Defense is built to stop average and below offenses.

[SCBills]

2 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

I’ve seen Rousseau compared to Tremaine Edmunds, which I would disagree with because I think Groot makes some of the splash plays that Edmunds never did.  
 

But I can see the Bills in a similar position in the offseason.  While Rousseau is a good players and does a lot of things that don’t show on the stat sheet like setting the edge - does the team want to pay him top 5 money?  Because he’ll likely get that on the open market.

 

Does his solid production warrant a contract of an elite player?  

No, it doesn’t warrant an elite player contract.  
 

The comparison to Edmunds is because we see the otherworldly potential but, at some point, it has to click. 
 

He has to show out this postseason.  
 

Same for Oliver or I’d float his name for a trade this offseason.  
 

Enough is enough and the DL cannot be the reason we don’t get to a Super Bowl.  
 

If it is, blow it up. 

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

2 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

I don’t know if that’s what the Bills defense is “ built” to stop - no GM/ front office thinks that way. I think the scheme - X’s and O’s -is fine. The Bills lack a couple of elite defenders - the Jimmys and Joes- to be a dominant unit. 

This. If there is any blame, it’s on Beane. Need more true difference makers on the d-line, and an impact safety.
 

if Daquon had returned to form and Von was what he was supposed to be, this D would also look a lot different. Oh well.  

[Gman10]

Defense wins championships. Hopefully we get some better defense next

season. Thats our weak link

[LABILLBACKER]

3 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

They need 1 elite level talent on talent which they’ve never really had throughout McDermott’s tenure.  
 

I guess the closest would be Milano at his peak or pre-injury Von Miller.  

Exactly....I've been saying this since the day we drafted Josh.  He's had absolutely NO game wrecking elite defensive player. And until Sean finds one, the result will be the same.

[JohnNord]

Just now, Mikie2times said:

Except that's just not true

• The Colts in 2020 had the 3rd highest EPA facing us of the entire season in the playoffs
• The Chiefs in 2020 had the 1st highest EPA facing us of the entire season in the playoffs
• The Chiefs in 2021 had the 3rd highest EPA facing us of the entire season in the playoffs
• The Bengals in 2022 had the 3rd highest EPA facing us of the entire season in the playoffs
• The Chiefs in 2023 had the 5th highest EPA facing us of the entire season in the playoffs

So we have given 3 separate teams some of the best offensive performances they had all year vs us in the playoffs. Then yes, to your point, we have given KC some of the best offensive performances they have had in multiple seasons. 

 

But just so lazy to say KC and walk away. 

- The Bills won against the Colts in 2020

- The Bills scored 10 points against Cincinnati their lowest output all season. 
- The Bills defense was severely undermanned and started AJ Klein and still had a chance to win on the final drive.

 

So aside from the losses Kansas City - your evidence is a game that the Bills won 5 years ago and a loss to CIN where the offense played like trash and scored 10 points?  
 

Confirmation bias is strong here.  But I will agree that the Bills need the defense to step up more in the postseason.  Especially against Kansas City 

 

[Boatdrinks]

Just now, LABILLBACKER said:

It's not just KC & Mahomes. This defense got destroyed by Cincy and Burrow. Even Skylar Thompson made us sweat.  Where are the metrics there?

Mahomes and Burrow are top QBs to be sure. Trying to throw the Skylar Thompson Dolphins game in that same category of game is a stretch- more myth than reality. That game was about one thing: turnovers by the Bills offense. The Bills defense did its job- giving up only field goals on short fields several times. It was a sloppy game by Allen and the offense that made a likely blowout of Miami into a nail biter. 

[JohnNord]

1 minute ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly....I've been saying this since the day we drafted Josh.  He's had absolutely NO game wrecking elite defensive player. And until Sean finds one, the result will be the same.

Sadly it’s not for lack of trying though.  Beane has invested a lot of resources on defense both in the draft and in FA.  
 

I’d argue the cumulative return has been good…not great.  Many singles and doubles but no homeruns.

[Mikie2times]

Just now, JohnNord said:

- The Bills won against the Colts in 2020

- The Bills scored 10 points against Cincinnati their lowest output all season. 
- The Bills defense was severely undermanned and started AJ Klein and still had a chance to win on the final drive.

 

So aside from the losses Kansas City - your evidence is a game that the Bills won 5 years ago and a loss to CIN where the offense played like trash and scored 10 points?  
 

Confirmation bias is strong here.  But I will agree that the Bills need the defense to step up more in the postseason.  Especially against Kansas City 

 

I'm sorry, I didn't know this thread was about offense? If so I would focus more on the fact that the offense is consistently putting this defense in positive game scripts. All you're pointing out is that it's harder to do that in the playoffs. Ground breaking observation on your part. 

[JohnNord]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

Mahomes and Burrow are top QBs to be sure. Trying to throw the Skylar Thompson Dolphins game in that same category of game is a stretch- more myth than reality. That game was about one thing: turnovers by the Bills offense. The Bills defense did its job- giving up only field goals on short fields several times. It was a sloppy game by Allen and the offense that made a likely blowout of Miami into a nail biter. 

That’s why I laugh how Bills fans glaze Skyler Thompson.  The game should have been over in the first quarter before Josh started pressing and almost lost the game.

 

You can argue that he did the same thing a week later against Cincinnati 

[GoBills808]

6 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

Exactly....I've been saying this since the day we drafted Josh.  He's had absolutely NO game wrecking elite defensive player. And until Sean finds one, the result will be the same.

