Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 6 minutes ago, SoonerBillsFan said: All of them. He will break that promise
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 3 Posted December 3 47 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: I don't appreciate Trump's bluster on this. I know "mass deportations" is meant to be red meat for the base. I don't know for sure, but I hope he's saying this: We intend to enforce the immigration laws as written. If so, there are well over a million aliens who are here under final orders of deportation. They've had their due process and a judge/appeals board and/or court has said the judge was right. So there's a "mass" I guess right there. There's also obviously lots and lots of people here illegally who have criminal records. That's another mass that gets to go through whatever hearing process the law prescribes. Focus on those two groups of people and you are coming awfully close to Obama 2009-11, before he decided he couldn't stand to be called Deporter in Chief and started deciding which laws he liked enough to bother enforcing. There's another fantasy that to be honest Trump and his minions have encouraged: that every single illegal alien in the United States will be swept up by a Deportation Force that includes the military. Trump likes the shock and awe that that idea instills in people, but I sincerely hope he doesn't go there I don't like the rhetoric all that much, but that pales comparison to the abject failure to address the issues at the border by dems and republicans alike over the past several decades. Sadly, we're at a point where a firm hand has to be applied to fix the problem, and in doing so, it's almost certainly going to be ugly. Imo, the single best thing that can happen is if/when a person in authority obstructs lawful proceedings, he's placed in cuffs and taken to jail. I think your approach makes sense, if for no other reason than it has to start somewhere.
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 15 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: I don't like the rhetoric all that much, but that pales comparison to the abject failure to address the issues at the border by dems and republicans alike over the past several decades. Sadly, we're at a point where a firm hand has to be applied to fix the problem, and in doing so, it's almost certainly going to be ugly. Imo, the single best thing that can happen is if/when a person in authority obstructs lawful proceedings, he's placed in cuffs and taken to jail. I think your approach makes sense, if for no other reason than it has to start somewhere. Well thank goodness no one has "fixed" the "problem" at the border. Our economy is way better because of it. So my question is, fix what problem? The USA is made of immigrants, so exactly what problem do you want to fix? What is your big problem with immigrants? How are they hurting you? Maybe you are just easily manipulated into believing they are hurting you? If all he is going to do is free criminals from our prisons to send them to freedom in their home country, its kind of stupid. Plus, we pay for their trip home, right?
The Frankish Reich Posted December 3 Posted December 3 6 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Well thank goodness no one has "fixed" the "problem" at the border. Our economy is way better because of it. Well, I don't know, but I suspect that if the two polar opposites are (A) no illegal immigration whatsoever over the last 40 years (Reagan's amnesty) vs. (B) the real-life situation, then (B) would clearly win. But from that we can't infer that the huge numbers we've seen in the last 6 years (yes, that includes Trump years, when the big surge started), if continued indefinitely, would result in a net gain to the economy. I would like to think that we as a country and as a government can think critically and rationally, rather than a gut reaction that's "whatever the last guy did, let's do the opposite." With emphasis on the "would like to think" ...
Biden is Mentally Fit Posted December 3 Posted December 3 6 minutes ago, The Frankish Reich said: With emphasis on the "would like to think" ... The side that you prefer just went whole hog on hitler/nazis/fascists/weird/couch banging/end of democracy. Why even entertain the idea?
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 1 minute ago, The Frankish Reich said: Well, I don't know, but I suspect that if the two polar opposites are (A) no illegal immigration whatsoever over the last 40 years (Reagan's amnesty) vs. (B) the real-life situation, then (B) would clearly win. But from that we can't infer that the huge numbers we've seen in the last 6 years (yes, that includes Trump years, when the big surge started), if continued indefinitely, would result in a net gain to the economy. I would like to think that we as a country and as a government can think critically and rationally, rather than a gut reaction that's "whatever the last guy did, let's do the opposite." With emphasis on the "would like to think" ... You have to motivate voters. GOP can do that by saying immigrants are eating cats. Dems can't do that. If there was one lesson from this election it was that voters hate inflation. That was the issue, but how do you campaign on that? Harris tried doing what Truman did in 1948, blames Wall Street and corportations, but there was no there there. Truman did all sorts of things to convince the country Wall Street was driving inflation. Harris got side tracked on that with laughing at cat eaters. She ended up losing to a guy that is crazy and unhinged. But inflation means tariff wars and mass deportations are pretty bad ideas. So what does Trump do? Hopefully mass deportations. But we won't be that lucky. I saw Biden administartion started a little fight with China over tariffs on some things. Nice, give that war a little kick. 1 minute ago, Biden is Mentally Fit said: The side that you prefer just went whole hog on hitler/nazis/fascists/weird/couch banging/end of democracy. Why even entertain the idea? And, that was the high road, wasn't it? The cat eating, weird Trump rallies where he just dances, calling Dems Marxist, Communists, whatever. Ya, Dems are just expected to be the nice guys.
