and overall play was not remotely good enough in either game. We forced two punts over two games. The Chiefs once again had historically elite efficiency against us. It's the same story we see in every single playoff run. I'm honestly at a loss that anybody could think it is going to change at this point.

 

I know we can get past KC but it's not going to happen through the defense. 40 points per game. That should be the goal.

 

Agree to disagree on Bernard/Andrews. That was a spectacular defensive play, not an unforced offensive error.

 

How about we strive for 40 points but also be cognizant that we need to hold opposing offenses under 40 points?? Again, what team has won the SB with an actual historically bad defense (not what GoBills would describe as historically bad)? How about we try and bolster both??

[Coach Tuesday]

7 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

Agree to disagree on Bernard/Andrews. That was a spectacular defensive play, not an unforced offensive error.

 

How about we strive for 40 points but also be cognizant that we need to hold opposing offenses under 40 points?? Again, what team has won the SB with an actual historically bad defense (not what GoBills would describe as historically bad)? How about we try and bolster both??

Just not correct.  Lots of film breakdowns out there.  Bernard guessed wrong about where Andrews was cutting and it left him wide open.  Bernard has struggled a bit in zone this year compared to last year for whatever reason.  Still was a beautiful peanut punch.

[VW82]

1 minute ago, Coach Tuesday said:

Just not correct.  Lots of film breakdowns out there.  Bernard guessed wrong about where Andrews was cutting and it left him wide open.  Bernard has struggled a bit in zone this year compared to last year for whatever reason.  Still was a beautiful peanut punch.

 

You mean the part that counted?

[GoBills808]

10 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

Agree to disagree on Bernard/Andrews. That was a spectacular defensive play, not an unforced offensive error.

 

How about we strive for 40 points but also be cognizant that we need to hold opposing offenses under 40 points?? Again, what team has won the SB with an actual historically bad defense (not what GoBills would describe as historically bad)? How about we try and bolster both??

at least quote me lol

 

and yes- historically bad

 

Bills defense against the Chiefs in their four playoff losses

 

17 touchdowns
7 field goals
6 punts
3 end of half kneel-downs
3 end of game kneeldowns
2 turnovers (both fumbles)
1 missed field goal

Average points per game: 34.75
Points per drive: 3.56

 

For the record, the Detroit Lions led the NFL in points per drive at 3.09 in 2024.

 

If you’re keeping score (pun intended), the Bills have allowed 24 scoring drives out of 39 possessions. Take out six kneel-downs and it’s 24 out of 33, for a scoring rate of 72.7% and a touchdown rate of 51.5%. The Chiefs have never had to punt more than twice in any of these postseason meetings and have averaged 34.75 points in their wins. Sunday’s game marked Kansas City’s season high in points scored (32) and tied for a season high in first downs (28).

[VW82]

Just now, GoBills808 said:

at least quote me lol

 

and yes- historically bad

 

Bills defense against the Chiefs in their four playoff losses

 

17 touchdowns
7 field goals
6 punts
3 end of half kneel-downs
3 end of game kneeldowns
2 turnovers (both fumbles)
1 missed field goal

Average points per game: 34.75
Points per drive: 3.56

 

For the record, the Detroit Lions led the NFL in points per drive at 3.09 in 2024.

 

If you’re keeping score (pun intended), the Bills have allowed 24 scoring drives out of 39 possessions. Take out six kneel-downs and it’s 24 out of 33, for a scoring rate of 72.7% and a touchdown rate of 51.5%. The Chiefs have never had to punt more than twice in any of these postseason meetings and have averaged 34.75 points in their wins. Sunday’s game marked Kansas City’s season high in points scored (32) and tied for a season high in first downs (28).

 

So four different teams playing against four different teams spread out over four years while completely discounting everything else that happened over those four years...c'mon man.

[GoBills808]

Just now, VW82 said:

 

So four different teams playing against four different teams spread out over four years while completely discounting everything else that happened over those four years...c'mon man.

do i really need to qualify historically bad in the playoffs? should be pretty obvious that's what we've been talking about, yes

[BillsFan130]

2 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

at least quote me lol

 

and yes- historically bad

 

Bills defense against the Chiefs in their four playoff losses

 

17 touchdowns
7 field goals
6 punts
3 end of half kneel-downs
3 end of game kneeldowns
2 turnovers (both fumbles)
1 missed field goal

Average points per game: 34.75
Points per drive: 3.56

 

For the record, the Detroit Lions led the NFL in points per drive at 3.09 in 2024.

 

If you’re keeping score (pun intended), the Bills have allowed 24 scoring drives out of 39 possessions. Take out six kneel-downs and it’s 24 out of 33, for a scoring rate of 72.7% and a touchdown rate of 51.5%. The Chiefs have never had to punt more than twice in any of these postseason meetings and have averaged 34.75 points in their wins. Sunday’s game marked Kansas City’s season high in points scored (32) and tied for a season high in first downs (28).

You are not going to give the Bills defence credit for the end of half kneel down? It was great scheme and execution all around..

[VW82]

1 minute ago, GoBills808 said:

do i really need to qualify historically bad in the playoffs? should be pretty obvious that's what we've been talking about, yes

 

We're not historically bad in the playoffs though. We've had a lot of good defensive playoff performances over the past six years.

