Where would Jim Kelly in his prime rank amongst todays QBs?

[Kelly to Allen]

12 minutes ago, Johnny Bravo said:

The only fact you keep bringing up is that Reed is in the HOF.   Using this logic do you also think Lamar is better than Josh because he has been voted MVP twice?  Or do you use your own eyes to form your own opinion about who the better player is?

 

Reed was awesome and deserves the HOF.  I watched both he and Moulds and think Moulds was the better of the two and would have been the best receiver in the league with better QBs throwing him the ball.

Eric Moulds is the greatest wr buffalo has ever had. 

 

Eric Moulds in his prime is one of the most talented wrs to ever play the position. 

[Your Brown Eye]

Going by the breakdown given, a solid 8-12. 

[tomur67]

Totally disagree with the statements that Jim Kelly didn't have the arm strength compared to today's QBs.  You think Tua or Russell Wilson have stronger arms than Kelly had.  Wrong, and there are others today that are fairly successful that don't throw as well as Jim did.

[SMAKCruiser]

Does prime Jim Kelly also get exposed to the same training, etc as today's players?  If so, I think he'd be in the 4-7 range.  Why does this one poster think Kelly had below average arm strength?  He was not Elway or Favre level but  could make any throw on the field with plenty of velocity on it.  

[The Jokeman]

Kelly was a gunslinger true and true but will give him credit for having an above average arm and somewhat mobile. I liken him to a Kirk Cousins/Baker Mayfield type. Somewhere in the middle of the pack as never felt Kelly made players better but instead relied on the talents around him. (see Thurman Thomas was MVP of the Bills offense not Kelly). 

[amprov56]

20 minutes ago, Johnny Bravo said:

The only fact you keep bringing up is that Reed is in the HOF.   Using this logic do you also think Lamar is better than Josh because he has been voted MVP twice?  Or do you use your own eyes to form your own opinion about who the better player is?

 

Reed was awesome and deserves the HOF.  I watched both he and Moulds and think Moulds was the better of the two and would have been the best receiver in the league with better QBs throwing him the ball.

I'm not arguing against the opinion if Moulds had a QB he would be a HOFer and you are right, more to it than the HOF. I watched Reed, a 4th round pick from the giant football factory of Kutztown, PA (find it on a map without google) become one of the greatest clutch recievers in the game. Over the middle taking serious hits and hanging on to the ball, I cant even begin rolling out game winning catches. He had an awesome work ethic, working out staying long after practices and non player employees of the Bills organization will tell you, a great person. I am partial, had a chance to meet Andre in the Gaslight Section of San Diego in 2004, easy to talk to, down to earth and extremely grateful the Bills drafted him in the 4th round. I want to stress I agree with all about Moulds and would loved to have seen him in the K Gun with Reed during the no huddle prime years and credit him along with Flutie for keeping a team in decline in the playoffs, 1998 - 1999. Andre is in the HOF, well deserved and he has Kelly and the K Gun to thank and makes no bones about, to me, the greatest WR in Bills history, 1985 through 1999, a true Buffalo Bill and a fan favorite for 15 years!!!

[Brian3488]

“There are known knowns. These are things we know that we know. There are known unknowns. That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know.”

[CaseyatBat]

1 hour ago, Sweats said:

 

 

 

 

You must be new..........you'll learn 

I am new here and I am definitely learning

 

 

Edited 18 hours ago by CaseyatBat

[Bob Chandler's Hands]

9 hours ago, That's No Moon said:

He did have some when he was younger though and he'd get hit a lot less in the modern game and not have guy going at his knees constantly so it's hard to say.  He's less mobile than most of the current top guys though.  He'd be like a Stafford IMO

Stafford is the perfect modern comp in my opinion. 

[FireChans]

1 hour ago, MarlinTheMagician said:

I can understand this, but there is a good argument for #3 in that list.  Durability matters.

But I voted 4-7.

Meh, Stafford was an iron-man until he was 100 years old and clear Kelly imo.

Edited 17 hours ago by FireChans

[CaseyatBat]

1 hour ago, Simon said:

 

They are, as is disagreeing with those opinions.

When you say something as patently stupid as "Allen is not a smart QB" while we're watching him see every inch of field and in total command of this offense, then you are going to get exactly what you deserve.

 

It is part of what makes him great.  Allen runs to the sideline, jumps in the air and launches it across his body downfield. That is not smart, you know that.