We had 4AllPros on the defensive side of the ball vs Bengals in the playoffs and 4 vs chiefs in 13seconds game

 

I mean how much elite talent do you need

 

 

[Mikie2times]

Just now, JohnNord said:

That’s why I laugh how Bills fans glaze Skyler Thompson.  The game should have been over in the first quarter before Josh started pressing and almost lost the game.

 

You can argue that he did the same thing a week later against Cincinnati 

But then you might realize Joe Burrow was 9-9 with two TD passes and a 14-0 lead after two drives 🤣

[Straight Hucklebuck]

2 hours ago, TD716 said:

Please change up the defensive philosophy this off season . Defense feasts on average and below QB’s and offensive lines. This coupled with Josh gets you double digit win totals each year. In the playoffs you very rarely see below average. Good qb’s,with time, pick apart our defense. Also sick of mobile DT’s. Jeff Wright, Kyle Williams and most of our current ones come to mind. Please either draft or pickup a mountain for the middle to at least stop the run. 

Well I don’t think Beane is purposely drafting mediocre lineman - for example AJ Epenesa, Dewayne Carter were guys with draftable grades in the mid-rounds - but what was their ceiling supposed to be? 

Rousseau is playing well for an end of Round-1 defensive end.

 

Their big money shot was Von Miller and that has been derailed by injury and he’s old. You handed a 33 year old a 6-year contract. 

For the last two seasons the Bills have had little to no money to spend in Free Agency - so that leads to a collection of guys - Tim Settle, Austin Johnson, Dawaune Smoot, Casey Toohill, Poona Ford, they got a good year out of Leornard Floyd. 

 

Now picking 9th overall - Oliver over Jeff Simmons, Dexter Lawerence, Christian Wilkins is indisputable miss. That’s McDermotts scheme and not projecting well to the NFL level. 
 

They’ve had a thing for old DTs that they’re familiar with - Star L and DaQuan Jones - and once they identity a starter, it does seem to be that they want continuity for multiple seasons. 
 

This is why I think after this Playoff run - McDermott needs to be evaluated on a season by season basis if the goal is really the Super Bowl at OBD. 
 

I think the rest of 2024 and 2025 is more than fair enough and if he can not get it done, it’s time to try something else. 


 

 

Edited December 14 by Straight Hucklebuck

[JohnNord]

2 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

I'm sorry, I didn't know this thread was about offense? If so I would focus more on the fact that the offense is consistently putting this defense in positive game scripts. All you're pointing out is that it's harder to do that in the playoffs. Ground breaking observation on your part. 

No, I’m trying to look at the playoff losses holistically whereas you are selectively using information to support a flawed narrative.  But..go on

5 minutes ago, GoBills808 said:

We had 4AllPros on the defensive side of the ball vs Bengals in the playoffs and 4 vs chiefs in 13seconds game

 

I mean how much elite talent do you need

 

 

Wrong. 

[Mikie2times]

2 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

No, I’m trying to look at the playoff losses holistically whereas you are selectively using information to support a flawed narrative.  But..go on

Wrong. 

Burrow is still completing passes as you type

 

I found this image of your holistic evaluation 

 

Edited December 14 by Mikie2times

[Ya Digg?]

18 minutes ago, LABILLBACKER said:

It's not just KC & Mahomes. This defense got destroyed by Cincy and Burrow. Even Skylar Thompson made us sweat.  Where are the metrics there?

Nuts, you were doing so well too-then you tried to use Skylar Thompson for your argument. Good try though 

[mannc]

24 minutes ago, Boatdrinks said:

 

Your point is valid- the Bills defense has failed them in the playoffs. That game is probably not the best example. Offensively I think the game plan was a sound one: play keep away from Mahomes Kelce and Co. It darn near worked. 

I re-watched last year’s playoff game a couple weeks ago.  Josh Allen had a near-perfect game…the Bills’ receivers had 4 HUGE drops (by Diggs, Cook and 2 egregious ones by Sherfield) all of which were costly.

[GoBills808]

4 minutes ago, JohnNord said:

No, I’m trying to look at the playoff losses holistically whereas you are selectively using information to support a flawed narrative.  But..go on

Wrong. 

White

Hyde

Johnson

Poyer

Milano

 

next

[Boatdrinks]

8 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

But then you might realize Joe Burrow was 9-9 with two TD passes and a 14-0 lead after two drives 🤣

The Bills sure looked like they had no idea how to play defense in the snow. The Bengals were happy to pile up rac yards as the Bills backed off. Still, Allen did almost nothing to match the Bengals and Burrow that day. Defense was bad, and offense was non existent. 

[JohnNord]

1 minute ago, Boatdrinks said:

The Bills sure looked like they had no idea how to play defense in the snow. The Bengals were happy to pile up rac yards as the Bills backed off. Still, Allen did almost nothing to match the Bengals and Burrow that day. Defense was bad, and offense was non existent. 

Both sides of the ball were bad which is why I don’t think you can fault only the defense.  It was a complete team collapse and a different situation than some of the games that Mickey and others are suggesting

[GoBills808]

5 minutes ago, Mikie2times said:

Burrow is still completing passes as you type

 

I found this image of your holistic evaluation 

 

This guy was on here a couple weeks ago talking about how horrible a coach McVay is😂😂grain of salt