Edited yesterday at 12:16 AM by VW82

[GoBills808]

3 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

We're not historically bad in the playoffs though. We've had a lot of good defensive playoff performances over the past six years.

is this seriously news to you? this is from last season- adding this seasons performance will cement it further

 

 

[VW82]

7 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

is this seriously news to you? this is from last season- adding this seasons performance will cement it further

 

 

 

This is a classic strawman argument. Rather than addressing my objection that we're historically bad, you pivot to trying to compare us to our regular season selves so as to make it seem like we're historically bad (in comparison with ourselves). Nice try.

[GoBills808]

4 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

This is a classic strawman argument. Rather than addressing my objection that we're historically bad, you pivot to trying to compare us to our regular season selves so as to make it seem like we're historically bad (in comparison with ourselves). Nice try.

you understand allowing 380ypg and 24.8ppg would put you at or near the bottom of NFL defenses, season in season out

 

maybe you don't. either way historically bad playoff defense

[VW82]

37 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

you understand allowing 380ypg and 24.8ppg would put you at or near the bottom of NFL defenses, season in season out

 

maybe you don't. either way historically bad playoff defense

 

Let's do a McD-era experiment and calcualte relative points given up defensively per playoff opponenet (i.e. +/- points given up relative to opponents' regular season average). I understand this isn't perfect because there are a lot of variables in a playoff game but presumably some of those variables will even out over 7 seasons. In order to keep this apples to apples I'm going to limit to final score through four quarters (no OT). Also, + is bad - is good. 

 

2017: Bills vs. Jags: -6.1

2019: Bills vs. Houston: -5.1

2020: Bills vs. Colts: -4.2

2020: Bills vs. Ravens: -26.3

2020: Bills vs. Chiefs: +8.4

2021: Bills vs. Pats: -10.2

2021: Bills vs. Chiefs: +13.8

2022: Bills vs. Dolphins: +7.6

2022: Bills vs. Bengals: +0.9

2023: Bills vs. Steelers: -0.9

2023: Bills vs. Chiefs: +5.2

2024: Bills vs. Broncos: -18.0

2024: Bills vs. Ravens: -5.5

2024: Bills vs. Chiefs: +9.4

 

Average relative playoff defense: -2.214

 

So...out of 14 playoff games in the McD era, on average we've held playoff opponents to 2.214 points below their regular season average. 

 

Yes, we've had some trouble with specific match ups, but STOP WITH THE HYPERBOLE. WE ARE NOT HISTORICALLY BAD EVEN IN THE POSTSEASON!!!

Edited yesterday at 01:12 AM by VW82

[GoBills808]

22 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

Let's do a McD-era experiment and calcualte relative points given up defensively per playoff opponenet (i.e. +/- points given up relative to opponents' regular season average). I understand this isn't perfect because there are a lot of variables in a playoff game but presumably some of those variables will even out over 7 seasons. In order to keep this apples to apples I'm going to limit to final score through four quarters (no OT). Also, + is bad - is good. 

 

2017: Bills vs. Jags: -6.1

2019: Bills vs. Houston: -5.1

2020: Bills vs. Colts: -4.2

2020: Bills vs. Ravens: -26.3

2020: Bills vs. Chiefs: +8.4

2021: Bills vs. Pats: -10.2

2021: Bills vs. Chiefs: +13.8

2022: Bills vs. Dolphins: +7.6

2022: Bills vs. Bengals: +0.9

2023: Bills vs. Steelers: -0.9

2023: Bills vs. Chiefs: +5.2

2024: Bills vs. Broncos: -18.0

2024: Bills vs. Ravens: -5.5

2024: Bills vs. Chiefs: +9.4

 

Average relative playoff defense: -2.214

 

So...out of 14 playoff games in the McD era, on average we've held playoff opponents to 2.214 points below their regular season average. 

 

Yes, we've had some trouble with specific match ups, but STOP WITH THE HYPERBOLE. WE ARE NOT HISTORICALLY BAD EVEN IN THE POSTSEASON!!!

all this work and i could have spared you the trouble- i'll agree our defense is merely poor in the playoffs when considering 'average relative playoff ppg surrendered vs regular season including games played in a hurricane and against bo nix'

 

now we are in full agreement

[VW82]

9 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

all this work and i could have spared you the trouble- i'll agree our defense is merely poor in the playoffs when considering 'average relative playoff ppg surrendered vs regular season including games played in a hurricane and against bo nix'

 

now we are in full agreement

 

Nope. The point of that exercise was that our playoff defense has been statisically above average over the McD era despite your claims to the contrary. Read that post again.

Edited yesterday at 01:38 AM by VW82

[T.E.]

1 hour ago, VW82 said:

Lamar thoroughly outplayed Josh outside of two bad plays. Let's at least be real about happened.

This is what actually happened. McDermott went into playoff choke-job mode and put Allen on the shelf for the entire second half because he was so terrified of turning the ball over. Then he instituted his full-time prevent defense which didn't even make an attempt an attempt to go after Jackson or do anything aggressive.

 

You can't get outplayed if your coach doesn't allow you to play in the first place.

Edited yesterday at 01:41 AM by T.E.

[VW82]

1 minute ago, T.E. said:

This is what actually happened. McDermott went into playoff choke-job mode and put Allen on the shelf for the entire second half because he was so terrified of turning the ball over. Then he instituted his full-time prevent defense which didn't even make an attempt an attempt to go after Jackson or do anything aggressive.

 

You can't get outplayed if your coqch doesn't allow you to play in the first place.

 

This is at least a fair argument.

[GoBills808]

9 minutes ago, VW82 said:

 

Nope. The point of that exercise was that our playoff defense has been statisically above average over the McD era despite your claims to the contrary. Read that post again.