Kincaid update? (now declared OUT for Sunday)

[warrior9]

53 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

In what area?  In blocking, Knox is night and day more consistent than Kincaid.

 

In terms of target vs reception, Knox has caught 10 of his 16 targets (62.5%), while Kincaid has caught 34 of his 59 targets (58%).

 

Just say you don't like Kincaid man. 

 

Is it his fault Josh over threw him in Indy? You mad about that or something? 

Do you want to see more Knox? That's fine but don't forget the significant drops he has had in his career. 

 

Have you forgot that teams game plan to take the middle of the field away with Kincaid? Should I keep going? 

[PoundingDog]

Kincaid is arguably the biggest disappointment for the Bills. You can argue opponents paying more attention to him but we all kind of expected that he will have a game or two he dominates by now. Heck Rookie Keon had sort of a dominating game. Looks to me his skillset remains with smooth route running, plus catching ability kind of physical part. The mental part, the instinct to finding open spot, not running into coverage is not really there, at least not shown now. Also he's still a below average blocker. 

[DaVinci]

Back up TE be ready if Knox gets more targets, He seems to get injured often. 

Edited November 12 by DaVinci

[BillsFan130]

7 minutes ago, warrior9 said:

Just say you don't like Kincaid man. 

 

Is it his fault Josh over threw him in Indy? You mad about that or something? 

Do you want to see more Knox? That's fine but don't forget the significant drops he has had in his career. 

 

Have you forgot that teams game plan to take the middle of the field away with Kincaid? Should I keep going? 

Yep. Drops, penalties, clumsiness, the list goes on.

Kincaid is by far a better receiving tight end than Knox and it's not even close 

[SoMAn]

FWIW, in the ‘big dub’ post-game, walking through tunnel to locker room vid that the media dept puts out, Kincaid was walking alongside Knox, and I didn’t notice any hint of a limp or discomfort. 
Whether the injury is minor enough that it wouldn’t effect typical activity, but not for the demands of playing TE remains to be seen. 

Edited November 12 by SoMAn

[PoundingDog]

They have Morris. I expect they to elevate Zach Davidson, the 6'7" dude who has surprising hands in training camp. Not much a blocker, but can be a viable red zone target

[Back2Buff]

17 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said:

Here's the problem with stats:  Kincaid of course draws tougher assignments and the defence keys in on him- I'm sure you would Agree to acknowledge that.

And 16 targets compared to 59. If Knox had 59 targets, his efficiency of course will go down.

 

Is Knox a better blocker? Yes. Is he a better route runner with better hands? Not even close

 

You are missing a major point in this discussion, if Kincaid is off the field, a WR will get more targets.  I think the Bills offense is better when the one TE on field can both block and catch a few balls.  Kincaid is so one dimensional that you are better off playing a WR instead of a one-dimensional TE.  That is just my opinion, and the way I like to see football played.  I think the Bills best offenses was with 3 WR, 1 RB and 1 TE on field.  Knox was able to contribute more in the passing game, because the WR now in the slot was creating much more space than Kincaid is.

 

In an entirely healthy lineup, I would rather see Cook, Cooper, Shakir, Knox, Coleman than Cook, Cooper, Coleman, Knox and Kincaid.   I think removing Knox for a WR, you lose the ability to be able to disguise the run.  I love our offense in play action and RPO.  Can't stand the shot gun sit back, with just 4 receiving targets running wherever.  

[The Firebaugh Kid]

Dalton commands a lot of attention. So does Cooper. I think once they are both finally on the field consistently with the other complementary pieces in place you will see more production from Dalton. I will admit that so far I’m pretty disappointed in his production this season. 

[BillsFan130]

2 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

You are missing a major point in this discussion, if Kincaid is off the field, a WR will get more targets.  I think the Bills offense is better when the one TE on field can both block and catch a few balls.  Kincaid is so one dimensional that you are better off playing a WR instead of a one-dimensional TE.  That is just my opinion, and the way I like to see football played.  I think the Bills best offenses was with 3 WR, 1 RB and 1 TE on field.  Knox was able to contribute more in the passing game, because the WR now in the slot was creating much more space than Kincaid is.

 

In an entirely healthy lineup, I would rather see Cook, Cooper, Shakir, Knox, Coleman than Cook, Cooper, Coleman, Knox and Kincaid.   I think removing Knox for a WR, you lose the ability to be able to disguise the run.  I love our offense in play action and RPO.  Can't stand the shot gun sit back, with just 4 receiving targets running wherever.  

Ahh ok I see what you're saying. And you do bring up some good points cause I myself do like the Bills a lot better in 11 personnel to your point.

