Kurt Warner breaks down the 4th down. Allen error?

[oldmanfan]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

There wasn’t anyone on the left to come. The numbers were to the right. But they thought they were bluffing. Now maybe he slid it to Chris Jones. That’s actually my guess. Chris Jones is the guy you want extra attention to. So they ignore the pressure look and thought KC was bluffing.

 

Thats just unacceptable to me. Allen is going to think about it all offseason.

I’ll say it again:  sometimes it’s not you doing something wrong, it’s the other guy doing something right.  And that was a brilliant defensive call

[Julio Hopkins]

***** me, Brady ran a mesh concept on the most important play of the season like a kid running back to mama.  

[harmonkillebrew]

2 minutes ago, Julio Hopkins said:

***** me, Brady ran a mesh concept on the most important play of the season like a kid running back to mama.  

but Ty Johnson should have broken off his route when his guy blitzed. As Warner says, do a sight adjust to the boundary to give Allen an option on that side.

He either did the wrong thing or wasn't coached to do that. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

9 minutes ago, oldmanfan said:

I’ll say it again:  sometimes it’s not you doing something wrong, it’s the other guy doing something right.  And that was a brilliant defensive call

It’s how I love to call defense. But there are ways to beat it built into the play. First is setting the right protection.

 

It was a mess that Allen almost saves with an amazing throw.

 

Timeout should’ve been called by coach imo. Thats hindsight but if im the coach looking at 6 rushers vs 5, im calling timeout.

Edited Monday at 10:42 PM by Buffalo_Stampede

[Einstein]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

There wasn’t anyone on the left to come. The numbers were to the right.

 

This is wrong.

 

There were 3 rushers on the left and 3 on the right.

 

One of the 3 on the right was a showing blitzer that had dropped back all game long. So in the offenses mind it was 3 on the left and 2 on the right.

The numbers were on the left. Or if you include the showing blitzer, it was even. And the left side had a DE split out wideeee.

 

 

 

 

 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

2 minutes ago, Einstein said:

 

This is wrong.

 

There were 3 rushers on the left and 3 on the right.

 

One of the 3 on the right was a showing blitzer that had dropped back all game long. So in the offenses mind it was 3 on the left and 2 on the right.

The numbers were on the left. Or if you include the showing blitzer, it was even. And the left side had a DE split out wideeee.

 

 

 

 

 

3v3. And you gave your hots on that side if they all come.

Edited Monday at 10:45 PM by Buffalo_Stampede

[Einstein]

7 minutes ago, Julio Hopkins said:

***** me, Brady ran a mesh concept on the most important play of the season like a kid running back to mama.  

 

Been screaming this since it happened.

He ran that same tired 4th down beater that takes several seconds to develop on the most crucial down of the season.

 

1 minute ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

3v3.

 

Yeah. At best (they had been dropping that defender back all game).

 

The numbers were not to the right. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Just now, Einstein said:

 

Been screaming this since it happened.

He ran that same tired 4th down beater that takes several seconds to develop on the most crucial down of the season.

 

 

Yeah. At best (they had been dropping that defender back all game).

 

The numbers were not to the right. 

If you’re snapping the ball with 6 rushers potentially coming you have a hot ready.

 

They literally just thought KC was bluffing. Thats unacceptable in my opinion.

[Julio Hopkins]

1 minute ago, harmonkillebrew said:

but Ty Johnson should have broken off his route when his guy blitzed. As Warner says, do a sight adjust to the boundary to give Allen an option on that side.

He either did the wrong thing or wasn't coached to do that. 

 

I'm not criticizing the execution or the coaching behind it.  I don't have statistical analysis behind it, but I believe they ran a LOT of mesh plays this year.  This was the play of the season where you bring out something new.  Be it a new concept or a variation of a concept to throw the defense off.  I just think Brady had a really poor game on top of a really poor showing against the Ravens.  

[Buffalo Barbarian]

51 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

It was wrong. Protection was set wrong. And Spencer Brown for whatever reason doesn’t slide left

 

Its not wrong when they always show right but blitz left , however this this time they blitzed right from the right. Josh isnt that dumb to slide protection away from the obvious, Spags just out tricked us.

 

 

[3rdand12]

46 minutes ago, harmonkillebrew said:

So many issues here with protection on this play and Ty not doing the sight adjust to make himself available as a hot once his CB blitzes.

