Kurt Warner breaks down the 4th down. Allen error?

[Simon]

14 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

The guy that we traded up for in the 1st round choked, plain and simple.

 

 

Are you referring to Allen?

Kincaid was running exactly where he was supposed to be running.

That ball was 15 yrds short of where it should have been and he had to make a tough adjustment to stop on a dead sprint and come back for it.

[HappyDays]

1 minute ago, Simon said:

 

He was running exactly where he was supposed to be running.

The ball was 15 yrds short of where it should have been and he had to make a tough adjustment to stop on a dead sprint and come back for it.

 

I don't agree with that all. It's zone and his zone is completely vacated. He needs to stop running about 5 yards before he does. Where is he running to? Then he needs to see the ball in the air and track it like a punt. He runs himself out of the play, fails to track the ball properly, then makes an awkward attempt to make up for it and can't finish the catch that he made more difficult for himself.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

10 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

And still I don't know why the obsession is over the protection call. It didn't matter. Even if the protection was perfect, Kincaid was wide the hell open and would have been the target and would have needed to come down with the catch. For as wide open as he was a pop fly was the best possible throw because it's impossible to conceive that he could fail to track and catch it with so much space around him.

 

Look at it from this angle:

 

There's nothing but space in every direction! This is worse than muffing a punt. There's nothing else about this play that is worth talking about. The guy that we traded up for in the 1st round choked, plain and simple.

 

That’s a new one. It’s too loud to protect the QB on 4th down and Super Bowl! 😂

 

Call a timeout! 

 

 

8 minutes ago, Simon said:

 

Are you referring to Allen?

Kincaid was running exactly where he was supposed to be running.

That ball was 15 yrds short of where it should have been and he had to make a tough adjustment to stop on a dead sprint and come back for it.

And the ball was curving as it came down. I think it was a ball he thinks he should catch but it was not an easy catch.

[Simon]

1 minute ago, HappyDays said:

Where is he running to?

 

He's running into the vacated zone and the further he ran into it, the more open he was.

If Allen had been able to throw from any platform whatsoever that play ends up inside the 10 or possibly in the endzone.

He should have made the tough catch, but he shouldn't have had to even make a catch that was tough.

That ball should have been 15 yrds in front of where it was and that was what he was anticipating, imo.

[Dablitzkrieg]

1 hour ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

It’s just bugging me today because there’s absolutely no reason to slide protection to the left. 
 

The play is driving me crazy. It’s worse than 13 seconds. 

Yeah, no it's not

[SirAndrew]

21 minutes ago, HappyDays said:

And still I don't know why the obsession is over the protection call. It didn't matter. Even if the protection was perfect, Kincaid was wide the hell open and would have been the target and would have needed to come down with the catch. For as wide open as he was a pop fly was the best possible throw because it's impossible to conceive that he could fail to track and catch it with so much space around him.

 

Look at it from this angle:

 

There's nothing but space in every direction! This is worse than muffing a punt. There's nothing else about this play that is worth talking about. The guy that we traded up for in the 1st round choked, plain and simple.

 

That was a great video. Kincaid basically needed to make the catch like a baseball outfielder. Instead he poorly tracked the ball, ran incredibly slow (as usual), and made the catch much more difficult than it needed to be. It would have been a very tough catch, but I think he made it that way. 

[BillsFanForever19]

Kurt Warner's viewpoint demands more respect that the fan Fitz is replying to. But the sentiment remains the same:

 

 

[Billz4ever]

31 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

 

And this is the difference between good coaches and great coaches.  While they set this up the Bills kept running the same bastard version of a disaster tush push into the same gap over and over again where the Chiefs were selling out to stop.  

 

I was losing my mind watching that.

[Best Williams Available]

1 hour ago, JakeFrommStateFarm said:

The way to beat that jailbreak in protection was to have a check down.

 

That's on Brady not Josh

Also don’t go empty set, put a RB back there to save Josh if needed. Also a safety outlet. Brady sucked the last 2 weeks.

[Alphadawg7]

1 minute ago, Billz4ever said:

 

I was losing my mind watching that.

Same, it wasn’t even a tush push anymore, it was absurd 

[SirAndrew]

1 minute ago, Billz4ever said:

 

I was losing my mind watching that.

