GoBills808 Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:30 AM, FireChans said: I donโt think they put 2 and 2 together, no. I think they love watching Josh. And they notice the stark difference watching anybody but Josh. But they donโt realize itโs almost entirely BECAUSE of Josh. As evidenced by this thread trying to give Ty Johnson credit for his offensive performance. lol. Expand This Ty Johnson game ball๐๐๐ Quote
FireChans Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:31 AM, oldmanfan said: Whatever. Football is the ultimate team game but you donโt think anyone but Josh has talent on this team. Live in your bubble. Expand Walked right into that one. Case closed! Quote
Success Posted December 16 Author Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:31 AM, Boatdrinks said: Honestly , what if the majority of this board was up in arms about the game and said it was completely unacceptable? Would it make a damn bit of difference ? Nope. We can bark at the moon all night, but Iโd rather just savor the incredible Allen performance and the win. Theyโve beaten the best two teams in the NFL by record. Expand Nah, you're right of course. I'm getting defensive because some of the reactions on this thread have been so over the top. I didn't think this would be a controversial take, at all. Of course I'm happy about the win. It's huge. And other guys played great. But there is TOO MUCH ON ALLEN, as there is week after week (imo). I just watched him play the kind of game that should be a "rocking chair game" for him in the 4th. 1 Quote
UKBillFan Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:30 AM, Generic_Bills_Fan said: I donโt get this in the context of this thread thoughโฆfor example, Josh did make a mistake overthrowing wide open Knox and he made a ridiculous play. The big Ty Johnson play early was an overthrow too. Guys making great plays gave him a built in margin for error so how do we turn around and say โitโs all Joshโ when the final whistle blows. Frankly Iโd be pissed reading that as one of these other players. nobody wants to take anything away from Josh heโs amazing but other guys are stepping up too. An amazing qb surrounded by scrubs on the oline and at the skill positions is not carrying you single handedly to 30,40+ points every week. Expand I do get the argument that the Bills would have lost with anyone but Josh at QB today, though - and I would include 2024 Mahomes in that. That's not to take away from some of the great plays made by others but, without Josh, they may not have been put in a position to complete them. Quote
Alphadawg7 Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:28 AM, FireChans said: If you want to win with defense, you better hire Vrabel or peel Belichick away from UNC. Expand Who said "win with defense"? Literally no one has ever said that once But you don't IGNORE defense or dismantle it because you put all your resources in the offense. Unless you want to be like the Saints with Brees who struggled to consistently make the playoffs, the Bengals this year, the Dolphins, etc. We don't have to be the 85 Bears, but you better be able to get a stop. How many times has Allen left the field late with a lead to see the defense give up the game? Meanwhile our "savior" Cooper had 0 catches again today. We have the highest scoring offense in the NFL over the past 5 seasons now, over taking KC. Literally the most points in the league...yet people still complaining its not enough, we need to go offensively heavy again this offseason for the 4th season in a row while our defense is the biggest threat to sabotaging the best season of Allens career (and probable MVP season) Quote
GunnerBill Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:26 AM, Success said: This isn't the first few years of Allen being good. There is a different standard now. This team has one of the best QB's in history - the expectations NOW are a title. Look at the responses on this thread. Like people are incredulous there is any criticism after we beat a great team - like it erases everything else from the game. The bar needs to be higher. Or we can just be happy getting big regular season wins, and divisional round extis. Expand No. People are not incredulous that there is any criticism. That is a complete strawman. There is lots still to criticise. You can't give up the points the Bills have given up the past two weeks. You can't miss a chip shot field goal. You can't risk some of the clock stuff at the end. That is still different than "entirely Josh Allen." Josh is incredible. He is the best football player on the planet. We are only Superbowl contenders because we have Josh Allen. But other players made critical plays in the game tonight. 1 2 Quote
Boatdrinks Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:33 AM, Success said: Nah, you're right of course. I'm getting defensive because some of the reactions on this thread have been so over the top. I didn't think this would be a controversial take, at all. Of course I'm happy about the win. It's huge. And other guys played great. But there is TOO MUCH ON ALLEN, as there is week after week (imo). I just watched him play the kind of game that should be a "rocking chair game" for him in the 4th. Expand I definitely wanted the D to hold them to somewhere in the 20โs. I thought it was possible deep into the 3rd quarter. It was a great win , but everything is not hunky dory . There is work to be done because it gets tougher in the playoffs. Iโd like to not have to rely on Allen heroics all the time. They have 3 weeks to figure stuff out as best they can. I thought they bounced back in a big way for about 3 quarters though 1 Quote
FireChans Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:37 AM, GunnerBill said: No. People are not incredulous that there is any criticism. That is a complete strawman. There is lots still to criticise. You can't give up the points the Bills have given up the past two weeks. You can't miss a chip shot field goal. You can't risk some of the clock stuff at the end. That is still different than "entirely Josh Allen." Josh is incredible. He is the best football player on the planet. We are only Superbowl contenders because we have Josh Allen. But other players made critical plays in the game tonight. Expand The water boys did their jobs tonight too. They made sure everyone was good and hydrated. 1 Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:33 AM, GoBills808 said: This Ty Johnson game ball๐๐๐ Expand That early ty catch wasnโt a great play on a not super well thrown ball? Or the Knox catch? Idk man guys made some ridiculous plays tonight. Cook fights through a tackle by the hair to rip off a huge td run. The oline has been great. I feel like Josh would be as mad as anyone in this thread or more reading yโall suggesting nobody is helping him do anything lol Quote
