12/15/24 Week 15 Bills @ Lions Game Post Game Thread

[DrDawkinstein]

5 minutes ago, mbowman14 said:

I thought about this at the time, and it is the only logical reason not to throw the hail mary.  If that really is the concern, let Trubisky throw it.  You have to take a shot there for a lucky bounce or DPI.  The play to Shakir had no chance whatsoever and it wasted a small opportunity at points.

 

I would also look at the Hook and Ladder play Detroit ran.  That is the perfect play for the next to last play of the half when the Bills needed 5-10 yards for a FG and the Lions took away the short sideline since Buffalo had 0 TOs.  Something like that from Kincaid to Shakir flying across the field to then get out of bounds.  Curious to see if it is added for playoff time.

 

While I bag on a lot of McD's decisions, I'm totally on board with how we handled those last plays before halftime.

 

When we got the ball back with 3min in the half, I'm sure everyone thought "ok, lets run the clock down and get some points (even a fg) before half, then come back out for the 2nd half and do it again, and really put this game out of reach".

 

Then we stall out, AND miss the FG. But then are lucky enough that Detroit misses their FG too. At THAT point, the mindset changes to "ok, lets just get out of here as it is, come back out after half and reset". Dont allow any dumb plays that could give Detroit a boost going into halftime like missing another FG, or an INT on a Hail Mary. Or even worse, with an aggressive coach like Campbell, it's likely he doesnt just rush 3 or even 4 on the Hail Mary, so there is a chance they come after Josh and something worse happens (a Josh fumble, or even an injury). Just get out of the half and regroup in the 3rd quarter.

 

I didnt hate it.

[wjag]

3 minutes ago, CaseyatBat said:

 

thats not possible. you cannot advance an onside kick recovery

 

Didn't realize that.

[CaseyatBat]

2 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

While I bag on a lot of McD's decisions, I'm totally on board with how we handled those last plays before halftime.

 

When we got the ball back with 3min in the half, I'm sure everyone thought "ok, lets run the clock down and get some points (even a fg) before half, then come back out for the 2nd half and do it again, and really put this game out of reach".

 

Then we stall out, AND miss the FG. But then are lucky enough that Detroit misses their FG too. At THAT point, the mindset changes to "ok, lets just get out of here as it is, come back out after half and reset". Dont allow any dumb plays that could give Detroit a boost going into halftime like missing another FG, or an INT on a Hail Mary. Or even worse, with an aggressive coach like Campbell, it's likely he doesnt just rush 3 or even 4 on the Hail Mary, so there is a chance they come after Josh and something worse happens (a Josh fumble, or even an injury). Just get out of the half and regroup in the 3rd quarter.

 

I didnt hate it.

 

I hated it. You have Josh Allen, possibly the strongest arm in the league and you run a little screen pass. For what? 

 

luckily it didn't matter. detroits D is so bad, but you should be trying to score points there 

 

 

Edited Monday at 04:41 PM by CaseyatBat

[finn]

12 hours ago, Big Turk said:

I don't mean to beat a broken drum but I think Josh Allen is probably the best player I have ever seen in my life.

The sheer number of things he does as well or better than anyone is just crazy. His velocity and accuracy means he can fit the ball in tiny openings, his uncanny mobility and pocket presence means he can extend plays until his receivers get open, he's so athletic he can throw while in the air, across his body, and without setting his feet, he's so fricking big tacklers bounce off him, he's so fast he can outrun linebackers and deke out safeties, and he's seasoned enough now that he can quickly diagnose a defensive look and adjust as well as anyone.  Maybe most importantly, he's so extraordinarily competitive that you just can't stop him. His enormous willpower makes his teammates want to run through a brick wall for him. 

 

I mean, he's pretty much the best of Brady, Jackson, Favre, Young, Kelly, Newton, and Mahomes in one person. And he's a good guy!

[billybob71]

The Josh Allen media hype is on full blast this morning, I find it funny most of us on here knew he was amazing months and years ago, these games come as zero surprise to me  

Edited Monday at 04:47 PM by billybob71

[Simon]

6 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

At THAT point, the mindset changes to "ok, lets just get out of here as it is, come back out after half and reset". Dont allow any dumb plays that could give Detroit a boost going into halftime like missing another FG, or an INT on a Hail Mary. Or even worse, with an aggressive coach like Campbell, it's likely he doesnt just rush 3 or even 4 on the Hail Mary, so there is a chance they come after Josh and something worse happens (a Josh fumble, or even an injury). Just get out of the half and regroup in the 3rd quarter.

