12/1/2024 Bills vs. 49’ers post game thread

[Gregg]

https://nypost.com/2024/12/02/sports/bills-fans-throw-snowballs-at-injured-christian-mccaffrey-49ers-kick/

[Mat68]

2 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

 

I wouldn't argue against the Dunne article being an impetus for McDermott to self-examine and change.  I also think the way the team rallied behind him may have had a strong emotional impact on him.  I think there are some other things though.

I believe McD spent Josh Allen's first 5 years butting heads with his offensive coordinators to develop a solid run game not named Josh Allen.  As a defensive-minded coach, he knows very well that it's much harder to defend a "multiple" offense that can run when they need to, that being able to control clock is a needed complimentary trait, and that if you're concerned with the long-term health of your QB it's not smart to use him as your best RB.  I think Daboll (and his disciple Dorsey) heard "blah blah Ginger, blah blah blah Ginger" whenever McDermott would try to make that point, to where McDermott resorted to calling them out in pressers (not his nature).

 

I also think that Leslie Frazier had a different defensive mindset than McDermott in some big moments.  (Others may disagree, and that's fine) I think Babich is more aggressive and stays more aggressive when he has a lead, and McDermott is good with that.

 

So I think McDermott, all around, is looser this year because he has a coaching staff that is more comfortable for him to work with and he has a run game that looks pretty solid independent of his QB.  He has less internal frustrations he's presenting a "stone face" about.  

 

It's also easier to be "looser", more relaxed and happier, with a 10-2 team that just won the division in week 12, than it is to 6-6 at the bye week with several of your best players on IR.  A good dose of that "Vitamin W" cures many ills!

 

 

I think those a fair points.  Fraizer well liked around the league.  Daboll and Dorsey had the shine of creating Allen.  Imo Daboll knew passing and Allens success gets him a Head coaching job and that was his end goal.  Dorsey as a qb wanted to pass aswell.  Mcdermott looks to right in both decisions.
 

 He wanted a more aggressive defense.  See 13 secs.  That required personnel changes and schematic.  They have done both. 
 

Mcdermott wanted a run game to pair with poor environments to play in.  In a even match up having the ability to posses the ball and control the game is big.  Balance makes everything on offense easier and the job of the opposing defense much harder.  The book on the Bills offense was written in 2020.  Now the book is still open.  Answers for the defense are available but they come with a cost.  Play a light box Buffalo runs its at will.  Stop the run Allen can piece you up.  Play man, zone and the same holds true.  Mcdermott wants to win and genuinely cares about his players.  Allen the leader streamlines his message to the team.  A leadership counsel has multiple opinions. Now there is really 2 Mcdermott and Allen. 

 

  

[bigK14094]

15 hours ago, GETTOTHE50 said:

That Allen dive for the pylon will be in commercials for a while.

Have seen him to it before....its one of his moves.

[Big Turk]

37 minutes ago, Mat68 said:

I think those a fair points.  Fraizer well liked around the league.  Daboll and Dorsey had the shine of creating Allen.  Imo Daboll knew passing and Allens success gets him a Head coaching job and that was his end goal.  Dorsey as a qb wanted to pass aswell.  Mcdermott looks to right in both decisions.
 

 He wanted a more aggressive defense.  See 13 secs.  That required personnel changes and schematic.  They have done both. 
 

Mcdermott wanted a run game to pair with poor environments to play in.  In a even match up having the ability to posses the ball and control the game is big.  Balance makes everything on offense easier and the job of the opposing defense much harder.  The book on the Bills offense was written in 2020.  Now the book is still open.  Answers for the defense are available but they come with a cost.  Play a light box Buffalo runs its at will.  Stop the run Allen can piece you up.  Play man, zone and the same holds true.  Mcdermott wants to win and genuinely cares about his players.  Allen the leader streamlines his message to the team.  A leadership counsel has multiple opinions. Now there is really 2 Mcdermott and Allen. 

 

  

 

Bills now have an answer for virtually any way the other team wants to try and defend them offensively.

[Logic]

2 hours ago, Beck Water said:

 

 

I wouldn't argue against the Dunne article being an impetus for McDermott to self-examine and change.  I also think the way the team rallied behind him may have had a strong emotional impact on him.  I think there are some other things though.

I believe McD spent Josh Allen's first 5 years butting heads with his offensive coordinators to develop a solid run game not named Josh Allen.  As a defensive-minded coach, he knows very well that it's much harder to defend a "multiple" offense that can run when they need to, that being able to control clock is a needed complimentary trait, and that if you're concerned with the long-term health of your QB it's not smart to use him as your best RB.  I think Daboll (and his disciple Dorsey) heard "blah blah Ginger, blah blah blah Ginger" whenever McDermott would try to make that point, to where McDermott resorted to calling them out in pressers (not his nature).

