MVP hype for Allen

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

 

I don't think the NE game is enough for Josh to lose MVP to Lamar, and the odds reflect that. But if he has another average at best game, considering Lamar has already (in the eyes of experts) played out of his skin against the Texans, it'll narrow further. And whatever happens tomorrow, anything but a Lions-like performance is likely to play into Lamar's hands. Either Josh will barely appear in week 18, or the Bills would have lost.

 

Last year, perhaps no one played well enough to truly be awarded MVP, particularly QBs. Whilst Josh put the stats together, seeing his OC sacked plus the number of interceptions counted against him. This year, two players in particular have lit up the league. Only one can claim the prize.

We'll ave to agree to disagree here.  Average games against NE & NY that the Bills still win should in no way cancel out the clear fact that Allen has better met the criteria of MVP then Jackson has.

 

And don't be quite so quick to dismiss the "conspiracy" angles here - there is a new thread that just liked to an article that lays out why the author believes there is a racial element in play here.  It's regrettable that such a thing has to pop up over this award but it's hard to argue against the articles evidence which IMO is overwhelming.

 

 

[Kelly to Allen]

27 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

He should play a couple of series throwing check downs and handing the ball off to stay sharp and keep his consecutive game starting streak active.  But by the end of the 1st quarter he should be on the bench.

 

 

No. 

 

 

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

We'll ave to agree to disagree here.  Average games against NE & NY that the Bills still win should in no way cancel out the clear fact that Allen has better met the criteria of MVP then Jackson has.

 

And don't be quite so quick to dismiss the "conspiracy" angles here - there is a new thread that just liked to an article that lays out why the author believes there is a racial element in play here.  It's regrettable that such a thing has to pop up over this award but it's hard to argue against the articles evidence which IMO is overwhelming.

 

 

 

I think we may agree with each other to an extent, but the performance against the Jets has opened up the chance for people to push Lamar. If Josh had put in a performance akin to the Niners/Rams/Lions then it would be harder for them to cobble an argument together. As it is, it's easy to relay play after play from Lamar from the last week. In comparison, there were no plays from the Jets game. Again, recency bias.

 

I can accept an argument of unconcious bias playing a part in the calls. Or, when it comes to Ryan Clark, a concious one. But the door has been opened, whether deemed fairly or unfairly.

[CincyBillsFan]

8 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

I think we may agree with each other to an extent, but the performance against the Jets has opened up the chance for people to push Lamar. If Josh had put in a performance akin to the Niners/Rams/Lions then it would be harder for them to cobble an argument together. As it is, it's easy to relay play after play from Lamar from the last week. In comparison, there were no plays from the Jets game. Again, recency bias.

 

I can accept an argument of unconcious bias playing a part in the calls. Or, when it comes to Ryan Clark, a concious one. But the door has been opened, whether deemed fairly or unfairly.

IMO the door was closed after Allen's play in the 4 game stretch against the Chiefs, 49's, Rams & Lions.  The ONLY thing IMO that could knock Allen from the top of the MVP hill versus Jackson would be for the Bills to lose the next 2 games and finish behind Baltimore for the #2 seed.

 

 

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, CincyBillsFan said:

IMO the door was closed after Allen's play in the 4 game stretch against the Chiefs, 49's, Rams & Lions.  The ONLY thing IMO that could knock Allen from the top of the MVP hill versus Jackson would be for the Bills to lose the next 2 games and finish behind Baltimore for the #2 seed.

 

 

 

If that happens, I have no doubt Jackson will be MVP.

[CincyBillsFan]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

 

If that happens, I have no doubt Jackson will be MVP.

And if it doesn't happen I have no doubt that Allen SHOULD be the MVP.

 

 

[zow2]

Voters may be hoping that Saquon breaks the record.  That would be a good excuse to not vote for Allen.... or Lamar for a 3rd time.   With the Eagles locked in to their division title and also keeping Hurts out, seems kinda nuts to run him more than a handful of times.  Maybe they hope he can break a long run or two.

 

 

[UKBillFan]

1 minute ago, zow2 said:

Voters may be hoping that Saquon breaks the record.  That would be a good excuse to not vote for Allen.... or Lamar for a 3rd time.   With the Eagles locked in to their division title and also keeping Hurts out, seems kinda nuts to run him more than a handful of times.  Maybe they hope he can break a long run or two.

 

 

 

Barkely all but disappearing after Hurts went out really dented his claim.

[zow2]

Just now, UKBillFan said:

 

Barkely all but disappearing after Hurts went out really dented his claim.

 

I agree but I'd make a bet that if he sets the rushing record he has a real shot to win MVP.   

[UKBillFan]

Just now, zow2 said:

 

I agree but I'd make a bet that if he sets the rushing record he has a real shot to win MVP.   

 

I think it stands out that every debate this week has been focused on Josh v Lamar. Or just how wonderful, glorious and brilliant Lamar is. Barkley has barely been mentioned.