The Frankish Reich Posted December 3 Posted December 3 1 minute ago, Biden is Mentally Fit said: The side that you prefer just went whole hog on hitler/nazis/fascists/weird/couch banging/end of democracy. Why even entertain the idea? Find where I have posted a "soft on crime" or "soft on illegal immigration" item. Yes, I preferred the Democrat to win the presidency, but that has nothing to do with Biden's response to illegal immigration. I am not a single-issue voter. And unlike you, I do not conform my political opinions to whatever Donald John Trump happens to like/dislike this particular morning. 3 minutes ago, Tiberius said: You have to motivate voters. GOP can do that by saying immigrants are eating cats. Dems can't do that. If there was one lesson from this election it was that voters hate inflation. That was the issue, but how do you campaign on that? Harris tried doing what Truman did in 1948, blames Wall Street and corportations, but there was no there there. Truman did all sorts of things to convince the country Wall Street was driving inflation. Harris got side tracked on that with laughing at cat eaters. She ended up losing to a guy that is crazy and unhinged. But inflation means tariff wars and mass deportations are pretty bad ideas. So what does Trump do? Hopefully mass deportations. But we won't be that lucky. I saw Biden administartion started a little fight with China over tariffs on some things. Nice, give that war a little kick. And, that was the high road, wasn't it? The cat eating, weird Trump rallies where he just dances, calling Dems Marxist, Communists, whatever. Ya, Dems are just expected to be the nice guys. Funny how quickly the cat eating craze ended. You would think the Haitian community would still be scouring the alleys of Springfield looking for their favorite delicacy.
Biden is Mentally Fit Posted December 3 Posted December 3 Just now, The Frankish Reich said: Find where I have posted a "soft on crime" or "soft on illegal immigration" item. Yes, I preferred the Democrat to win the presidency, but that has nothing to do with Biden's response to illegal immigration. I am not a single-issue voter. And unlike you, I do not conform my political opinions to whatever Donald John Trump happens to like/dislike this particular morning. Find where I have posted a political opinion that conforms to what the bad orange woke up thinking about. Don’t spend too much time looking as we both know your comment is idiotic. Your response is also a bit defensive isn’t it? My comment is in regard to your naïveté, not your immigration thoughts. 9 minutes ago, Tiberius said: You have to motivate voters. GOP can do that by saying immigrants are eating cats. Dems can't do that. If there was one lesson from this election it was that voters hate inflation. That was the issue, but how do you campaign on that? Harris tried doing what Truman did in 1948, blames Wall Street and corportations, but there was no there there. Truman did all sorts of things to convince the country Wall Street was driving inflation. Harris got side tracked on that with laughing at cat eaters. She ended up losing to a guy that is crazy and unhinged. But inflation means tariff wars and mass deportations are pretty bad ideas. So what does Trump do? Hopefully mass deportations. But we won't be that lucky. I saw Biden administartion started a little fight with China over tariffs on some things. Nice, give that war a little kick. And, that was the high road, wasn't it? The cat eating, weird Trump rallies where he just dances, calling Dems Marxist, Communists, whatever. Ya, Dems are just expected to be the nice guys. Your side sh*t the bed. Bigly. And here I was starting to buy into your analysis that it was all about abortion and that Florida was in play. Turns out you got EVERYTHING wrong. Oh well.
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 6 minutes ago, Biden is Mentally Fit said: Your side sh*t the bed. Bigly. And here I was starting to buy into your analysis that it was all about abortion and that Florida was in play. Turns out you got EVERYTHING wrong. Oh well. Your side has lost before, right? So what? I still think your a dumb person. Pretty sure I'm right about that. But you do post a lot more than most people. Still, that doesn't make you right about anything. Do you understand that?
Biden is Mentally Fit Posted December 3 Posted December 3 12 minutes ago, Tiberius said: I still think your a dumb person. Always a fun thing when this happens.
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 3 Posted December 3 34 minutes ago, Tiberius said: Well thank goodness no one has "fixed" the "problem" at the border. Our economy is way better because of it. So my question is, fix what problem? The USA is made of immigrants, so exactly what problem do you want to fix? What is your big problem with immigrants? How are they hurting you? Maybe you are just easily manipulated into believing they are hurting you? If all he is going to do is free criminals from our prisons to send them to freedom in their home country, its kind of stupid. Plus, we pay for their trip home, right? The problem is multi-faceted: It starts with a process that encourages individuals seeking a better way of life to risk their lives on a dangerous journey, where murder, assault, rape, death and victimization is common place. It seems clear to me that you don't care about those people, or perhaps you're comfortable with the price they pay so you can get cheaper Cheese Doodles at your local Walmart; It extends to this side of the border where a significant number people continue to be victimized, trafficked, and manipulated, though it apparently is acceptable to you because you save an extra 50 cents on the frozen pizza you get at the local Dollar General; It extends further to people in this country--some here legally, some not, and many citizens victimized by crime, though their suffering does allow you as a privileged American to get your fruit at a 10% discount; It goes further still with benefits funded with taxpayer money at the expense of other necessary and important social programs, but you make pretty good scratch so f*** everyone else, right Tibsy? It rewards business and individuals exploiting the system by paying people under the table, defrauding the taxpayer further, but I get that you like it's good for you and the price of peppers and onions; It seems to me that in the chaos of illegal immigration, we subsidize people/countries that don't have our best interest at heart. That's a bad idea. The US is indeed a country of immigrants, and a clean, neat, safe an orderly process should be our collective goal. I don't know why it isn't. That doesn't seem to be something you're interested in, but I understand you gotta take care of you first. You're the problem, Tibsy, not the solution.
