"13 Seconds", help me out here

[JohnNord]

2 hours ago, MJS said:

In what way did McDermott collapse?

I’ve you are going to criticize McDermott, it’s not really fair to use 2019.  The Bills were the road underdog and lower seed playing on the road. 
 

Bills fans don’t want to face the reality that Josh greatly contributed to that loss.  He took a sack that knocked them out of FG range and fumbled at midfield that led to a Texans TD.   He was not the only issue and to his credit he led them to a tie FG, but that sequence is how the game flipped.  
 

Also if you remember, Frazier called the perfect blitz on 3rd down and Milano and Taron had Watson dead to rights.  It was a fluke he escaped.  
 

So a loss is a loss, but to say they “collapsed” is not being intellectually honest.  

[MJS]

Just now, JohnNord said:

I’ve you are going to criticize McDermott, it’s not really fair to use 2019.  The Bills were the road underdog and lower seed playing on the road. 
 

Bills fans don’t want to face the reality that Josh greatly contributed to that loss.  He took a sack that knocked them out of FG range and fumbled at midfield that led to a Texans TD.   He was not the only issue and to his credit he led them to a tie FG, but that sequence is how the game flipped.  
 

Also if you remember, Frazier called the perfect blitz on 3rd down and Milano and Taron had Watson dead to rights.  It was a fluke he escaped.  
 

So a loss is a loss, but to say they “collapsed” is not being intellectually honest.  

Yeah, I agree. Which is why I asked. I didn't remember anything from the coaches causing a collapse. But it was a long time ago.

 

I think if the Bills lose a game there are some fans who just blame everything on McDermott. As the head coach, he always shoulders some blame, but was he the primary reason? No. I would put more blame on the players' lack of execution in that game.

[DCOrange]

21 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

I’ve you are going to criticize McDermott, it’s not really fair to use 2019.  The Bills were the road underdog and lower seed playing on the road. 
 

Bills fans don’t want to face the reality that Josh greatly contributed to that loss.  He took a sack that knocked them out of FG range and fumbled at midfield that led to a Texans TD.   He was not the only issue and to his credit he led them to a tie FG, but that sequence is how the game flipped.  
 

Also if you remember, Frazier called the perfect blitz on 3rd down and Milano and Taron had Watson dead to rights.  It was a fluke he escaped.  
 

So a loss is a loss, but to say they “collapsed” is not being intellectually honest.  

I was at that game and remember thinking we should just run the ball at that moment because at the time, Josh was super prone to those back breaking sacks. And the terror I felt as he started retreating was not fun.

 

I was also losing my mind at that halftime kickoff; most people hadn't returned to their seats yet when that happened and I was freaking out because I had noticed he never actually took a knee. At the time I thought it was a TD for us. 

[3rdand12]

19 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

Close. I work in a middle school. This has been a meme for years.

Some of my Grand Daughters sang it in the back seat while I try not to scream while driving. Thank goodness that phase is over !

Elsa Elsa Elsa

BTW Pretty awesome you are in Education. Would not have guessed actually

 

[FireChans]

4 hours ago, MJS said:

In what way did McDermott collapse?

Aren’t you a big “the HC gets all the credit and blame because it’s all his responsibility?” guy?

 

If so, McD collapsed because the offense was terrible in the second half, the moment was too big for Josh and co, they were playing wild and out of control and puked all over themselves after a first half shut out in a game that they should have probably won.

 

I know it’s fun to say “it was Josh and offenses” fault, not McD’s!” when it’s convenient, but it’s not really honest work imo.

Edited Sunday at 06:45 PM by FireChans

[MJS]

3 minutes ago, FireChans said:

Aren’t you a big “the HC gets all the credit and blame because it’s all his responsibility?” guy?

 

If so, McD collapsed because the offense was terrible in the second half, the moment was too big for Josh and co, they were playing wild and out of control and puked all over themselves after a first half shut out in a game that they should have probably won.

 

I know it’s fun to say “it was Josh and offenses” fault, not McD’s!” when it’s convenient, but it’s not really honest work imo.

