MVP hype for Allen

[Goin Breakdown]

22 minutes ago, SCBills said:

Joe Burrow has a different vibe about him.  We all know what I mean by this. 
 

 

Arrogance? Am I missing something? 

[SCBills]

3 minutes ago, Goin Breakdown said:

Arrogance? Am I missing something? 

@Process nailed it above on play style. 
 

Burrow also has a much more swagged out style.  What Josh Allen does for a meme, is how Burrow actually is, fashion-wise.  And I don’t hate it, it works for him.   He wears the latest fashion and rolls up to the game listening to “walk in your trap, take over your trap”.   Josh Allen wears an oversized hoodie and listens to Frank Sinatra. 

[Orlando Buffalo]

This years MVP race is actually very telling for many of the MVP voters in that many of them have admitted that they don't understand football by contradicting themselves multiple times this year. So many guys who said stats are everything, now are arguing they are the only thing, guys who said Josh can't show for the big games saw him do it 4 games a row and then pretend KC and Detroit aren't big games. Several of them said Josh would be MVP if the Bills made the playoffs before the season now argue he was loads of talent around him. Truly knowing football apparently is not a requirement to vote on MVP, I will state also that Lamar is having an incredible year but is not the MVP because King Henry is the one who makes the team go. 

[zow2]

2 hours ago, SirAndrew said:

Lamar can have MVP if we get a Super Bowl parade in Buffalo. I love Josh, but an Allen MVP doesn’t matter to me. Does he deserve it? Yes, but it is what it is. An Allen MVP only gives us bragging rights over random fans and pundits. That doesn’t do much for me. 

 

I think it matters to a lot of us for various reasons.  Bills fans want him to be recognized with the highest individual honor in the NFL. It would be a ticket to the HOF without any question.   He deserves it not just for this season but for his body of work and offensive production (records) over the past several years. Lamar is not 3 MVP’s to Zero better than Josh.  
 

I also want Allen to leave Buffalo someday with hardware.  The Lombardi is what we all want but the MVP is a nice consolation prize for him and the organization. Who knows if Josh will be this close again? maybe next season Mahomes goes off again, then Burrow makes a run… or Jayden Daniels, Goff, Lamar again, etc.   He’s so close now, just needs a decent game and win vs the Jets.

[Success]

2 hours ago, SirAndrew said:

Lamar can have MVP if we get a Super Bowl parade in Buffalo. I love Josh, but an Allen MVP doesn’t matter to me. Does he deserve it? Yes, but it is what it is. An Allen MVP only gives us bragging rights over random fans and pundits. That doesn’t do much for me. 

 

I get the sentiment.  

 

But, IF we never get a title, I kind of want history to know how great this guy was.  I hate thinking that way, because Josh Allen kind of has to get a ring at some point. He's too good not too, but stranger things have happened.

 

[Chicken Boo]

4 hours ago, H2o said:

Just now watching these videos.

 

Ryan Clark is a clown. Cam Newton is a clown. They definitely speak from their own racial bias in many instances.  Dominique Foxworth is another just the same, as well as Chris Canty. It gets pretty ridiculous after a while. It would probably hurt them to the core if Josh got a Lombardi before Lamar. It would hurt them even more if Josh got one and Lamar NEVER gets one. 

 

So if all of them were inspired by Randall Cunningham and Michael Vick, does that mean Josh was inspired by Fran Tarkenton and Steve Young?

 

Then he mentions the "tush push" as a reason for the disparity in rushing TD's.  Clark obviously doesn't even watch the Bills. He also doesn't take into account where Lamar is throwing 5 yard TD's, Josh is running in from 5 yards out. 

 

Did they watch last year where Josh was better than Lamar, but Lamar got the MVP because of his team's record? They'll blame it on Josh's INTs of course. I haven't heard ANYONE say Lamar is not deserving, but quit trying to create some narrative that Lamar is MJ or Kobe and being failed by not receiving his accolades due. Just a stupid argument. 

 

Josh played better than his stats for the most part, but he had 29 TDs and 18 INTs.  He wasn't going to win with those numbers. 

[transplantbillsfan]

Allen has really cleaned up his ball security as far as fumbling goes. Allen only has 2 lost fumbles to Lamar's 5. And overall (recovered and lost) Lamar has 10 fumbles to Allen’s 5.

