Bills are 8-2 for the first time in over 30 years

[Buffalo716]

18 minutes ago, Thrivefourfive said:

It’s not happening with this coach and with these coordinators. I don’t feel like we have an advantage over any of the contenders, on the sidelines. None of them. We may have some talent and a great QB, but nowhere near enough talent to overcome the coaching.

 

This is why we lose. Always outmatched by the coaches. Reid and Spags vs McDermott and some inexperienced chump scapegoat coordinators that should be picking the bones of average or below organizations. That’s where the good ones figure it out, make a name, and become future leaders. McDermott has been pampered all his assistant coaching career, with superior staffs and talent. I don’t like his process for hiring coordinators.
 

Imagine a Super Bowl (won’t ever happen) where McDermott/Babich/Brady vs Campbell/Johnson/Glenn. The Lions have accomplished more than the Bills have.. they had SF in the NFCCG and didn’t finish them off. The Bills never had a shot vs KC back in 2020 in their only championship game appearance. 

Spagnola is not some super defensive genius 

 

He's had plenty of defenses that struggle.. he has great pieces all over his defense.. when they didn't have those pieces they're not that electric

 

He's literally no different than Leslie Frazier... They run different schemes but they're success is basically the same.. when they have talent their defense is good when they don't have the talent they can struggle 

 

In fact when I went to Kansas City for the bills chief game couple years ago..  this just shows you how every fan base is alike 

 

Nobody and I mean nobody over there liked spagnola.. every single person said I wish we could trade Leslie Frazier for him 

 

Now fan appeal doesn't mean much... But the point stands that their own fans did not like him.. they didn't like the defense he ran and they didn't like his play calling

 

Yet this board, think we don't beat the Chiefs because they have guys like spagnola , yet he's not belichick or parcells

 

He has Chris Jones who is a Hall of Fame game wrecker that most teams can't block , with other good defensive lineman and linebackers and players 

 

Spagnola was literally one of the most inept head coaches of all time, he has a great team and a great organization.. he's not that special

[hondo in seattle]

4 hours ago, GETTOTHE50 said:

whatever floats your boat son.

 

and no thanks for your service

 

I served my country because I believe in American values including the freedom of speech.  I'm okay with Rich Eisen predicting the Bills would finish third.  And I'm okay with you saying, "no thanks for your service."  

 

And I still thank you for posting a segment of The Rich Eisen show where they were all so very wrong in their predictions.  It was amusing to watch.  

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

5 hours ago, Thrivefourfive said:

It’s not happening with this coach and with these coordinators. I don’t feel like we have an advantage over any of the contenders, on the sidelines. None of them. We may have some talent and a great QB, but nowhere near enough talent to overcome the coaching.

 

This is why we lose. Always outmatched by the coaches. Reid and Spags vs McDermott and some inexperienced chump scapegoat coordinators that should be picking the bones of average or below organizations. That’s where the good ones figure it out, make a name, and become future leaders. McDermott has been pampered all his assistant coaching career, with superior staffs and talent. I don’t like his process for hiring coordinators.
 

Imagine a Super Bowl (won’t ever happen) where McDermott/Babich/Brady vs Campbell/Johnson/Glenn. The Lions have accomplished more than the Bills have.. they had SF in the NFCCG and didn’t finish them off. The Bills never had a shot vs KC back in 2020 in their only championship game appearance. 

 Lol the lions genius coaching staff got absolutely freakin embarrassed by the niners in that second half…they got outscored 27-7 with the 1 td being essentially in garbage time.  ‘Had them’ isn’t down 10 and needing a td and an onside kick with a minute to go in the game 😂 

 

honestly cant believe people have forgiven Campbell for that game.  Up 14 you don’t take the fg and turn it over on downs?  Then down 3 you don’t take the fg and turn it over on downs. Brilliant

 

Not to mention, the lions losing somewhat comfortably to a team not as good as the chiefs means a lot but the bills taking the actual chiefs right down the wire multiple times doesn’t?  A bit of a logical flaw there lol 

 

Edited November 12 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[DrPJax]

On 11/10/2024 at 4:56 PM, JimBob2232 said:

 

Really depends on injuries and WRs.  If Cooper is solid, and Coleman continues to grow, Milano comes back at 80+%, and we get consistent play from Rapp and Hamlin, I think we have a shot.  Thats a lot of *IFs*, but no reason to think we cant beat anyone on any given Sunday

     I think you and a couple other posters are spot on! .  There are just certain things  that can’t be ignored. 
 

      The chiefs are arguably better than us at every key area ; 1 ) Reid has proven at this point to be a better HC than Sean in the playoffs and also is probably a better oc NOW than Brady. 2) spags is an innovative dc , and they have a superstar de / closer / playmaker in Chris jones compared to any player on the bills d. Our closer , Von , is way past his prime w injuries taking their toll. Jones has a history of dominating the bills come playoff time. Our one great chance was the 13 sec game to overcome that d and well, we will never forget how that ended. 3 ). I hate this but mahomes so far has proven to be the best qb related to Super Bowl results .  I like Allen better as a Buffalo guy, character guy , and  so far he has played really well in the playoffs , but he hasn’t had the playmaker support or the coaching staff has made just enough errors to neutralize his talent in the playoffs. He has left the field leading , only to end up going home with defensive collapses.   Other than that run ending in 13 sec , he has not lead the Bills to dominant leads( two scores or more) , and the o tends to go thru periods of hurting and stopping themselves with penalties etc or he is prone to ill timed turnovers ( like the Houston game) keeping games  within reach , and that sets them up for the d to fail late.  Say what you will , mahomes so far just has been a better closer of games in the playoffs. 4 ) They have a player in kelce who has been there and elevates his game come playoff time  , creating mismatches with linebackers. We just have not yet had anything comparable outside of Josh.   5) they have had dominant special teams play. Last year bass was a liability down the stretch.  He is looking good so far , but let’s see in the playoffs. I don’t think any of the above is hyperbole; home field advantage is huge for making a SB run, and so far the Chiefs have proven that. 
 

