The root source of D problems is the D Line

[Pete]

4 hours ago, Kelly to Allen said:

The buffalo dline was elite vs KC.

 

Again ppl are being the prisoner of the moment...

 

 

That’s KC game is prisoner of the moment.  DLine got gashed against Rams, Ravens, Colts, Dolphins, Cardinals…….

[BobbyC81]

On 12/9/2024 at 4:08 AM, chef4131 said:

I do think its time for an Ed Oliver discussion   8 tkls this season and 1 sack   Am I wrong thinking we should have more production from him?  

 
Especially considering the extension he got.  Not getting the value from Oliver and Miller contracts.

[Sweats]

14 minutes ago, BobbyC81 said:

 
Especially considering the extension he got.  Not getting the value from Oliver and Miller contracts.

 

 

 

We'll let Miller walk in the offseason and find a solid replacement in the draft........we've got a lot of picks next year and some cap space to work with, so i'm confident that it'll work out for us.

[oldmanfan]

D line had their collective asses handed to them.  I hope pride kicks in when they see the film and they decide to man up Sunday.

[Aesop]

Still searching for a dominate 1 tech. When McD first arrived it was supposed to be Star, then a combo of Harry Phillips/Kyle Williams, then Jordan Phillips and now we are in the Daquon Jones years. Ed is a true 3 tech and although I will agree that he hasnt lived up to his contract, he hasnt had a solid 1 tech at his side. Which also effects how our linebackers play their gaps in the run game. Football will never change, it is always won or lost in the trenches.

[Brandon]

 I agree.  I thought the safeties would be the downfall of this team,  but they've been more or less adequate.  The defensive line,  however,  struggles to rush the passer and running plays up the middle have looked like the parting of the Red Sea all season.  The number one priority this offseason needs to be a DT that can hold the point of attack against the run.      

[oldmanfan]

At this point I'd play Solomon and sit Miller.  Miller is just not doing much.

[Brandon]

On 12/9/2024 at 6:08 AM, chef4131 said:

I do think its time for an Ed Oliver discussion   8 tkls this season and 1 sack   Am I wrong thinking we should have more production from him?  

 

Right now,  I'd say it's the worst contract on the roster.  .  

[All_Pro_Bills]

20 minutes ago, Brandon said:

 

Right now,  I'd say it's the worst contract on the roster.  .  

Ed's cap hit goes to $20.75M in 2025, $21M in 2026, $22.5 in 2027, and UFA in 2028.

[Mr. WEO]

17 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

Wilfork is HOF eligible. Richard Seymour is in the HOF. Ty law is in the HOF. McGinest was a HOF finalist I believe. Harrison is a HOF finalist. All not there during the entire dynasty but certainly for some of it.

 

Rousseau makes PFF stats and not a lot of actual plays. I do like him as a player.  He is just horribly inconsistent.  Zero impact yesterday. Even Von made more impact than Rousseau yesterday. 

 

Taron is a great player and probably 2nd most skilled player on the team. Maybe 3rd after Cooper now. Bernard is wonderful but still has size limitations. 

Beane has tried but the just has not been able to find a true star on the DL. 

 

He really isn't.  This became more obvious as Nacua just destroyed and toyed with him the whole game. 

[colin]

mcdermot is all about hard working and smart guys, he loves that.

 

he loves milano and bernard and aj klien and high motor DL who run stuff down, and corners and safeties who diagnose and communicate.  the problem is, he loves them to a fault.  bishop was hot trash his couple games when he played for injured starters, but he's an athletic marvel, as is elam, and similarly williams.

 

having guys line up far back and run so much means we need guys who can run all day, which generally means guys who are less big and less explosive, and the rams knew that and figured out how to get the second level to go the wrong way for a step and bait our hard charging DL over and over, somewhat similar to what baltimore did, except baltimore did it with power and the rams did it timing and stafford dropping dimes.

 

i really hope mcd and babbich figure something out, because their scheme was great vs kc.  i think we are too heavy game script dependent.  with the greatest qb of all time on the team, you should not plan to get a lead and grind and hope the other team makes mistakes, that is what the colts did and their d was similar and only won a chip when that one safety caught fire between injuries and just super charged their d.