 

9 turnovers for Lamar.

 

8 turnovers for Josh.

[Chicken Boo]

This board makes a habit of pooping on any QB that isn't Josh Allen. 

 

I had someone tell me Burrow was "a checkdown artist that had been figured out" a couple months ago.  The Lamar hate goes all the way back to the draft process and has never stopped.

 

Fans are now trying to downplay Mahomes's greatness because he hasn't thrown for 5,000 yards and 40 TDs the last couple of seasons.  They're crediting Reid with all his success.

 

Now I'm reading that Josh is receiving criticism because of racism. 😆

 

Heaven forbid that everyone isn't on their knees for a QB that has seen exactly 1 AFC Championship game.  

 

Victim mentality, you say?  The lack of awareness is blinding.  

[Kelly to Allen]

18 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

This board makes a habit of pooping on any QB that isn't Josh Allen. 

 

I had someone tell me Burrow was "a checkdown artist that had been figured out" a couple months ago.  The Lamar hate goes all the way back to the draft process and has never stopped.

 

Fans are now trying to downplay Mahomes's greatness because he hasn't thrown for 5,000 yards and 40 TDs the last couple of seasons.  They're crediting Reid with all his success.

 

Now I'm reading that Josh is receiving criticism because of racism. 😆

 

Heaven forbid that everyone isn't on their knees for a QB that has seen exactly 1 AFC Championship game.  

 

Victim mentality, you say?  The lack of awareness is blinding.  

 

Lamar Jackson made the pro bowl over Allen in 21....

 

Josh Allen didn't make the pro bowl last year...

 

Allen has the most tds in NFL history in his first 6 years 

He had the most tds in NFL history over any 4 year span ever from 20-23

 

If you took away all of Allens rushing production he has still tied Peyton Manning in passing tds in his first 6 years with less ints 

 

But Nick the troll wright said Allen shouldn't make the pro bowl this year lol ....literally today he said this. 

 

Jalen hurts was voted all pro over Allen in 22

 

If you listen to Ryan Clark, Rob Parker, and Bart Scott or Chris Canty, yes their is an irrational antagonism towards Allen. Dominique foxworth said he roots for his downfall and disparaged all his fans in the worst light.

 

He was voted as the most overrated QB by the players and is constantly undermined in the media with rhetoric about turnovers when he has almost the identical amount of turnovers in his first 6 years as Tom Brady and the exact same ints. Every single time his name is brought up it's in conjunction with " turnovers"

 

In fact it's the opposite in the playoffs as Allen is among the greatest ever and protecting the football in the playoffs 

 

Lamar Jackson has more ints and more turnovers in less playoff games....

 

Allen has almost 100 more tds than Lamar since 2020 in the regular season and playoffs. Allens playoff numbers are arguably the second greatest start ever for a QB in his first ten playoff games. 

 

Yet the media is going to give Lamar a 3rd MVP before he's won 3 playoff games 

 

That sir is called journalistic erasure. 

Edited December 28, 2024 by Kelly to Allen

[SCBills]

30 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

This board makes a habit of pooping on any QB that isn't Josh Allen. 

 

I had someone tell me Burrow was "a checkdown artist that had been figured out" a couple months ago.  The Lamar hate goes all the way back to the draft process and has never stopped.

 

Fans are now trying to downplay Mahomes's greatness because he hasn't thrown for 5,000 yards and 40 TDs the last couple of seasons.  They're crediting Reid with all his success.

 

Now I'm reading that Josh is receiving criticism because of racism. 😆

 

Heaven forbid that everyone isn't on their knees for a QB that has seen exactly 1 AFC Championship game.  

 

Victim mentality, you say?  The lack of awareness is blinding.  

Oh no, one person argued with you about Burrow.  That anecdotal evidence is certainly worth you ranting like this. 
 

I haven’t seen anybody say Reid is responsible for Mahomes..  I have seen people, myself included, say Allen would have similar success with Reid.  Maybe you disagree with that. 
 

Regarding the racism aspect.   His biggest detractors on ESPN have all made comments in the past about rooting for Lamar due to his blackness. (Mahomes is too light skinned for them) and folks like Dominique Foxworth have specifically talked about not being able to root for JA due to other reasons we don’t need to get into. 
 