FireChans Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:36 AM, Alphadawg7 said: Who said "win with defense"? Literally no one has ever said that once But you don't IGNORE defense or dismantle it because you put all your resources in the offense. Unless you want to be like the Saints with Brees who struggled to consistently make the playoffs, the Bengals this year, the Dolphins, etc. We don't have to be the 85 Bears, but you better be able to get a stop. How many times has Allen left the field late with a lead to see the defense give up the game? Meanwhile our "savior" Cooper had 0 catches again today. We have the highest scoring offense in the NFL over the past 5 seasons now, over taking KC. Literally the most points in the league...yet people still complaining its not enough, we need to go offensively heavy again this offseason for the 4th season in a row while our defense is the biggest threat to sabotaging the best season of Allens career (and probable MVP season) Expand When you say โwin with both sides of the ballโ I assume both sides are โoffenseโ and โdefenseโ right? Did you mean offense and special teams? I shouldnโt have assumed, sorry. Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted December 16 Posted December 16 (edited) On 12/16/2024 at 2:35 AM, UKBillFan said: I do get the argument that the Bills would have lost with anyone but Josh at QB today, though - and I would include 2024 Mahomes in that. That's not to take away from some of the great plays made by others but, without Josh, they may not have been put in a position to complete them. Expand I feel like the thread title was kind of bait haha then someone said none of the other bills are good players. But yea if he had an off night the team is probably in trouble Edited December 16 by Generic_Bills_Fan Quote
HappyDays Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:29 AM, GunnerBill said: I think Allen is the only one too - certainly on 2024 form. Mahomes at his best, sure. That is different from saying it is entirely him. He is the main reason we won. He is the main reason we win most of the time. That is what being an elite NFL QB is. But there are at least 2 or 3 other guys tonight who played incredible games and an OC who called a brilliant game that I don't think we win without, even with Josh's brilliance. Expand Then we don't really disagree on anything except for semantics. I will tip my cap to Brady not just for calling a great game (the awful 3rd and goal sequence excluded) but having a great gameplan to start. All day long we attacked the Lions injured LB corps and avoided their safeties at all costs. Committing to the run kept us in manageable 2nd/3rd downs on almost every series. If I'm going to credit one person other than Allen it would be him for sure. Quote
GoBills808 Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:38 AM, Generic_Bills_Fan said: That early ty catch wasnโt a great play on a not super well thrown ball? Or the Knox catch? Idk man guys made some ridiculous plays tonight. Cook fights through a tackle by the hair to rip off a huge td run. The oline has been great. I feel like Josh would be as mad as anyone in this thread or more reading yโall suggesting nobody is helping him do anything lol Expand Guys making tough catches happen every game every week What Allen does nobody can do 1 1 Quote
L Ron Burgundy Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:12 AM, oldmanfan said: I will state it again: Josh is phenomenal. But that doesnโt mean some of the great plays made by teammates should somehow be downgraded. Expand Sure. Quote
FireChans Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:41 AM, HappyDays said: Then we don't really disagree on anything except for semantics. I will tip my cap to Brady not just for calling a great game (the awful 3rd and goal sequence excluded) but having a great gameplan to start. All day long we attacked the Lions injured LB corps and avoided their safeties at all costs. Committing to the run kept us in manageable 2nd/3rd downs on almost every series. If I'm going to credit one person other than Allen it would be him for sure. Expand The Bills ran a gameplan not dissimilar to the one the Ravens ran v us. Came out using Ty Johnson in the Justice Hill role. Was very good. Quote
Generic_Bills_Fan Posted December 16 Posted December 16 (edited) On 12/16/2024 at 2:25 AM, GoBills808 said: This is a bad take imo This is exactly the game to say it was all Allen. I don't think any other QB in the league wins this game for us tonight and that's not hyperbole Expand What is a bad take? My point was guys made great plays and have been making great plays consistently and it feels weird to not acknowledge it. โItโs all Joshโ in the thread title feels like heโs elevating a bunch of scrubs and a few of the comments pushed that narrative other guys on the team could be playing well AND you need a good game from Josh to win still lol those can both be true simultaneously. what irked me was people implying itโs basically all JAGs and Josh Edited December 16 by Generic_Bills_Fan Quote
FireChans Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:43 AM, Generic_Bills_Fan said: โItโs all Joshโ in the thread title feels like heโs elevating a bunch of scrubs Expand You should legitimately check out Dawson Knoxโs, Ty Johnsonโs and Mack Hollins career pages. Thatโs EXACTLY whatโs happening. Sure Coleman has talent but is a rookie. Cook is a really good RB. OL is playing well but is also bailed out by Allen basically breaking at least 1 tackle in the backfield every time. Quote
GoBills808 Posted December 16 Posted December 16 On 12/16/2024 at 2:43 AM, Generic_Bills_Fan said: What is a bad take? My point was guys made great plays and have been making great plays consistently and it feels weird to not acknowledge it. โItโs all Joshโ in the thread title feels like heโs elevating a bunch of scrubs other guys on the team could be playing well AND you need a good game from Josh to win still lol those can both be true simultaneously. what irked me was people implying itโs basically all JAGs and Josh Expand That's exactly what it is lol We dont have a single receiver in the top 25 Quote
GunnerBill Posted December 16 Posted December 16 (edited) On 12/16/2024 at 2:46 AM, FireChans said: OL is playing well but is also bailed out by Allen basically breaking at least 1 tackle in the backfield every time. Expand Every time? Seriously? Of course it happens. But it isn't close to every time. The OL is playing legitimately well. Especially in pass pro. EDIT: on the receiving weapons I don't really disagree. The Bills do not have top talent there and the receivers are not making a ton of amazing plays for Josh. Althought the Knox catch was one. Edited December 16 by GunnerBill Quote
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