 

Which is why I was a bit confused when they did draft Kincaid, as Josh seems to be at his best in more 11 personnel/spread

 

[RiotAct]

9 minutes ago, The Firebaugh Kid said:

Dalton commands a lot of attention. So does Cooper. I think once they are both finally on the field consistently with the other complementary pieces in place you will see more production from Dalton. 

so never?

 

 

[Back2Buff]

11 minutes ago, BillsFan130 said:

Ahh ok I see what you're saying. And you do bring up some good points cause I myself do like the Bills a lot better in 11 personnel to your point.

 

Which is why I was a bit confused when they did draft Kincaid, as Josh seems to be at his best in more 11 personnel/spread

 

 

JNS, Flowers, and Addison getting to 20-23 and not trading up, then going up for Kincaid at 25 was devasting to me.  We had a well rounded TE already, we needed another receiving threat and I would always lean towards an actual WR vs a TE playing a receiver.  

[The Jokeman]

50 minutes ago, PoundingDog said:

Kincaid is arguably the biggest disappointment for the Bills. You can argue opponents paying more attention to him but we all kind of expected that he will have a game or two he dominates by now. Heck Rookie Keon had sort of a dominating game. Looks to me his skillset remains with smooth route running, plus catching ability kind of physical part. The mental part, the instinct to finding open spot, not running into coverage is not really there, at least not shown now. Also he's still a below average blocker. 

He's tied for 3rd amongst TEs for TDs. He's within 3 yards of being top 12 for yards. Maybe a sophomore slump but I'm more disappointed in Ed Oliver if I'm being honest.

[Dillenger4]

Kincaid is awesome and I can't imagine any Bills fan not seeing the absolute value, talent and all around stud that Dalton is. He catches tough passes similar to a WR. I bet if we didn't run the ball as much as we do he would be our #1 receiver".

He commands attention from every Defense that we play. His blocking is very good. And to compare Knox to Kincaid is funny. Downright not even close. Kincaid is a top 4 TE in the NFL.

[NewEra]

25 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

JNS, Flowers, and Addison getting to 20-23 and not trading up, then going up for Kincaid at 25 was devasting to me.  We had a well rounded TE already, we needed another receiving threat and I would always lean towards an actual WR vs a TE playing a receiver.  

 Now it makes sense

[JGMcD2]

2 minutes ago, NewEra said:

 Now it makes sense

[Ethan in Cleveland]

Nobody wants to say it but LaPorta is better and Beane could have drafted him without trading up wasting a 4th round pick.

 

LaPorta has 14.6 YPC this year. 

 

But, we also don't know how much of this is Brady vs Kincaid. So far he seems to be running too many five yard out patterns instead of challenging the mid to deep parts of the field. Is this because we have no deep speed at WR? 

 

 

[PoundingDog]

Ed Oliver is who he is. I don't expect any late surge for his level because he relies heavily on his get-offs. That is not something improves when you age.

 

Maybe we are all had too much hope for Kincaid. He's an older guy (25 already) coming out of college. 25 - 28 are generally the peak of peak of players development. ESPN, PFF all kind of had him at around top 5 in TE before the season. 10 games in, he's kind of middle of the road on passing stats. Certainly not bad. But not the kind of lead dog I think OBD had hoped for.  

[LABILLBACKER]

4 hours ago, Back2Buff said:

 

The team is better with just Knox in lineup.  Knox can actually block, and is able to catch the 3 balls that Kincaid catches.

Unfortunately that's a true statement. Was really expecting a more breakout 2nd season from 86?  Everything from our receiving Corp seems so disjointed this year.

[dave mcbride]

59 minutes ago, Back2Buff said:

 

JNS, Flowers, and Addison getting to 20-23 and not trading up, then going up for Kincaid at 25 was devasting to me.  We had a well rounded TE already, we needed another receiving threat and I would always lean towards an actual WR vs a TE playing a receiver.  

Kincaid is an excellent receiver who excels at getting open and then becoming elusive once he has the ball. He has very good hands too. His stats aren't a good measure of his talent, and it's still early days anyway.  

25 minutes ago, PoundingDog said:

Ed Oliver is who he is. I don't expect any late surge for his level because he relies heavily on his get-offs. That is not something improves when you age.

 

Maybe we are all had too much hope for Kincaid. He's an older guy (25 already) coming out of college. 25 - 28 are generally the peak of peak of players development. ESPN, PFF all kind of had him at around top 5 in TE before the season. 10 games in, he's kind of middle of the road on passing stats. Certainly not bad. But not the kind of lead dog I think OBD had hoped for.  

The counting stats are a function of the Bills system, not him.

[Dablitzkrieg]

Wait, there are actual people that don't like Kincaid?  That's amazing