No, I'm not. I like to assign blame and credit where I see it. But I do call out the hypocrisy of people crediting Josh Allen and Brady when things go well, but only McDermott when things go bad. The head coach shares in all the blame and the credit.

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, MJS said:

No, I'm not. I like to assign blame and credit where I see it. But I do call out the hypocrisy of people crediting Josh Allen and Brady when things go well, but only McDermott when things go bad. The head coach shares in all the blame and the credit.

So the offensive collapse in Houston is McD’s collapse, yes?

[Alphadawg7]

22 hours ago, ProcessTruster said:

This board continues to beat the crap out of McD re:  13 seconds game.   

 

Correct me if someone has the definitive word on this, but my understanding is that McD told Heath Farwell to have Bass squib kick with 13 seconds left (which would have forced the returner to pick up the ball and return it, running the clock down well below 13 sec and ending the game) but Farwell failed to get the call in to Bass.   Taiwan Jones said later he "could not believe" Bass was kicking it through the end zone. 

 

So if my understanding is correct, McD made the right call and Farwell screwed it up.   McD courageously took the heat  (called it a "learning experience for all ")and refused to throw Farwell under the bus (although he fired him "Leslie Frazier style" quietly later).  Bass has never been pushed to talk as far as I know.

 

So instead of continuing to rip McD for 13 seconds, he should be commended for not shunting the blame on his ST coach Farwell, who (my understanding is) totally pooped the bed.   McD manned up and took the blame even though Farwell did the deed.   That's the guy I want at the top of my organization.  

 

If someone has the actually documented facts on this, chime in, but the whole 13 seconds thing has been misrepresented for 3 years IMO.

 

 

Basically what came out after the game was that McD wanted a squib quick and when Heath huddled up the ST unit to deliver the message failed to notice that Bass was not in the group as he was still kicking balls into the net.  So McD called for a squib and Heath told everyone but the kicker, which also why so many guys on the field were confused when there was no squib and Bass and kicked it out of the endzone.  The other 10 guys were expecting to run down and cover a squib except Bass didn't know he was supposed to squib it.  

 

Rather than scapegoat him, McD never directly said anything about it and they let Heath step down and take a lateral move to Jags (although Bills to Jags feels like a step down regardless) without dragging him under the bus.  

[CoudyBills]

2 hours ago, JohnNord said:

I’ve you are going to criticize McDermott, it’s not really fair to use 2019.  The Bills were the road underdog and lower seed playing on the road. 
 

Bills fans don’t want to face the reality that Josh greatly contributed to that loss.  He took a sack that knocked them out of FG range and fumbled at midfield that led to a Texans TD.   He was not the only issue and to his credit he led them to a tie FG, but that sequence is how the game flipped.  
 

Also if you remember, Frazier called the perfect blitz on 3rd down and Milano and Taron had Watson dead to rights.  It was a fluke he escaped.  
 

So a loss is a loss, but to say they “collapsed” is not being intellectually honest.  

Intellectual and most Bills fans...no.

[Ethan in Cleveland]

2 hours ago, JohnNord said:

I’ve you are going to criticize McDermott, it’s not really fair to use 2019.  The Bills were the road underdog and lower seed playing on the road. 
 

Bills fans don’t want to face the reality that Josh greatly contributed to that loss.  He took a sack that knocked them out of FG range and fumbled at midfield that led to a Texans TD.   He was not the only issue and to his credit he led them to a tie FG, but that sequence is how the game flipped.  
 

Also if you remember, Frazier called the perfect blitz on 3rd down and Milano and Taron had Watson dead to rights.  It was a fluke he escaped.  
 

So a loss is a loss, but to say they “collapsed” is not being intellectually honest.  

Two things can be true. 

The defense collapsed 

But you are correct the defensive call worked but the players Milano in particular didn't make the play

[Bills Fan in MD]

Is there any truth to the rumor that there's a game later today that has the potential to make a game that happened three years ago a distant memory???