Josh did all he could, that guy Torrence was supposed to block was on him in no time before he could even flip his body around and toss to Shakir.  And Josh still almost made the amazing pass to Kincaid by avoiding the two blitzers, but Brown couldn't hold his block on Karlaftis who affected the throw and put Josh on his back.

And yet still, Kincaid should have caught it.

 

Makes you wonder about the coaching. but man Josh gives us a chance on every play. He needs more guys around him to step up. 

 

 

I am ending the season with this thought ^ 
Well done !

 expand to see bolded please

Edited Monday at 11:03 PM by 3rdand12

[Buffalo_Stampede]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo Barbarian said:

 

Its not wrong when they always show right but blitz left , however this this time they blitzed right from the right. Josh isnt that dumb to slide protection away from the obvious, Spags just out tricked us.

 

 

Thats not how it works. There are hots built into for this stuff. You set protection and you have your hots if they do come. 
 

The protection set gave no chance to get to the hots. There is no way Joe Brady designed the play this way. 
 

They thought KC was bluffing and weren’t ready for the blitz. 

Edited Monday at 10:58 PM by Buffalo_Stampede

[3rdand12]

39 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

it's about making plays

 

Spagnuolo made a great playcall, Allen beat it w an even better play. Kincaid can't finish the catch

 

you have got to make the play. it's the biggest moment of the season. just make the play. the reason we're not talking about Mahomes messing up a protection read is because his lob into double coverage got ripped away from Bishop by Worthy.

 

[Old Coot]

1 hour ago, Billz4ever said:

They already explained why the protection was called as it was.  It was based on what they had been showing earlier in the game.

This is what coaches do. They set things up during the game so at the end of the half or end of game they spring the set-up play on the opponent. Both O & D coaches do it.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Last thing I’ll say.

 

Joe Brady calls a play. We have 5 blockers. They show 6 rushers.

 

From what I’m reading here from a lot of people is our options are to hope they don’t blitz or surrender and accept defeat if they blitz. 

[Billz4ever]

7 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Last thing I’ll say.

 

Joe Brady calls a play. We have 5 blockers. They show 6 rushers.

 

From what I’m reading here from a lot of people is our options are to hope they don’t blitz or surrender and accept defeat if they blitz. 

 

Teams show fake pressure all the time and back out of it.  Our D does it a lot.  You don't see the other team calling T.O. just because we show pressure.

 

The Chiefs literally did that in that play. Bolton showed blitz up the middle and backed out into coverage. 

 

And just FYI, Josh routinely faces plays where the defense sends more rushers than they have blockers.  Josh probably has a handful of touchdowns and a lot of first downs if you want to go back and analyze the film of Josh Allen against the Blitz this season.

 

 

Edited Monday at 11:26 PM by Billz4ever

[colin]

I said earlier in the season the real issue w the line was out stunt and blitz pick up.  They seemed to figure it out for a while, but spags saw a ***** in the armor.

 

It's odd to me that Torrence didn't block anyone and Brown went right.  If the protection was shifted left, the only free runner should have been on the right, not the gut.  I think Spencer went right.

 

If the most central guy got picked up, I think it's an easy throw and hopefully catch.

[Alphadawg7]

1 hour ago, Billz4ever said:

 

They already explained why the protection was called as it was.  It was based on what they had been showing earlier in the game.

 

 

 

And this is the difference between good coaches and great coaches.  While they set this up the Bills kept running the same bastard version of a disaster tush push into the same gap over and over again where the Chiefs were selling out to stop.  

[HappyDays]

And still I don't know why the obsession is over the protection call. It didn't matter. Even if the protection was perfect, Kincaid was wide the hell open and would have been the target and would have needed to come down with the catch. For as wide open as he was a pop fly was the best possible throw because it's impossible to conceive that he could fail to track and catch it with so much space around him.

 

Look at it from this angle:

 

There's nothing but space in every direction! This is worse than muffing a punt. There's nothing else about this play that is worth talking about. The guy that we traded up for in the 1st round choked, plain and simple.

 

Edited Monday at 11:37 PM by HappyDays

[Motorin']

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Josh said he slid protection left. Warner says you should slide it right. 

 

Did Josh mess up? Did Spencer Brown mess up? If they slid left like Allen says then Brown blocked the wrong rusher.

 

 

 

Warner's point about the sight adjustment for the lone receiver is so valid. He has 10-12 yards cushion from the safety, who is also five yards inside. That should be an automatic pitch and catch for the first down.