Why hasn't the Samuel signing worked?

[Augie]

54 minutes ago, JÂy RÛßeÒ said:

Because Hollins is better.  Because Shakir is better.  Because Cooper is better.  Because the RBs are better.  Because the TEs are better.  

 

Well, there is that. 

 

But we did have the one game where we tried to force it to him early. That was confusing.  I like the more recent offense better. Let’s peak at the right time this year! If he is the Super Bowl MVP, I’ll buy the first round!!! 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

*Must be present to win* 

[Sojourner]

I honestly thought he was going to fill the role Lil Dirty had. It seems like those gadgets are what they have him in mind for most but it just isn’t working. 
 

Many factors come into play but like a lot have, rightly imo, said is that there’s better players who work from that Y role. 
 

Didn’t think he’d get 1k but 5-700 yards and a few tds was a reasonable expectation. Way off. 

[Mikie2times]

32 minutes ago, ControllerOfPlanetX said:

They’ve scored over 30 points for 8 straight games, so I think it has worked out quite well.

 

So when we don't play well we can discuss it again?

[Fleezoid]

The signing worked out great. It's everything after that that's been kind of a mystery. 

[Beck Water]

52 minutes ago, Jerry Jabber said:

Samuel has been dealing with foot issues all season long. 

 

Right.  Turf toe injuries just linger like the scent of a dead woodchuck under the porch.

[Mr. WEO]

Hmmm---this is a real head scratcher.  Maybe we can look back on Beane's history of WR signings to suss out just what may be happening here.

 

To wit, these signings:

 

Deonte Hardy

Trent Sherfield

Crowder

Emanuel Sanders

Jake Kumerow

Andre Roberts

Duke Williams

Kelvin Benjamin

Jeremy Kerley

Devonte Thompson

Jordan Matthews

John Brown 2.0

Wesley 2.0

 

Beane treats filling the WR room with veterans like a guy pretending all day to be answering emails at work....

[LABILLBACKER]

1 hour ago, WotAGuy said:

Didn’t he get a 3-year deal?  Wonder if they will keep him or let him go. It seems like he is a poor fit for what they are doing because when he does get a target, it’s seldom downfield. 

Yes, 3/ 34.5

Probably can't get out till after next season according to Spotrac.  Some of that paper could've gone toward a pass rusher.  Oh well, the current wr room is in very good shape.

[todd]

Foot injuries often cause other injuries because you are constantly favoring it. Playing with it probably causes all kinds of soreness and trips to the chiropractor. 

[JakeFrommStateFarm]

Another Panthers bust signing 

 

When will we ever learn?

[djp14150]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Probably going to get flamed but if there is a second flaw (consistent deep ball being the other) in Josh's game it is these quick throws to WR screens.  He really doesn't throw them well. He bounced a ball to Samuel in the Detroit game. It's almost like he doesn't have the ball fully gripped. 

These bad throws and Samuel's injuries have hurt him. Shakir took most of the Isiah McKenzie crossing routes. Just not much else for Samuel to do. 

He grounds the ball to kill they play because he sees a CB possibly trying to pick it.

[K-9]

Yet. Why hasn’t it worked yet.

[GASabresIUFan]

2 hours ago, nedboy7 said:

I think we will see a different Samuel next year. 

Deebo?

[Buffalo Junction]

1 hour ago, Mr. WEO said:

Hmmm---this is a real head scratcher.  Maybe we can look back on Beane's history of WR signings to suss out just what may be happening here.

 

To wit, these signings:

 

Deonte Hardy

Trent Sherfield

Crowder

Emanuel Sanders

Jake Kumerow

Andre Roberts

Duke Williams

Kelvin Benjamin

Jeremy Kerley

Devonte Thompson

Jordan Matthews

John Brown 2.0

Wesley 2.0

 

Beane treats filling the WR room with veterans like a guy pretending all day to be answering emails at work....

Seems to me that a lot of those choices may have been requested by the coaching staff - be it offense or ST - or bottom of the WR room fliers. Samuel certainly seems like a Brady request due to previous success…. Who knows though.
 