 

mcd's scheme can work but he needs a chaos machine on the DL like "the kraken" was, who can single handedly just beat people in front of him and disrupt runs and passes.  ultimately our guys are a bit over fit to his overly specific scheme, and thus elam, bishop, and williams just can't be worked in to the d to do what they do well, because everyone on our d has to do so many different things and with the line just bolting up the pitch all day, a step or two at LB or db spells disaster vs a high quality qb.

 

im still on my if he wins it all he's here as long as he wants, and if he gets his pants taken down and spanked on d in the playoffs again he's gotta go.  with ja17 and especially with him and that line we have on o, we need a d that has a chance to get stops vs top flight opponents.

[nedboy7]

After listening to Marino this morning this is really the problem. 

It is a great recap of the defensive effort.  A must listen. 

[SCBills]

1 hour ago, oldmanfan said:

At this point I'd play Solomon and sit Miller.  Miller is just not doing much.

I see people say this, but most weeks he’s one of our highest rated defensive line guys.  Not a high barrier given our DT’s have been giving us nothing and Epenesa shows up every 2-3 games, but still..

[strive_for_five_guy]

5 minutes ago, SCBills said:

I see people say this, but most weeks he’s one of our highest rated defensive line guys.  Not a high barrier given our DT’s have been giving us nothing and Epenesa shows up every 2-3 games, but still..

Are these people professional football coaches and experts, though?

[Bill51390]

They need to blow up the defensive line, what we have isn’t working. This rotational/situational players on the line isn’t working and hasn’t worked. Need a massive upgrade at 1 tech. Need to move on from Miller and Epenesa neither are worth what we are paying them. If they need to stay, not sure what their cap hits look like, then they need to just be backups and not situational players. Then draft a pass rusher, I don’t care

if we need to trade up. The defensive line is killing us. They kill us every year in the post season. It needs to be a focus. 
The offense is fine, Allen is showing this year that we can pretty much just plug players in there and he will produce. We are okay at LBer, DB/Safety we are fine, could do with some upgrades, but we can be fine with what we have. This offseason needs to be all in on defensive line. 

[Call_Of_Ktulu]

I am still a big believer of the Pat Williams Ted Washington DT’s with pure speed rushers on the outside. 

2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

Ed's cap hit goes to $20.75M in 2025, $21M in 2026, $22.5 in 2027, and UFA in 2028.

I hate paying DT’s this kind of money unless they are a generational talent which Ed is not. 

[LabattBlue]

3 hours ago, oldmanfan said:

At this point I'd play Solomon and sit Miller.  Miller is just not doing much.

Same old same old. For the most part, just run upfield past the QB, which is bad whether it is a running play or passing play.  Can’t wait for him to become a former Bill come next spring/summer. 

Edited December 10 by LabattBlue

[LabattBlue]

2 hours ago, All_Pro_Bills said:

Ed's cap hit goes to $20.75M in 2025, $21M in 2026, $22.5 in 2027, and UFA in 2028.

😡

[LABILLBACKER]

3 hours ago, Aesop said:

Still searching for a dominate 1 tech. When McD first arrived it was supposed to be Star, then a combo of Harry Phillips/Kyle Williams, then Jordan Phillips and now we are in the Daquon Jones years. Ed is a true 3 tech and although I will agree that he hasnt lived up to his contract, he hasnt had a solid 1 tech at his side. Which also effects how our linebackers play their gaps in the run game. Football will never change, it is always won or lost in the trenches.

Then find a monster 1 tech. A guy that blocks out the sun. Someone who's not Haynesworth.  We've been rotating Jags @ 1T since McD took the job.  And yes Ed Oliver has not played anywhere near his contract. 

[Alphadawg7]

12 hours ago, Kelly to Allen said:

The buffalo dline was elite vs KC.

 

Again ppl are being the prisoner of the moment...

 

 

 

Prisoner of the moment is focusing on the DL being "elite" against a team with a mediocre offense and sub par OL.  

 

DL was embarrassed against the Ravens and Rams, teams who can throw and run the ball with QB's who can get the ball out quickly.

 

So I would say you are being prisoner to an isolated past moment and ignoring the real issues that are going to be problematic when we face premium opposition in the post season.