 

The smart play is to throw the ball away. He does this 2 or 3 times per game, its not rare, its what he does. 

 

Also, I was responding to people who said Jim Kelly (HOF legend) is a backup level QB. You want to talk about a dumb opinion! Kelly called all the plays on the fly, no-huddle, now that's total command of the offense. 

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

9 hours ago, pennstate10 said:

It’s basically impossible to answer this question, because we have little in the way of quantitative comparisons between football decades.  

 

But time is the same in 2024/as in 1990s. 
 

It is absolutely and quantitatively true that athletes of 2024 are better than those of the 1990s. 
 

The gold medal winner in the 100m ran 9.96 in 1992. The 8th place finisher ran 9.91 in 2024.  
 

So yeah, I think that Kelly would be an average at best nfl QB today. 
 

And Babe Ruth wouldn’t even crack a major league roster today. 
 

 

Nah! The best of their time you have to believe given similar conditions would be amongst the best now and vice versa.

Edited 17 hours ago by D. L. Hot-Flamethrower

[JP51]

Allen Mahomes Burrow... then in the mix with Jackson, Herbert etc... 

[Kirby Jackson]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

Meh, Stafford was an iron-man until he was 100 years old and clear Kelly imo.

Who is the better QB historically Jim Kelly or Matt Stafford? I don’t know the right answer but it feels interesting.

Edited 16 hours ago by Kirby Jackson

[FireChans]

1 minute ago, Kirby Jackson said:

Who is the better QB historically Jim Kelly or Matt Stafford? I don’t know the right answer but it feels interesting.

Better or more deserving of HoF?

 

Better: Matt

 

Hof: Kelly

 

1 off winners vs 4x loser.

[Kirby Jackson]

54 minutes ago, CaseyatBat said:

 

It is part of what makes him great.  Allen runs to the sideline, jumps in the air and launches it across his body downfield. That is not smart, you know that.

 

The smart play is to throw the ball away. He does this 2 or 3 times per game, its not rare, its what he does. 

 

Also, I was responding to people who said Jim Kelly (HOF legend) is a backup level QB. You want to talk about a dumb opinion! Kelly called all the plays on the fly, no-huddle, now that's total command of the offense. 

Who said he was a backup? That’s insanity. It’s equally insane to believe that he would be a top 3 guy in this elite QB era. He wasn’t a top 3 guy in his era (Marino, Elway, Montana). Anywhere in 4-12 feels okay. 

Just now, FireChans said:

Better or more deserving of HoF?

 

Better: Matt

 

Hof: Kelly

 

1 off winners vs 4x loser.

I really don’t know the question that I’m asking. I guess that it is, “20 years from now, a young fan asks someone that is 70, and would have seen both primes, which one was better?” I think you did a nice job laying it out. 

[FireChans]

11 minutes ago, Kirby Jackson said:

I really don’t know the question that I’m asking. I guess that it is, “20 years from now, a young fan asks someone that is 70, and would have seen both primes, which one was better?” I think you did a nice job laying it out. 

It's Stafford man. I'm so glad that dude got a ring. Stafford would have been talked about as another "what if" QB second only to Marino.

[CaseyatBat]

Stafford has made only 2 pro bowls in his entire career. I cannot believe this is a discussion. Stafford will make the HOF just because they put everyone in these days but he is not Kelly level

[The Jokeman]

1 hour ago, CaseyatBat said:

 

It is part of what makes him great.  Allen runs to the sideline, jumps in the air and launches it across his body downfield. That is not smart, you know that.

 

The smart play is to throw the ball away. He does this 2 or 3 times per game, its not rare, its what he does. 

 

Also, I was responding to people who said Jim Kelly (HOF legend) is a backup level QB. You want to talk about a dumb opinion! Kelly called all the plays on the fly, no-huddle, now that's total command of the offense. 

and too bad he couldn't run a better 2 minute drill in Super Bowl XXV or we would have won it. As much people credit Kelly far too many don't criticize him for playing below average in all 4 Super Bowls. 

[BADOLBILZ]

 

The more interesting question to me is what QB's from Kelly's era would have been great today.   There were so many glass-Joe Burrow types back in the 80's and 90's that are totally forgotten.   Guys like Chris Miller or Chris Chandler.   I mean, Justin Herbert IS Rob Johnson.    When Goodell changed the rules in 2010 to protect concussion prone young QB's Aaron Rodgers and Ben Roethlisberger it changed the type of QB that is able to succeed.