[julian]

1 hour ago, UKBillFan said:

 

For all the conspiracy theories about race etc. the biggest issue for Josh is he had an average game against the Jets whilst Lamar played lights out against both the Steelers and the Texans. Albeit Josh wasn't helped by his receivers last Sunday - if Shakir, twice, and Cooper had held on to those passes it may have been slightly different. But, as it is, it has really brought Lamar back into the equation. Recency is king.

Lights out against the Texans is wild… he completed 10 passes and ran the ball 4 times, he made a couple big plays but was essentially just operating an extremely high functioning offense.

[UKBillFan]

Just now, julian said:

Lights out against the Texans is wild… he completed 10 passes and ran the ball 4 times, he made a couple big plays but was essentially just operating an extremely high functioning offense.

 

That's how it's been presented by the experts. I was watching one clip this morning stating how great Lamar was despite only completing ten passes and running the ball four times.

[zow2]

1 minute ago, UKBillFan said:

 

I think it stands out that every debate this week has been focused on Josh v Lamar. Or just how wonderful, glorious and brilliant Lamar is. Barkley has barely been mentioned.

 

It's *Only* if he breaks the record that he will be back in play.  If he falls one yard short he has zero shot.  I don't think he gets it, not if the Eagles care about their playoff run.

 

The only voter I've heard consistently on TV is Acho.  He's been very measured and rational.  Many of these other tv guys spouting off are overly emotional and have personal agendas to root for certain guy(s).  I don't think they represent the majority of the voters.

[UKBillFan]

3 minutes ago, zow2 said:

 

It's *Only* if he breaks the record that he will be back in play.  If he falls one yard short he has zero shot.  I don't think he gets it, not if the Eagles care about their playoff run.

 

The only voter I've heard consistently on TV is Acho.  He's been very measured and rational.  Many of these other tv guys spouting off are overly emotional and have personal agendas to root for certain guy(s).  I don't think they represent the majority of the voters.

 

Acho makes things up as he goes along. A couple of weeks ago he was saying team record is key, and is why he voted for Lamar last year. Suddenly he's not outright backing Josh.

[Goin Breakdown]

So can the rain tomorrow affect MVP voting?  I'm asking sarcastically yet seriously too. It seems like if Josh does anything wrong it's over. 
 

[zow2]

7 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

So can the rain tomorrow affect MVP voting?  I'm asking sarcastically yet seriously too. It seems like if Josh does anything wrong it's over. 
 

 

If the Oline can dominate the trenches, I think Buffalo can run and pass well enough in the rain to win going away.  Allen could prob take off and scramble/slide more than a few times.  If he wants to just stand still in the pocket and throw, i honestly don't think that's his strength.  When he's on, he's moving, extending plays and creating stuff.

[strive_for_five_guy]

8 minutes ago, UKBillFan said:

 

Acho makes things up as he goes along. A couple of weeks ago he was saying team record is key, and is why he voted for Lamar last year. Suddenly he's not outright backing Josh.

We will ultimately find out when the votes are cast where Acho lands.  People can’t just glaze Josh nonstop when Lamar is actually putting up better numbers.  After Lamar’s performance on Wed, Acho acknowledged the race isn’t over yet, but also posted a video clarifying how the MVP is about which play is most valuable, not necessarily who has the best stats.  Whoever Acho and others vote for, they’re ultimately going to need to answer for that, so a measured approach is to show consideration for various perspectives.

 

I continue to believe if Josh and the team lock up the 2 seed tomorrow, barring a horrible day by Josh, he will end up winning MVP.  And he still has a decent shot to win it even with a bad day in a win tomorrow.

[Goin Breakdown]

8 minutes ago, zow2 said:

 

If the Oline can dominate the trenches, I think Buffalo can run and pass well enough in the rain to win going away.  Allen could prob take off and scramble/slide more than a few times.  If he wants to just stand still in the pocket and throw, i honestly don't think that's his strength.  When he's on, he's moving, extending plays and creating stuff.

Unfortunately watching tomorrow's game will have a level of "Allen being great" rather than the team being great. Thats not what the game should be about.  

[zow2]

7 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Unfortunately watching tomorrow's game will have a level of "Allen being great" rather than the team being great. Thats not what the game should be about.  

 

I don't know who's in and who's out on the Jets DLine, but i think this will be a 180+ rushing day for the Bills.   Maybe that includes a Josh tush-push or two.  I really think the Bills take it to the Jets tomorrow, just not sure how impressive Allen will be.  He should do Ok,  there's no need to take risky shots downfield in lousy rain but he will probably take a few.  

[Process]

I can't get over them running a segment discussing Lamar Jackson being the most underappreciated QB in the league. He may be the most over appreciated player in NFL history. 

 

2 playoff wins in 7 years

2 40 TD seasons in 7 years

1 4000 yard passing season in 7 years