 

I say we focus on that for now.

[That's No Moon]

45 minutes ago, 3rdand12 said:

Would not have guessed actually

 

Me neither.

[MJS]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

So the offensive collapse in Houston is McD’s collapse, yes?

Only in the sense that he is the head coach and responsible for his team. Not in the sense that he did something in the game to squander opportunities.

[JohnNord]

31 minutes ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Two things can be true. 

The defense collapsed 

But you are correct the defensive call worked but the players Milano in particular didn't make the play

The defense didn’t really “collapse.”  They gave up 19 points in the second half, 11 of which were set up by short fields thanks to Josh.  
 

Houston’s offense was good that season so while surrendering 2 TD’s and a FG isn’t stellar, 19 points isn’t really that extreme.   Especially when Houston won the overtime toss and the defense got the ball back.  
 

If that was their margin for error, then maybe that was part of the problem.  
 

 

 

[stevestojan]

It wasn’t the kick. 
 

It was the pee-wee level defensive play calling after when everyone of US (and we’re all idiots) knew exactly where the ball was going. And Clappy of course had his infamous soft zone out there. 
 

I’m not over it. That was our best shot. Period. 

[billsfan714]

35 minutes ago, stevestojan said:

It wasn’t the kick. 
 

It was the pee-wee level defensive play calling after when everyone of US (and we’re all idiots) knew exactly where the ball was going. And Clappy of course had his infamous soft zone out there. 
 

I’m not over it. That was our best shot. Period. 

Same here, Josh was on a historic playoff heater.   I'll never be over it.   The one I could care less about and people still talk about is the music city miracle.   Did anyone with a functioning brain actually think Rob Johnson or Flutie were going to lead us to a superbowl?    We lost, fine that team was what it was, a wild card round team that was never going to win it all.

Edited Sunday at 08:35 PM by billsfan714

[HamptonBillsfan]

23 hours ago, ProcessTruster said:

This board continues to beat the crap out of McD re:  13 seconds game.   

 

Correct me if someone has the definitive word on this, but my understanding is that McD told Heath Farwell to have Bass squib kick with 13 seconds left (which would have forced the returner to pick up the ball and return it, running the clock down well below 13 sec and ending the game) but Farwell failed to get the call in to Bass.   Taiwan Jones said later he "could not believe" Bass was kicking it through the end zone. 

 

So if my understanding is correct, McD made the right call and Farwell screwed it up.   McD courageously took the heat  (called it a "learning experience for all ")and refused to throw Farwell under the bus (although he fired him "Leslie Frazier style" quietly later).  Bass has never been pushed to talk as far as I know.

 

So instead of continuing to rip McD for 13 seconds, he should be commended for not shunting the blame on his ST coach Farwell, who (my understanding is) totally pooped the bed.   McD manned up and took the blame even though Farwell did the deed.   That's the guy I want at the top of my organization.  

 

If someone has the actually documented facts on this, chime in, but the whole 13 seconds thing has been misrepresented for 3 years IMO.

 

The HC is the final word on instructions to a kicker. If he entrusted Farwell, whoever he is, instead of telling Bass himself, and Bass never got the call, it’s on the HC. It’s more than the kickoff though, why was Hill and Kelce allowed to get free releases and be wide open with 13 seconds left. Even if you tackled the primary targets and got holding penalties the game is over or they have a Hail Mary with 6 seconds left. Any defensive coach worth keeping is better prepared for that situation and Sean knows it.

[stevestojan]

2 hours ago, billsfan714 said:

Same here, Josh was on a historic playoff heater.   I'll never be over it.   The one I could care less about and people still talk about is the music city miracle.   Did anyone with a functioning brain actually think Rob Johnson or Flutie were going to lead us to a superbowl?    We lost, fine that team was what it was, a wild card round team that was never going to win it all.

100%. 
 

If it WAS a squib, it would have left them with 8 seconds or so, and better field position for the one play they needed to get a FG. And Clappy’s defense would have given that up. 
 

And you’re 100% right on the music city miracle.