 

I thought they were absolutely going hunting for points in that part of the field with 30+ seconds and 2 TO's left.

Unfortunately Allen got put in a bad situation and opted to take the grounding call instead of exposing himself to another hard hit.

They still managed to get across midfield and I wish McDermott would have risked the slight chance of a blocked FG and let Bass try one from there.

[davefan66]

Just now, billybob71 said:

The Josh Allen hype is on full blast this morning, I find it funny most of us on here knew he was amazing months and years ago, these games come as zero surprise to me  

If memory serves, wasn’t he voted most overrated player?

 

Guess he took that to heart, didn’t he!

 

Would love to see how that vote turns out now.

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

7 minutes ago, CaseyatBat said:

 

I hated it. You have Josh Allen, possibly the strongest arm in the league and you run a little screen pass. For what? 

 

luckily it didn't matter. detroits D is so bad, but you should be trying to score points there 

 

 

FWIW Josh called "Kill kill kill" so their primary was called off. I can believe Josh seeing something he didn't like

[stevewin]

5 hours ago, entropyrules said:

 

does anyone know if any there other NFL teams with turf similar or the same as the Lions. Would be interesting to find out if those turfs also are correlated with a higher incidence of injuries.

There was discussion about the turf leading up to the game.  The Lions turf was changed last year to a 'monofilament' turf from 'slit film', which the NFLPA has cited for causing more non-contact injuries (the belief being the slit film is 'stickier' for cleats).  So Detriot actually has the 'safer' turf now

 

The remaining teams with slit film are New York Giants, New York Jets, Minnesota Vikings, New Orleans Saints, Indianapolis Colts, and Cincinnati Bengals

 

https://www.prideofdetroit.com/2023/1/6/23542354/detroit-lions-changing-ford-field-turf-safer-core-monofilament-surface-2023

 

 

Edited Monday at 05:13 PM by stevewin

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

2 minutes ago, billybob71 said:

The Josh Allen media hype is on full blast this morning, I find it funny most of us on here knew he was amazing months and years ago, these games come as zero surprise to me  

What's amazing is somehow now the supporting cast is one of the best he's ever had after the Jets and Dolphins were supposed to take the division this year

[davefan66]

1 minute ago, Simon said:

 

I thought they were absolutely going hunting for points in that part of the field with 30+ seconds and 2 TO's left.

Unfortunately Allen got put in a bad situation and opted to take the grounding call instead of exposing himself to another hard hit.

They still managed to get across midfield and I wish McDermott would have risked the slight chance of a blocked FG and let Bass try one from there.

I wanted a FG also. He has the leg.  Since he already missed a kick, does his psyche come into play on that kick? Does McD avoid putting him in that position?

 

Not a fan of the play they called either.

[DrDawkinstein]

1 minute ago, davefan66 said:

If memory serves, wasn’t he voted most overrated player?

 

Guess he took that to heart, didn’t he!

 

Would love to see how that vote turns out now.

 

Those 15 NFC players that reporter talked to set off a fire that is burning the entire league to the ground!

Just now, davefan66 said:

I wanted a FG also. He has the leg.  Since he already missed a kick, does his psyche come into play on that kick? Does McD avoid putting him in that position?

 

Not a fan of the play they called either.

 

Probably. As well as the chance that a line-drive FG gets blocked and possibly returned the other way. Or any other momentum a failed FG would give the Lions there.

 

Even with doing nothing to end the half, the last taste in the Lions' mouths was missing the FG. Dont give them any spark, especially at the risk of your own players' psyche.

 

Reset, come out strong in the 2nd half. Which we did.

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

Definitely need to put Hyde on the roster this week and stop playing games 

[CaseyatBat]

8 minutes ago, WhitewalkerInPhilly said:

FWIW Josh called "Kill kill kill" so their primary was called off. I can believe Josh seeing something he didn't like

 

I didnt see that

[jayg]

5 hours ago, Big Turk said:

This game was also a scoreigami. The first time in the NFL there has ever been a 48-42 game.

 

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/bills-upset-win-over-lions-ends-with-final-score-thats-never-been-seen-before-in-nfl-history/

 

Yeah, what happens at the bottom of those piles is not for the faint of heart. I wonder how often a ball changes hands due to some of that stuff?

 

I keep saying it over and over again. Never take this time for granted, we will never see it again.

 

3 hours ago, ProcessImproverMan said:

https://x.com/_MLFootball/status/1868487911127318545

Apparently the Lions were getting dirty with their fingers on the last onside kick and were sticking them where they should not be.