I just can’t get those plays out of my head. It was like running repeatedly into a brick wall. That summed up the loss, and I can’t even move on to analyze other portions of the game. 

[Simon]

5 minutes ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Same, it wasn’t even a tush push anymore, it was absurd 

 

I mean, they still had a guy pushing him.

It just happened to be a scrawny TE from Utah with a bad knee. 

[Buffalo_Stampede]

4 minutes ago, Best Williams Available said:

Also don’t go empty set, put a RB back there to save Josh if needed. Also a safety outlet. Brady sucked the last 2 weeks.

At least we saved our timeouts because we all knew we’d stop Mahomes and get the ball back.

 

Shakir is basically the outlet there. I just don’t get the play. I think this will drive Allen crazy all off season. I’m not sure what the plan was if the blitz came.

[SirAndrew]

3 minutes ago, Best Williams Available said:

Also don’t go empty set, put a RB back there to save Josh if needed. Also a safety outlet. Brady sucked the last 2 weeks.

Brady was absolutely terrible, and I’m

surprised that isn’t universally agreed upon here. Any Madden play caller could score points with Allen. It’s all what you do when it counts most, and Brady has nothing special. He runs the same stuff over and over. We’ve seen the same short pass plays to Cook and Shakir all season with very little variation. We have the talent to succeed, but putting that repetitiveness on tape against someone like Spags is bad news. 

[Billz4ever]

3 minutes ago, Best Williams Available said:

Also don’t go empty set, put a RB back there to save Josh if needed. Also a safety outlet. Brady sucked the last 2 weeks.

Or maybe even better, have the back there off Josh's right and if they come, Josh tosses it right over their heads to a wide open back who has nothing but daylight ahead of him. 

 

It's all hindsight at this point, and in the end Kincaid should've caught the ball. Just more things to stew on over this offseason.  When fans try and dissect plays as much as we are and think about the "what could've beens" you've got to wonder how much it eats at the players who were actually there living it.

[SirAndrew]

6 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

At least we saved our timeouts because we all knew we’d stop Mahomes and get the ball back.

 

Shakir is basically the outlet there. I just don’t get the play. I think this will drive Allen crazy all off season. I’m not sure what the plan was if the blitz came.

The inability to force a punt after the Kincaid play is an underrated defensive fail as well. I’m not saying we had a great chance anymore, but that’s where a competent defense makes a stop. 

[Best Williams Available]

2 minutes ago, Buffalo_Stampede said:

At least we saved our timeouts because we all knew we’d stop Mahomes and get the ball back.

 

Shakir is basically the outlet there. I just don’t get the play. I think this will drive Allen crazy all off season. I’m not sure what the plan was if the blitz came.

Since Josh read zone D, Shakir is an outlet but also like 3rd or 4th in the progression. They’ve ran that play with a RB back there before. There was no plan for a blitz as all receivers on the right were running 10 yard routes. So frustrating.

[Buffalo_Stampede]

Just now, Best Williams Available said:

Since Josh read zone D, Shakir is an outlet but also like 3rd or 4th in the progression. They’ve ran that play with a RB back there before. There was no plan for a blitz as all receivers on the right were running 10 yard routes. So frustrating.

Bingo! When KC didn’t show man I’m calling timeout. I don’t like what could happen.

 

I didn’t hear the Torrence comment that was posted about them bluffing that blitz all game but you can’t believe they will bluff on 4th down. This is the game.

 

 

[bobobonators]

Kincaid catches that ball and Allen is a hero. This thread doesn’t exist. 

[Billz4ever]

Just now, Buffalo_Stampede said:

Bingo! When KC didn’t show man I’m calling timeout. I don’t like what could happen.

 

I didn’t hear the Torrence comment that was posted about them bluffing that blitz all game but you can’t believe they will bluff on 4th down. This is the game.

 

 

 

And in the end, Kincaid dropped the ball, which could've happened had the protection been perfect. It's largely irrelevant. If a ball hits a receiver in the hands, the last thing I'm worried about was the protection called on the play.  Allen beat the blitz like he's done countless times and got the throw off.  The ball was thrown to a spot where an NFL receiver should've been able to make a play. He didn't. End of story.