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 3 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: The problem is multi-faceted: It starts with a process that encourages individuals seeking a better way of life to risk their lives on a dangerous journey, where murder, assault, rape, death and victimization is common place. It seems clear to me that you don't care about those people, or perhaps you're comfortable with the price they pay so you can get cheaper Cheese Doodles at your local Walmart; Let's take this one at a time: Mass deportation will hurt people, too. So your sanctimony is all crap. You want to hurt people to help others? Yup, sending people to the Venezulaian dictatorship will sure help people. What garbage Go sell that crap to people that read Redstate.com 8 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: The problem is multi-faceted: It extends to this side of the border where a significant number people continue to be victimized, trafficked, and manipulated, though it apparently is acceptable to you because you save an extra 50 cents on the frozen pizza you get at the local Dollar General; Good, let's help those people. Trump's rhetoric that these people are rapist and murderers sure makes exploiting them a lot easier. But again, your sanctimony is funny, because its so fake.
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 11 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: It extends further to people in this country--some here legally, some not, and many citizens victimized by crime, though their suffering does allow you as a privileged American to get your fruit at a 10% discount; Human's commit crime you moron. You are basically arguing to get rid of humans to end crime. Just F'n brilliant! Why didn't anyone think of this? Who commits crime? People do! 13 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: It goes further still with benefits funded with taxpayer money at the expense of other necessary and important social programs, but you make pretty good scratch so f*** everyone else, right Tibsy? Oh, but now the money IS important! I see. So tax payers supposedly having to pay more bad, but consumers paying less, not good. Do you understand meaning of consistency? But wait! Do immigrants pay taxes? It's almost like you don't understand anything about what you are rambling on about? Strange Ignorance
Tiberius Posted December 3 Author Posted December 3 18 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: It rewards business and individuals exploiting the system by paying people under the table, defrauding the taxpayer further, but I get that you like it's good for you and the price of peppers and onions; It's tough being pro-business. So you are pro-inflation, right? Or at least you are willing to pay more if you can get this people rounded up and shipped some place else? <----- This is what you are arguing. Right? 21 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: It seems to me that in the chaos of illegal immigration, we subsidize people/countries that don't have our best interest at heart. That's a bad idea. Huh? Explain 21 minutes ago, leh-nerd skin-erd said: The US is indeed a country of immigrants, and a clean, neat, safe an orderly process should be our collective goal. I don't know why it isn't. That doesn't seem to be something you're interested in, but I understand you gotta take care of you first. You're the problem, Tibsy, not the solution. Ya, because a mass deportation would sure be a neat, clean and orderly process, I guess that's why Trump wants to use the American military domestically, because it will all be fun and games
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 4 Posted December 4 (edited) 3 hours ago, Tiberius said: Let's take this one at a time: Mass deportation will hurt people, too. So your sanctimony is all crap. You want to hurt people to help others? Yup, sending people to the Venezulaian dictatorship will sure help people. What garbage Go sell that crap to people that read Redstate.com Good, let's help those people. Trump's rhetoric that these people are rapist and murderers sure makes exploiting them a lot easier. But again, your sanctimony is funny, because its so fake. But when taking things one at a time, shouldn’t you start at your beginning? What you wrote, the singular most important thing to you, according to you: Well thank goodness no one has "fixed" the "problem" at the border. Our economy is way better because of it. In the big picture, you’re not about the lives of illegal/legal immigrants, it’s about you and your double-quarter-pounder with cheese, two large fries and your large chocolate shake for as cheap as you can get it. There’s a better way, Tibs, but you have to see beyond the paper plate loaded with food in front of you, and the new android you feel you need so desperately. You don’t need it. Now that we’ve addressed that, yes, deportation is going to cause strain and angst. Many things in life do, and wanting everyone to have a safe place to land so the 4th 45” television you purchased is cheap cheap. Edited December 4 by leh-nerd skin-erd
leh-nerd skin-erd Posted December 4 Posted December 4 2 hours ago, Tiberius said: It's tough being pro-business. So you are pro-inflation, right? Or at least you are willing to pay more if you can get this people rounded up and shipped some place else? <----- This is what you are arguing. I am willing to pay more for items, yes, if our current system of anarchy, strife, loss and pain is replaced by an orderly process that deals with legal immigration. I’m still surprised, frankly, that this position bothers you. You must really be bad with budgeting. 2 hours ago, Tiberius said: Right? Huh? Explain Ya, because a mass deportation would sure be a neat, clean and orderly process, I guess that's why Trump wants to use the American military domestically, because it will all be fun and games No, it’s sad and tragic for so many people. Trump is dealing with a problem decades in the making, and the only reason the phrase “mass deportation” arises is because of the anarchy and chaos at the border. Solve the problem and the problem will be solved. Again, you’re part of the problem with your consumerism and constant need for cheaper goods.
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