And lastly.. you call yourself a Bills fan and take a shot at Allen like that?  “He’s only seen 1 AFC CG”… I’m sorry, can you remind us what happened last year in the Divisional Round with our Defense?   Can you illuminate the crowd on how it’s somehow on JA for us not beating the Chiefs when he gave us the lead with 13 seconds left?

 

 

Edited December 28, 2024 by SCBills

[Kelly to Allen]

53 minutes ago, transplantbillsfan said:

Allen has really cleaned up his ball security as far as fumbling goes. Allen only has 2 lost fumbles to Lamar's 5. And overall (recovered and lost) Lamar has 10 fumbles to Allen’s 5.

 

9 turnovers for Lamar.

 

8 turnovers for Josh.

 

Josh Allen has the 3rd LEAST amount of turnovers in NFL playoff history for a QB in his first ten playoff games. Only Brady and Mahomes are better 

2 hours ago, Orlando Buffalo said:

This years MVP race is actually very telling for many of the MVP voters in that many of them have admitted that they don't understand football by contradicting themselves multiple times this year. So many guys who said stats are everything, now are arguing they are the only thing, guys who said Josh can't show for the big games saw him do it 4 games a row and then pretend KC and Detroit aren't big games. Several of them said Josh would be MVP if the Bills made the playoffs before the season now argue he was loads of talent around him. Truly knowing football apparently is not a requirement to vote on MVP, I will state also that Lamar is having an incredible year but is not the MVP because King Henry is the one who makes the team go. 

 

To be fair, the gravity Lamar creates makes every ravens RB productive. But Henry is a different level. He's the Eric Dickerson of this era 

[Big Turk]

34 minutes ago, Kelly to Allen said:

 

Josh Allen has the 3rd LEAST amount of turnovers in NFL playoff history for a QB in his first ten playoff games. Only Brady and Mahomes are better 

 

To be fair, the gravity Lamar creates makes every ravens RB productive. But Henry is a different level. He's the Eric Dickerson of this era 

 

Here is the thing tho and why I say Henry is the MVP of the Ravens.

 

Ravens face some of the highest percentage of 8 man boxes in the NFL. Why? To stop Henry.

 

Why do they choose to stop Henry? Because they know if they do, Lamar is unlikely to be able to beat them on his own and will struggle.

 

Lamar is 2-5 when Henry has under 90 yards. His 2 wins were against the Giants and Bengals.

 

He lost to the Raiders and Browns who are a combined 3-24 against the rest of the NFL.

 

Those heavy boxes put Lamar in very favorable passing matchups which lead to a lot of college wide open receivers. Essentially he is throwing to people in wide open spaces more than anyone else, similar to Tua last year. 

 

If you watched both Steeler games it essentially tells you the entire story in a nutshell.

 

In the first game, the Steelers held Henry in check, didn't even score a TD and still won because Lamar couldn't overcome the lack of run support. In the second game, Henry runs wild and lo and behold, Lamar looks good(albeit with 3/4 of the Steelers secondary being out, but whatever).  That is the story. Shut Henry down and Lamar is unlikely to beat you.

 

Or as I like to say, Lamar will turn into La"mew".

 

Do teams go out of their way to shut Cook down? No...why? Because Allen can easily do what he did against the Rams and go sicko mode anyway with 6 TDs and 425 yards of offense by himself when Cook had 6 carries for 20 yards.

 

That's the difference. There are different levels to this most don't understand or take into consideration.

 

Without hesitation, every DC is trying to stop Allen with the Bills. Most DCs are first trying to stop Henry with the Ravens, not Lamar.

Edited December 28, 2024 by Big Turk

[Kelly to Allen]

3 hours ago, Doc Brown said:

Now we're getting somewhere to what the real debate is.  Everybody knows it but nobody will say it.

Can you imagine if we had social media during the bird and magic rivalry 😂 

2 minutes ago, Big Turk said:

 

Here is the thing tho and why I say Henry is the MVP of the Ravens.

 

Ravens face some of the highest percentage of 8 man boxes in the NFL. Why? To stop Henry.

 

Why do they choose to stop Henry? Because they know if they do, Lamar is unlikely to be able to beat them on his own and will struggle.

 

Lamar is 2-5 when Henry has under 90 yards. His 2 wins were against the Giants and Bengals.

 

He lost to the Raiders and Browns who are a combined 3-24 against the rest of the NFL.

