Our screen game is puzzling

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

We seem to be excellent at WR screens and horrendous at RB screens. 
 

I was glad we at least tried a few RB screens today, but they were comically bad. Yet our WR screens seem to work about 90% of the time.  
 

what gives? It makes no sense.

[Big Turk]

Allen doesn't seem to allow the rush to come to him long enough...

 

He seems to hurry the throws before the D is far enough sucked in.

 

The OLine is also terrible at selling it because a lot of times the entire D is waiting around the RB for the screen to come.

[Low Positive]

Can't we just be happy that we are suddenly good at WR screens?

[BillsFan130]

I don't think the bills have ran a successful RB screen since the Chan Gailey days

[MasterStrategist]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

Allen doesn't seem to allow the rush to come to him long enough...

 

He seems to hurry the throws before the D is far enough sucked in.

 

The OLine is also terrible at selling it because a lot of times the entire D is waiting around the RB for the screen to come.

This is it 💯

 

Starts with OL and they don't sell worth a damn.  Need a quick hand flash and shove, then let the rusher go and get in front of RB.  

 

Josh seems to stare it down. and also throw a split second early.

 

Screen games take alot of work, glad we're trying but this is why we never see the RB screens in most games.

 

[Estro]

1 minute ago, Big Turk said:

Allen doesn't seem to allow the rush to come to him long enough...

 

He seems to hurry the throws before the D is far enough sucked in.

 

The OLine is also terrible at selling it because a lot of times the entire D is waiting around the RB for the screen to come.

Spot on.  Allen is so quick to want to move off his spot to any pressure or even perceived pressure...... That it seems to make the screen game very difficult. Like you said you need to invite the rush toward you, accept the rush patiently then deliver the throw. Too often Allen rushes off his spot which creates a very disjointed, difficult pass to get the screen started.

 

I've heard Greg Cosell talking a lot about the Bills disjointed passing game and Allen's too often abandoning clean pockets......and I thought today was a glaring example of both. The wins are all that matters, but there's a slice of me that is growing concerned with this passing offense. Can you win 3-4 straight in the playoffs with this offense? Not sure

[Buffalo_Stampede]

I would think screens to the rb might be more difficult since there is someone always spying Allen. I don’t think I would run them.

[eSJayDee]

They're pretty much different plays.  The WR screen, you're trying to get the ball out to the WR as fast as possible, figuring the Dline is pretty much out of the play as they can't get out there fast enough, at least not fast enough to stop the play b4 it starts.  THe OLine then pretty much gets out in front & takes on the 2nd & (hopefully) 3rd levels.

On a conventional RB screen, it's slow developing & you've gotta get the DLine to commit upfield to take themselves out of the play.  For whatever reason, we're not able to adequately develop these slow "setup" plays.

[Boatdrinks]

47 minutes ago, Estro said:

Spot on.  Allen is so quick to want to move off his spot to any pressure or even perceived pressure...... That it seems to make the screen game very difficult. Like you said you need to invite the rush toward you, accept the rush patiently then deliver the throw. Too often Allen rushes off his spot which creates a very disjointed, difficult pass to get the screen started.

 

I've heard Greg Cosell talking a lot about the Bills disjointed passing game and Allen's too often abandoning clean pockets......and I thought today was a glaring example of both. The wins are all that matters, but there's a slice of me that is growing concerned with this passing offense. Can you win 3-4 straight in the playoffs with this offense? Not sure

Depends on if we get Coleman back relatively soon and Cooper gets enough games under his belt to develop chemistry with Allen. There’s still time, but every missed game lessens the chances of being a crisp passing offense come playoff time. 

[fridge]

Screens work best when defenses are committing to the pass rush. Historically, it was a bad idea to blitz Josh, so they haven't been a big part of our game. On top of that, teams used to spy Allen a lot more, which was another deterrent to the halfback screen pass. I wouldn't be surprised if this gets slowly incorporated more and more as Allen gets older and becomes less of a threat to take off.

[somnus00]

Josh's running ability limits our screen game success. Defense's eyes are in the back field. 

[947]

There was a screen attempt to Cook today that went through his hands. Watching live, it looked like there was some room to run. They never showed a replay, so I guess we'll never know.

[Miyagi-Do Karate]

If the defensive “spy” and Josh’s mobility is a problem for the RB screens, then why are the chiefs/Mahomes and ravens/jackson able to run RB screens pretty well?  

[Buffalo716]

13 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

If the defensive “spy” and Josh’s mobility is a problem for the RB screens, then why are the chiefs/Mahomes and ravens/jackson able to run RB screens pretty well?  

The line,  the backs and Josh don't do a good job selling the screen game 

 

The offensive line and the backs need to sell it better and so does Josh 

 

There's a little more room for those outside jailbreak screens and shakir works really good in tight space .. teams also contain the edge against Josh which could also make it more difficult 

 

What they could implement is more of a old school middle screen

[Simon]

Just now, Buffalo716 said:

What they could implement is more of a old school middle screen

 

You've got to spend a lot of time practicing that to get the timing right.

I'm not sure the Bills coaches are willing to do that for a design they are not convinced will work.

 

[Dablitzkrieg]

24 minutes ago, Miyagi-Do Karate said:

If the defensive “spy” and Josh’s mobility is a problem for the RB screens, then why are the chiefs/Mahomes and ravens/jackson able to run RB screens pretty well?  

Because they are better teams with better coaching

[gonzo1105]

They are good at WR and RB swing screens. The traditional screens not so much 

[Bookie Man]

They always look out of rhythm when they try to run them. It's sort of unbelievable that they aren't able to figure this out at a professional level. It honestly could open up the offense immensely if they can ever learn how to execute them. 

[Special K]

2 hours ago, BillsFan130 said:

I don't think the bills have ran a successful RB screen since the Chan Gailey days

 

CJ Spiller would run a successful screen, then be out the next 4 plays because he was "winded", according to Gailey🤣

 

"Winded" is always the first word that comes to mind when I think of Spiller.

[JohnNord]

3 hours ago, Big Turk said:

Allen doesn't seem to allow the rush to come to him long enough...

 

He seems to hurry the throws before the D is far enough sucked in.

 

The OLine is also terrible at selling it because a lot of times the entire D is waiting around the RB for the screen to come.

THIS.  I just don’t think Josh is comfortable throwing screens.  Either he doesn’t like to or he’s just not good at it.  Between 3 OC’s the RB screen has rarely been used in the offense