KRC Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Flag amendment and marriage amendment. 366639[/snapback] Flag - Yes, Marriage - No. I do not see this as an avenue into the Marriage amendment. Of course, what the Dems are doing with all of their "outrage" is drawing more attention to what Rove said. Couple that with the RNC press release detailing the actual words of leading Democrats after 9/11, and the public is now able to see for themselves. That alone is enough to hurt them. The best thing the Dems can do is to leave it alone. The more attention they bring to this, the more it will hurt them. Reeling in the fish. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghost of BiB Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 I thought the Right already had the answer: They hate our Freedom. 366580[/snapback] Which doesn't have a thing to do with it, but it sounded good, and they don't know any better anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Albany,n.y. Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Anyone calling for an apology, resignation etc is just another political hack/hypocrite. Seems like every day a Democrat wants a Republican to apologize& resign or a Republican wants a Democrat to apologize&resign. We might be better off if all the politicians apologize for wasting our time and then resign. This is a good column that appears in today's Newsday. http://www.newsday.com/news/columnists/ny-...news-columnists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reuben Gant Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Anyone calling for an apology, resignation etc is just another political hack/hypocrite. Seems like every day a Democrat wants a Republican to apologize& resign or a Republican wants a Democrat to apologize&resign. We might be better off if all the politicians apologize for wasting our time and then resign. This is a good column that appears in today's Newsday. http://www.newsday.com/news/columnists/ny-...news-columnists 366710[/snapback] From the article: Do you smell "apology fatigue?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnny Coli Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Flag - Yes, Marriage - No. I do not see this as an avenue into the Marriage amendment. 366653[/snapback] Would it be safe to say the people most vocally FOR a flag burning amendment are also most likely FOR a marriage amendment? The best way to get something to pass that has only a marginal chance is to get it on the same ballot with something that has a better chance of passing, and a better chance of getting people of the same mindset to the polls. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alaska Darin Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Anyone calling for an apology, resignation etc is just another political hack/hypocrite. Seems like every day a Democrat wants a Republican to apologize& resign or a Republican wants a Democrat to apologize&resign. We might be better off if all the politicians apologize for wasting our time and then resign. This is a good column that appears in today's Newsday. http://www.newsday.com/news/columnists/ny-...news-columnists 366710[/snapback] Nice post, Harv. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Crap Throwing Monkey Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Would it be safe to say the people most vocally FOR a flag burning amendment are also most likely FOR a marriage amendment? The best way to get something to pass that has only a marginal chance is to get it on the same ballot with something that has a better chance of passing, and a better chance of getting people of the same mindset to the polls. 366792[/snapback] It's possible...but that's a REAL stretch without supporting data. Before I were to accept that as anything more than a "Well, hypothetically...", I'd want to see supporting data. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EC-Bills Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Soon, he will be in the same league as Dean. He just needs to make these comments on a regular basis. 366461[/snapback] Everyone has got to have goals, especially in the politics game Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bobblehead Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 The Dems are obviously doing it out of desparation. I suspect that Rove has something up his sleeve. I heard one opinion yesterday that this was done to specifically lure the Dems to hang themselves. They are taking the bait easily. It is part of the whole patriotic, support the troops, support the best interests of America stuff that the Reps have been blasting the Dems with for years. This could all be part of legislation that will be hitting the floor soon. The tactic of "do you actually support this country, the troops and are patriotic or was Rove correct in his assessment of you?" The RNC had a press release immediately ready, which tells me that this was part of a larger scheme. Time will tell. 366632[/snapback] Well, that makes sense in a way, considering how calculating Rove is with everything. But, when you say this could be due to impending legislation, One could answer back to you that this was desparation by the GOP because of the failures they have experienced lately (social security, the filibuster compromise), they are getting nervous about their ability to wield political power in the future? Perhaps it was a calculated strategy based on the desparation of recent failure? I know, I make no sense, wait, my Ipod is beeping, why? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 One last time - Howard Dean doesn't have right to say ANYTHING because he says things as stupid as what Rove said on a nearly daily basis. 