 

I also think that Leslie Frazier had a different defensive mindset than McDermott in some big moments.  (Others may disagree, and that's fine) I think Babich is more aggressive and stays more aggressive when he has a lead, and McDermott is good with that.

 

So I think McDermott, all around, is looser this year because he has a coaching staff that is more comfortable for him to work with and he has a run game that looks pretty solid independent of his QB.  He has less internal frustrations he's presenting a "stone face" about.  

 

It's also easier to be "looser", more relaxed and happier, with a 10-2 team that just won the division in week 12, than it is to 6-6 at the bye week with several of your best players on IR.  A good dose of that "Vitamin W" cures many ills!

 

 

All great points. Thanks for this perspective.

Aside from the fact that McDermott seems to be in harmony with his current coordinators (which I agree with) and seems freed up to be more of a CEO rather than having to micro-manage (which also helps the team in a big way), I also think there's definitely something to the "scars"/fresh start argument.

That is: Having all these new/young players on the team -- and having six "heart and soul" captains gone -- has removed a lot of the scar tissue that had built up on this team and, with it, a lot of the "tightness" and weight.

The last time we saw the team look this good and the vibes around the team be this good was 2020, which incidentally was the last time this team played free and had fun without the crushing weight of expectation. From 2021 onward, the expectations became greater, the painful losses in big moments mounted, and the collective weight on everyone's shoulders just increased exponentially. It culminated in the 2023 season, where Joe Brady had to actually TELL the players "hey...I want you to celebrate and smile and have some fun out there" once he was hired as OC. He had to try to COACH them into enjoying themselves.

Now, that "version" of the Bills is gone. A lot of the players that went through those experiences are gone. And along with the exodus of those veterans, expectations were comparatively low for the Bills coming into this season. In starting a new chapter, in having a fresh start, in playing free, and being free of the weight of the world, I think this team is once again having fun and bonding, and building their own identity and legacy, somewhat separate from those of the teams that preceded them.

One of the reasons I argued for McDermott to be fired last year was that I felt a fresh psychological start was needed, and I thought that hiring a new head man was the only way to accomplish that. Thankfully, it appears that was not necessary. A few new coordinators and position coaches, a turning of the page and infusion of youth on the roster, and a bunch of preseason "this'll be the worst year of the Josh Allen era" prognostications from the talking heads, and here we are: the team is having fun, playing loose, exceeding expectations, and building something NEW. You love to see it.

[Beck Water]

14 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Bills now have an answer for virtually any way the other team wants to try and defend them offensively.

 

Not a perfect answer, but an answer for sure.  We will see if it is enough.

[Mailman]

22 minutes ago, bigK14094 said:

Have seen him to it before....its one of his moves.

Similar to the Minnesota game his rookie year. 

[Beck Water]

9 minutes ago, Logic said:

All great points. Thanks for this perspective.

Aside from the fact that McDermott seems to be in harmony with his current coordinators (which I agree with) and seems freed up to be more of a CEO rather than having to micro-manage (which also helps the team in a big way), I also think there's definitely something to the "scars"/fresh start argument.

That is: Having all these new/young players on the team -- and having six "heart and soul" captains gone -- has removed a lot of the scar tissue that had built up on this team and, with it, a lot of the "tightness" and weight.

The last time we saw the team look this good and the vibes around the team be this good was 2020, which incidentally was the last time this team played free and had fun without the crushing weight of expectation. From 2021 onward, the expectations became greater, the painful losses in big moments mounted, and the collective weight on everyone's shoulders just increased exponentially. It culminated in the 2023 season, where Joe Brady had to actually TELL the players "hey...I want you to celebrate and smile and have some fun out there" once he was hired as OC. He had to try to COACH them into enjoying themselves.

Now, that "version" of the Bills is gone. A lot of the players that went through those experiences are gone. And along with the exodus of those veterans, expectations were comparatively low for the Bills coming into this season. In starting a new chapter, in having a fresh start, in playing free, and being free of the weight of the world, I think this team is once again having fun and bonding, and building their own identity and legacy, somewhat separate from those of the teams that preceded them.

One of the reasons I argued for McDermott to be fired last year was that I felt a fresh psychological start was needed, and I thought that hiring a new head man was the only way to accomplish that. Thankfully, it appears that was not necessary. A few new coordinators and position coaches, a turning of the page and infusion of youth on the roster, and a bunch of preseason "this'll be the worst year of the Josh Allen era" prognostications from the talking heads, and here we are: the team is having fun, playing loose, exceeding expectations, and building something NEW. You love to see it.

 

Good post and fair points all.  

 

I think the point about the value of new/young players vs. the setback of moving on from the  veteran core is especially relevant.   Veteran players in each room who teach the rookies/new players how to be NFL players, convey the Bills culture, and help the team keep on track through losses and injuries are important.  McDermott values that.   