Not surprising considering Campbell preaches going after knee caps and is pushing a culture influenced by the Bounty Gate Saints culture he was a part of

 

59 minutes ago, JGMcD2 said:

This is hysterical. What football were you playing? 

 

Let’s go back 15 years, check this article out…

 

“It’s a loose football,” Seattle defensive tackle Craig Terrill said. “It’s the most valuable thing in the NFL. So you go after it.” It’s not like trying to find a needle in a haystack so much as it’s trying to endure reaching into a haystack full of needles. What happens in a football pile isn’t exactly dinner-table conversation. “You’ve got eye-poking,” defensive back Kennard Cox said. “You’ve got mouth-grabbing. You’ve got hand-bending. Anything to get the ball.”

 

https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seahawks/when-nfl-players-dive-for-a-loose-ball-what-happens-in-the-pile-stays-in-the-pile/

 

Not good enough, alright, I’ll go back to check with Fred Smerlas who played football for the Bills in the 80s and in the NFL into the 90s

 

Inside the pile, you kept your eyes closed, like a feeding shark, to guard against knifing hands that were trying to maim and blind, yank and punch scrotums, and dislocate fingers. The football changed hands often and ruthlessly. Late-comers dove into the jumble with their helmets first, heat-seeking missiles looking to break or dislodge anything in their way — the ball, even teeth. You couldn’t even trust your own teammates because in the heat of the scrum, it was often impossible to determine friend from foe.

 

https://www.sbnation.com/nfl/2019/12/12/21005035/fumble-pile-violence-nfl-stories

 

I’m going back DECADES for you, just to cover all bases. 

 

This is why they wear cups  and perform cup checks. AND, what you may not hear about is the plug. Plug checks are generally frowned upon though.

[Simon]

11 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

Those 15 NFC players that reporter talked to set off a fire that is burning the entire league to the ground!

 

I absolutely love when we play NFC teams we haven't seen in a while.

These dudes have never seen 6'5" 240lb white boy move like that in their lives and you can set your watch to their pursuit angles being totally inappropriate. 

[mbowman14]

12 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

Those 15 NFC players that reporter talked to set off a fire that is burning the entire league to the ground!

 

Probably. As well as the chance that a line-drive FG gets blocked and possibly returned the other way. Or any other momentum a failed FG would give the Lions there.

 

Even with doing nothing to end the half, the last taste in the Lions' mouths was missing the FG. Dont give them any spark, especially at the risk of your own players' psyche.

 

Reset, come out strong in the 2nd half. Which we did.

This also calls into question the 10 second runoff after the Intentional Grounding.  I think with 2 TOs left there, burning one of them would have been preferrable to the 10 second runoff which equates to two plays.  I really like McD as a coach, but his time management decisions continue to be poor.  Not calling a TO with :01 on the play clock in the 2nd half to get below the 2:00 warning after the fg attempt was also suspect.  You know these things are discussed in-depth because they are well prepared seemingly in all facets, but far too often it is not the optimal decision with regard to the clock.  

[Cheektowaga Chad]

30 minutes ago, DrDawkinstein said:

 

While I bag on a lot of McD's decisions, I'm totally on board with how we handled those last plays before halftime.

 

When we got the ball back with 3min in the half, I'm sure everyone thought "ok, lets run the clock down and get some points (even a fg) before half, then come back out for the 2nd half and do it again, and really put this game out of reach".

 

Then we stall out, AND miss the FG. But then are lucky enough that Detroit misses their FG too. At THAT point, the mindset changes to "ok, lets just get out of here as it is, come back out after half and reset". Dont allow any dumb plays that could give Detroit a boost going into halftime like missing another FG, or an INT on a Hail Mary. Or even worse, with an aggressive coach like Campbell, it's likely he doesnt just rush 3 or even 4 on the Hail Mary, so there is a chance they come after Josh and something worse happens (a Josh fumble, or even an injury). Just get out of the half and regroup in the 3rd quarter.

 

I didnt hate it

I usually dislike most of McDermotts decisions but I thought similarly and a lot of it was the game itself

 

On the road

 

Against one of it not the best team in the league

 

The crowd already completely neutralize

 

Buffalo gets the ball after the half

 

You have Detroit on the floor, keep them there, you got a knock out shot to start the half

[Brianmoorman4jesus]

How is it that it’s non stop excuses about the lions defensive injuries but last year we had it even worse? Nobody said a word.  We lost like 20 guys on defense alone, nobody said anything? We played a home playoff game with an old retired STs guy starting at LB

[wolfpack78]

Montgomery torn MCL too… we (or their turf) beat them up bad last night.