366597[/snapback] Sure he does. He can look at Rove and call him out on his stupidity, just like Republicans can call the Dems and Dean out on his stupidity. Its called politics, and my point was that both sides do it and have hte right to do it (as dispicable as it is, although highly entertaining) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 By pointing out that Rove was correct in that is was the Left that spent most of their time raising the issue, whether valid or not, you got all that other crap? 366575[/snapback] Yeah, I was drunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chilly Posted June 24, 2005 Author Share Posted June 24, 2005 The Dems are obviously doing it out of desparation. I suspect that Rove has something up his sleeve. I heard one opinion yesterday that this was done to specifically lure the Dems to hang themselves. They are taking the bait easily. It is part of the whole patriotic, support the troops, support the best interests of America stuff that the Reps have been blasting the Dems with for years. This could all be part of legislation that will be hitting the floor soon. The tactic of "do you actually support this country, the troops and are patriotic or was Rove correct in his assessment of you?" The RNC had a press release immediately ready, which tells me that this was part of a larger scheme. Time will tell. 366632[/snapback] The Republicans still very much have a minority party mentality in the US. An "us against them" mentality in which they are still trying to attract the voters, still trying get people to change sides, and are still working on organization to drive out voters and get them elected. I think the Democrats are finally starting to transition to this type of a mindset. The Democrats are obviously in a reorganizing status right now. Howard Dean has led this charge. If you listen to the speech at the "Stronger Together" conference (I believe was the title of it) a couple weeks ago when the fire really got started around his comments, what he talked about a lot was getting a grass roots campaign going. This is something the Democrats have not used previously. They've relied on sort of the majority mindset if "Elect us because we're the Democrats and we're the in party right now" kind of mentality. I think that was particularly evident in the 2004 election of Kerry vs Bush. (although the beat Bush group mentality where the Dems were starting to come together was the early makings of this). Its not working though because they are no longer the majority. They need their core members to get fired up around a cause, and to focus even more on electability and a general cause. In order to do this, they need to fire up the Democratic base, raise money, and get their base around a goal of "us vs them". More of a minority party mindset, where once they've got their coalition fired up and on board, they're more agressive in recruiting new people and broadening their appeal. From what I've seen, I think Dean is trying to do this by first firing up the base, getting fundraising contributions (there is actually proof that to the date, this election cycle is starting off better then the last election cycle for fundraising), and then becoming more moderate to win more voters away after the off-year elections. I think Dean's comments, and the fact that Durbin was at the Democratic fundraiser before he apologized both point to this. The fact that not ALL Democrats are supporting Dean is largely due, I believe, to not wanting to alienate the Weak/Leaning Democrats. I think Karl Rove is smart enough to realize that the Republicans need to keep the "Us vs them" minority party mentality and not let it slip into a majority party mentality and majority party organization. I think Karl Rove's comment really served two purposes: 1.) To serve as a message to the Democrats saying that the Republicans aren't going to let the Democrats steal this from them 2.) To show the Republicans that its still a huge fight and something that needs to continue to be fought in that way. If these scenarios play out, we're looking at just as tight or even tight elections in the coming future, until one party really screws up and the other takes solid, majority control. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brihs2005 Posted June 24, 2005 Share Posted June 24, 2005 Haven't read this whole thread, but is it just me that the Right seems to not care that they are alienating half of the country and that the left seems to be saying "Look how mean they are, they hit us first" I mean honestly if i was the leader of either party i would be going buggy over the stupid comments that advisors, senators, and representatives say that make my side (depending on which one you are on) look like jackasses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KRC Posted June 26, 2005 Share Posted June 26, 2005 Would it be safe to say the people most vocally FOR a flag burning amendment are also most likely FOR a marriage amendment? The best way to get something to pass that has only a marginal chance is to get it on the same ballot with something that has a better chance of passing, and a better chance of getting people of the same mindset to the polls. 366792[/snapback] I would agree with you if we were not discussing Consitutional Amendments. You are not doing to get two distinctly different pieces of legislation through in one Constitutional Amendment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Adam Posted July 2, 2005 Share Posted July 2, 2005 I thought the Right already had the answer: They hate our Freedom. 366580[/snapback] what do you mean OUR! lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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