But those veterans as they age also diminish in skill, and as you point out - scar tissue builds up where the team gets into a situation where they've previously come up short and "we've seen this movie before" trauma takes over.  Some players I think do become overall cynical, and then pass on that cynicism rather than the belief and confidence McDermott values.  You can manage a handful of cynics if the right counterbalance is there, but it's tricky.

I like the Vibe of the team right now.  Hopefully, it will continue.

[Big Turk]

12 minutes ago, Beck Water said:

 

Not a perfect answer, but an answer for sure.  We will see if it is enough.

 

No team has perfect answers...every team has some flaws.

[Stads]

Mike Schopp is such a wet blanket. He said it's "weird" how much Bills' fans crave the adoration of the national media about the team. He also said he turned the game off early to finish watching a Jon-Benet Ramsey documentary. 

 

He seriously needs to quit and go full time into the fantasy space. It's all he cares about anyway. We're all riding high right now. His negative shtick is growing old

[RiotAct]

7 minutes ago, Stads said:

Mike Schopp is such a wet blanket. He said it's "weird" how much Bills' fans crave the adoration of the national media about the team. He also said he turned the game off early to finish watching a Jon-Benet Ramsey documentary. 

lol wtf

[D. L. Hot-Flamethrower]

4 minutes ago, RiotAct said:

lol wtf

Great that he's catching up on new stories

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

1 hour ago, Gregg said:

https://nypost.com/2024/12/02/sports/bills-fans-throw-snowballs-at-injured-christian-mccaffrey-49ers-kick/

If the Post says it, I'm inclined to believe the opposite 

[Malazan]

12 minutes ago, Stads said:

Mike Schopp is such a wet blanket. He said it's "weird" how much Bills' fans crave the adoration of the national media about the team. He also said he turned the game off early to finish watching a Jon-Benet Ramsey documentary. 

 

He seriously needs to quit and go full time into the fantasy space. It's all he cares about anyway. We're all riding high right now. His negative shtick is growing old

Why in the hell would you listen to him?

[Big Turk]

49ers made NFL History last night:

 

 

[Logic]

20 minutes ago, Stads said:

Mike Schopp is such a wet blanket. He said it's "weird" how much Bills' fans crave the adoration of the national media about the team. He also said he turned the game off early to finish watching a Jon-Benet Ramsey documentary. 

 

He seriously needs to quit and go full time into the fantasy space. It's all he cares about anyway. We're all riding high right now. His negative shtick is growing old

There's an episode of Parks and Recreation featuring a shock jock radio show. The radio show is co-hosted by two guys: Crazy Ira and The Douche. It's a gross, tacky, un-funny caricature of a radio show, with dumb sound effects, sophomoric humor, and moronic conversation.

I bring this up because, well...that's what Schopp and the Bulldog is. It's outdated, irrelevant, sophomoric, grade school level "analysis" of football. In this day and age, with so much GOOD, insightful, intelligent, meaningful post-game analysis and discussion and dissection readily and freely available, it is an ongoing wonder to me why ANYONE would purposely subject themselves to such utter garbage.

"...other than that, Mrs Lincoln, how did you like the play?"

[MJS]

1 hour ago, Gregg said:

https://nypost.com/2024/12/02/sports/bills-fans-throw-snowballs-at-injured-christian-mccaffrey-49ers-kick/

Since when are snowballs seen as such a serious thing? I mean, jeeze. What if Christian McCaffrey got hit with a snowball!!!!!??? My gosh, would he ever recover???

[mikemac2001]

1 hour ago, Gregg said:

https://nypost.com/2024/12/02/sports/bills-fans-throw-snowballs-at-injured-christian-mccaffrey-49ers-kick/

They were just trying to ice his injured knee

[stevewin]

2 minutes ago, MJS said:

Since when are snowballs seen as such a serious thing? I mean, jeeze. What if Christian McCaffrey got hit with a snowball!!!!!??? My gosh, would he ever recover???

i remember one game within the last couple years - think it was a playoff game - there were some snowballs being thrown around and the sideline reporters were breathlessly reporting "THEY'RE THROWING ICEBALLLS!!!!!😱" like the end of the world was coming.  OMG - yeah I guess they are technically made of ice crystals.  I've never seen more hysterical overreaction to anything in my life

[Wacka]

3 hours ago, Bruffalo said:

I have WGR on in the background of my office when I'm not on a call. I'm pretty sure it's a prerequisite for any caller between 10AM-3PM to be absolutely sloshed. 

 

There was a guy on the Extra point show who sounded so drunk that I thought he was gonna hurl live on the radio. 

For funny, nothing beat East Side Eddy on the John Otto show at night on WGR back in the 80s. If anyone wanted to learn a Buffalo Polish accent all you had to do was listen when he called in.