That said, Harty, Mathews, and Crowder were duds aside from a punt return touchdown. 
 

Also…. If you’re gonna throw in trades (K Benjamin) you should include Diggs. Same goes towards Smoke 1.0 and Beasley 1.0 if you’re including the 2.0 resigning versions. 

[Lost]

2 hours ago, Mikie2times said:

Shakir is best in the slot, Kincaid is best in the slot, hell, even Coleman was a fantastic big slot at FSU (when he did it). It's hard to get the guy on the field and sure, I wish the front office saw this better early on. I don't think it's completely hindsight to make that statement. 

 

If there's one thing the Bills front office is good at, it's creating redundancy in the slot position.

[Big Turk]

It's worked...he had the coolest TD celebration this season on the Bills.

[SoonerBillsFan]

I hate it hasn't worked, he was the 1 signing I wanted in FA.

[Rochesterfan]

2 hours ago, Beast said:

Because he got hurt and the team went in a different direction out of necessity…..and that direction worked.

 

***** happens and I have a feeling the Samuel book is yet to be closed.

 

Totally agree and unfortunately he right now keeps getting nicked up when he gets a shot.

 

Had a turf toe, ankle, foot, shoulder, etc.  I think it has been a snake bitten year.

 

i expect given a healthy, but short offseason - they can revisit the stuff we saw in training camp before his first injury.

Edited Wednesday at 01:26 AM by Rochesterfan

[Mikie2times]

13 minutes ago, Lost said:

 

If there's one thing the Bills front office is good at, it's creating redundancy in the slot position.

That's my next pick up line for sure 

[dave mcbride]

3 hours ago, GASabresIUFan said:

On paper this had the hallmarks of a really good value signing.  Samuel was productive even in bad offenses and he had a prior positive relationship with Brady.  He has also proven productive in Wash and Car in the slot, occasionally outside or in the backfield.  Kind of like a poor man's Deebo Samuel.    He also has the kind of straight speed the Bills needed.

 

So why hasn't it worked.  Obviously the pre-season injury set him back, but is now week 16 and we have seen next to nothing from Samuel.  You would think given Brady's experience with Samuel that he'd scheme to get him the ball at least 4-5 times a game and that hasn't been the case.  

 

I have a bit of a theory.  I think he has a redundant skill set and Josh prefers Shakir and Kincaid (for obvious reasons) on the inside and despite his speed Samuel doesn't get separation when lined up on the boundary.   He also doesn't give us anything in the backfield that Cook, Davis and Johnson don't already bring as well.

 

Once he got healthy, the acquisition of Cooper and improved play by Coleman relegated Samuel to the 6th or 7th target behind Shakir, Kincaid, the RBs, Cooper, Coleman and probably Hollins.

 

 

 

 

 

 

To quote @Beast, the book ain’t closed at all. 

1 hour ago, Sojourner said:

I honestly thought he was going to fill the role Lil Dirty had. It seems like those gadgets are what they have him in mind for most but it just isn’t working. 
 

Many factors come into play but like a lot have, rightly imo, said is that there’s better players who work from that Y role. 
 

Didn’t think he’d get 1k but 5-700 yards and a few tds was a reasonable expectation. Way off. 

Still early days. 

[TheBrownBear]

2 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Probably going to get flamed but if there is a second flaw (consistent deep ball being the other) in Josh's game it is these quick throws to WR screens.  He really doesn't throw them well. He bounced a ball to Samuel in the Detroit game. It's almost like he doesn't have the ball fully gripped. 

These bad throws and Samuel's injuries have hurt him. Shakir took most of the Isiah McKenzie crossing routes. Just not much else for Samuel to do. 

Maybe it's been answered already, but he's successfully thrown a bunch of these LOS screens to Shakir this season.  I don't think it's a Josh issue.  I think Shakir is just far more dangerous than Samuel with the ball in his hands, so these looks are being schemed primarily for Shakir.