 

Those heavy boxes put Lamar in very favorable passing matchups which lead to a lot of college wide open receivers. Essentially he is throwing to people in wide open spaces more than anyone else, similar to Tua last year. 

 

If you watched both Steeler games it essentially tells you the entire story in a nutshell.

 

In the first game, the Steelers held Henry in check, didn't even score a TD and still won because Lamar couldn't overcome the lack of run support. In the second game, Henry runs wild and lo and behold, Lamar looks good(albeit with 3/4 of the Steelers secondary being out, but whatever).  That is the story. Shut Henry down and Laanr is unlikely to beat you.

 

Do teams go out of their way to shut Cook down? No...why? Because Allen can easily do what he did against the Rams and go sicko mode anyway with 6 TDs and 425 yards of offense by himself.

 

That's the difference 

 

This is really my only question about Lamar. 

 

Allen can literally have zero running game and still beat mahomes lol. 

 

That's a line of distinction and why Allen is the second best QB in the NFL imo

[CincyBillsFan]

1 hour ago, Chicken Boo said:

Victim mentality, you say?  The lack of awareness is blinding.  

The only "lack of awareness" I see on this board is your post here.  You're on a Bills message board complaining that Bills Fans are mean to other QB's.  Talk about BLIND.

 

 

[strive_for_five_guy]

59 minutes ago, Chicken Boo said:

This board makes a habit of pooping on any QB that isn't Josh Allen. 

 

I had someone tell me Burrow was "a checkdown artist that had been figured out" a couple months ago.  The Lamar hate goes all the way back to the draft process and has never stopped.

 

Fans are now trying to downplay Mahomes's greatness because he hasn't thrown for 5,000 yards and 40 TDs the last couple of seasons.  They're crediting Reid with all his success.

 

Now I'm reading that Josh is receiving criticism because of racism. 😆

 

Heaven forbid that everyone isn't on their knees for a QB that has seen exactly 1 AFC Championship game.  

 

Victim mentality, you say?  The lack of awareness is blinding.  

Well said, man.  Many of the analysts WANTED to be able to crown Josh MVP already this year, heck I wish he were crowned as well.  Didn’t matter anyone’s color.  But Lamar does have generally better stats than Josh, and the Bills O just put up a less than memorable performance against the Pats.  And then Lamar just went out and put up some solid numbers against Houston, including an electrifying run, a team that Josh struggled mightily against.  Plus, Baltimore beat us down pretty good in Week 4.  Does this hurt the feelings of the homers out there?

 

All that said, I can also still lay out a solid case for Josh.  We gave the Chiefs and Lions two of their three losses.  Josh has way more TD runs that Lamar.  We are about to wrap up the 2 seed at 13-3 while the Ravens are still in a battle to win their division at 11-5.  Josh also doesn’t have a HOF RB at his side.

 

I think the media generally wants to be able to give Josh the MVP award, so long as he doesn’t give them a reason not to at this point.  If the Bills just beat the Jets on Sunday and Josh doesn’t have a bunch of turnovers, I think he’s still got a real great shot at it.  But, the media can’t just sit there and glaze Josh nonstop when Lamar is putting up the best stats of his own career and just ignore that.  
 

 

[Big Turk]

16 minutes ago, Kelly to Allen said:

Can you imagine if we had social media during the bird and magic rivalry 😂 

 

This is really my only question about Lamar. 

 

Allen can literally have zero running game and still beat mahomes lol. 

 

That's a line of distinction and why Allen is the second best QB in the NFL imo

 

Sorry, but Allen has been the best player in the league for the last year and a half, not just QB.

[H2o]

1 hour ago, Chicken Boo said:

 

Josh played better than his stats for the most part, but he had 29 TDs and 18 INTs.  He wasn't going to win with those numbers. 

JA17 had 44 total TD's to Lamar's 29. INT'S or no INT'S, Josh was clearly better. He also closed out winning 6 of 7 games, leading the Bills to their 4th straight AFCE title and the #2 seed.

 

The same idiots last year who were claiming "it's not all about the stats" are the idiots this year saying "this award should be based on the stats, and Lamar's are better Josh Allen's." Let's all shed a tear and light a candle for the injustice of it all if Lamar doesn't win. Josh will only get it because people don't want to vote for the same guy all the time, not because he's deserving. It's ridiculous. 

[Chicken Boo]

1 hour ago, Kelly to Allen said:

 

Lamar Jackson made the pro bowl over Allen in 21....

 

Josh Allen didn't make the pro bowl last year...

 

Allen has the most tds in NFL history in his first 6 years 

He had the most tds in NFL history over any 4 year span ever from 20-23

 

If you took away all of Allens rushing production he has still tied Peyton Manning in passing tds in his first 6 years with less ints 

 

But Nick the troll wright said Allen shouldn't make the pro bowl this year lol ....literally today he said this. 

 

Jalen hurts was voted all pro over Allen in 22

 

If you listen to Ryan Clark, Rob Parker, and Bart Scott or Chris Canty, yes their is an irrational antagonism towards Allen. Dominique foxworth said he roots for his downfall and disparaged all his fans in the worst light.

 

He was voted as the most overrated QB by the players and is constantly undermined in the media with rhetoric about turnovers when he has almost the identical amount of turnovers in his first 6 years as Tom Brady and the exact same ints. Every single time his name is brought up it's in conjunction with " turnovers"

 

In fact it's the opposite in the playoffs as Allen is among the greatest ever and protecting the football in the playoffs 

 

Lamar Jackson has more ints and more turnovers in less playoff games....

 

Allen has almost 100 more tds than Lamar since 2020 in the regular season and playoffs. Allens playoff numbers are arguably the second greatest start ever for a QB in his first ten playoff games. 

 

Yet the media is going to give Lamar a 3rd MVP before he's won 3 playoff games 

 

That sir is called journalistic erasure. 

 

And all of those gaudy stats have resulted in what? 

 

You could argue Lamar's win last year, but he was the QB of the team with the best record in the league that featured who outside of him?   His first MVP was an easy choice.  He won't win it this year unless Allen collapses, but I'm sure fans will still find reasons to complain. "It's should have ben unanimous."  I can see it now.

 

Josh has simply been unfortunate to live during an era of Mahomes, the end of Rodger's prime and Lamar, but he'll win it this year in all likelihood.

[Kelly to Allen]

Just now, Chicken Boo said:

 

And all of those gaudy stats have resulted in what? 

 

You could argue Lamar's win last year, but he was the QB of the team with the best record in the league that featured who outside of him?   His first MVP was an easy choice.  He won't win it this year unless Allen collapses, but I'm sure fans will still find reasons to complain. "It's should have ben unanimous."  I can see it now.

 

Josh has simply been unfortunate to live during an era of Mahomes, the end of Rodger's prime and Lamar, but he'll win it this year in all likelihood.

Ppl truly forget how great Rodgers was in his prime. It was unreal.

 

I've said it before, his playoff game in 2010 vs the falcons is the greatest QB performance I've ever seen. 

[Chicken Boo]

1 hour ago, SCBills said:

Oh no, one person argued with you about Burrow.  That anecdotal evidence is certainly worth you ranting like this. 
 

I haven’t seen anybody say Reid is responsible for Mahomes..  I have seen people, myself included, say Allen would have similar success with Reid.  Maybe you disagree with that. 
 

Regarding the racism aspect.   His biggest detractors on ESPN have all made comments in the past about rooting for Lamar due to his blackness. (Mahomes is too light skinned for them) and folks like Dominique Foxworth have specifically talked about not being able to root for JA due to other reasons we don’t need to get into. 
 

And lastly.. you call yourself a Bills fan and take a shot at Allen like that?  “He’s only seen 1 AFC CG”… I’m sorry, can you remind us what happened last year in the Divisional Round with our Defense?   Can you illuminate the crowd on how it’s somehow on JA for us not beating the Chiefs when he gave us the lead with 13 seconds left?

 

 

 

It's pretty common to sometimes root for people that look like you.  Representation is important.  It's why Eminem is #1 selling rapper of all time.  This isn't news.  

 

Oh no, Allen lost a playoff game because of poor coaching and defense.  Aaron Rodgers knows this pain all took well.  He dealt with it for the majority of his prime years. 

 

Can you illuminate on that 10 point performance Allen put up in the divisional round?  

 

You can be a fan without being a blind loyalist.  Josh is not above criticism and without a Super Bowl ring in these next few years, he's going to be closer to that Marino category.