     So , while some argue the chiefs have been lucky or gotten sloppy wins , you can’t argue with being undefeated , and they have achieved  home field advantage almost every year.  I  think we could beat them and get to the SB THIS YEAR , but we have a more realistic chance if healthy for once , and can get that afc championship at home. Chiefs have the experience , history of success that breeds confidence , and they are so far just better come playoff time.  The Bills have enough talent , and Mcd has kept improving , so we should have  a realistic chance to make a run. .  We have a really tough schedule , but based on past results , you would have to prove to me they could actually remain healthy enough to get past that rough schedule to make a playoff run. Imo, Mcd is a perfect fit for the bills and he is the best chance regarding the HC POSITION to get a SB one time. I don’t see him being dominant like Reid has been, but he has the leadership qualities to get them there one time. He does have to overcome his losing playoff record, esp on the road and his teams seem to collapse under pressure as noted by his zero wins in overtime, yet  the players respect him and the chemistry is real. 
 

      They definitely could  do it this year as they are winning even ugly type games. They just have a narrower margin of error than the chiefs. Both teams are what their records show they are.  If they get and stay healthy , Allen can take over any game and if he gets hot, this could be the year. Many “ ifs “ as you stated,  but it’s possible as they gain confidence with each win. They have to be healthy tho , as they lack time together and need their best quality guys actually playing for a realistic shot.  Go Bills! 

[Buffalo716]

4 hours ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

I served my country because I believe in American values including the freedom of speech.  I'm okay with Rich Eisen predicting the Bills would finish third.  And I'm okay with you saying, "no thanks for your service."  

 

And I still thank you for posting a segment of The Rich Eisen show where they were all so very wrong in their predictions.  It was amusing to watch.  

Thank you for your service 

[Jauronimo]

On 11/10/2024 at 6:54 PM, Toyo321 said:

This team has to prove its metal over their next 4 games.  Enough said.  I will not pass any judgement on them until this 4 game gauntlet is over.  This is not the best team TBH that we can assemble for a SB run.  Next year is the year that I was banking on.  But we will see what happens in the next 5 weeks.

mettle

[hondo in seattle]

38 minutes ago, Buffalo716 said:

Thank you for your service 

 

After all these years, I still don't really know what to say to that.  No thanks are necessary but appreciated nonetheless.  

 

I give my thanks to all the guys who didn't come back alive and whole.  

[Buffalo716]

27 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

After all these years, I still don't really know what to say to that.  No thanks are necessary but appreciated nonetheless.  

 

I give my thanks to all the guys who didn't come back alive and whole.  

I don't think there's really much to say 

 

Every single person in the United States military today chose to serve

 

And for that millions of people across the country are eternally grateful 

 

So they didn't have to... And we can be chatting on this message board where we can all have different opinions 

 

I come from a military family and had family serve in the revolution and after.. there's nothing I respect more than the men and women who serve this country and the ones who paid the ultimate sacrifice

 

 

 

Edited November 12 by Buffalo716

[GoBills808]

59 minutes ago, Jauronimo said:

mettle

Thank you for your service

[GunnerBill]

16 hours ago, Ethan in Cleveland said:

I'd add Cook, Cooper, possibly Rousseau, and Bernard to your list. And that leaves off Shakir who can also make plays but is not an elite talent. 

 

I don't think any of those guys are elite difference makers. Good players, certainly. But they are a level or two in each case below that top level. We have two elite level players. Allen and Johnson.

[NewEra]

9 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Spagnola is not some super defensive genius 

 

He's had plenty of defenses that struggle.. he has great pieces all over his defense.. when they didn't have those pieces they're not that electric

 

He's literally no different than Leslie Frazier... They run different schemes but they're success is basically the same.. when they have talent their defense is good when they don't have the talent they can struggle 

 

In fact when I went to Kansas City for the bills chief game couple years ago..  this just shows you how every fan base is alike 

 

Nobody and I mean nobody over there liked spagnola.. every single person said I wish we could trade Leslie Frazier for him 

 

Now fan appeal doesn't mean much... But the point stands that their own fans did not like him.. they didn't like the defense he ran and they didn't like his play calling

 

Yet this board, think we don't beat the Chiefs because they have guys like spagnola , yet he's not belichick or parcells

 

He has Chris Jones who is a Hall of Fame game wrecker that most teams can't block , with other good defensive lineman and linebackers and players 

 

Spagnola was literally one of the most inept head coaches of all time, he has a great team and a great organization.. he's not that special

I think Spags’ situational play calling is superior to Frazier.  I don’t see how they are equals.

[Buffalo716]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

I think Spags’ situational play calling is superior to Frazier.  I don’t see how they are equals.

Just because the bills don't beat the Chiefs in the playoffs doesn't mean he's better 

 

Spagnolo in his career has 5 defenses in the top 10 for yards.. he has six top 10 defenses in points 

 

Frazier has eight defensive teams in the top 10 for yards.. 4 for points 

 

Frazier has seven teams top 10 in takeaways, spags 4

 

Neither were great head coaches but Leslie Frazier was a better head coach with more wins and less losses.. 

 

We scored 30 on spags defense twice.. they scored 30 on our defense twice... Our defense also held them them to 20 twice

 

Our defense is usually always banged up in the playoffs that's the problem.. and I know other teams are too but you can't consistently be without your best guys when it matters

 

Neither are considered elite defensive gurus in the mold of Bill belichick... They're in the echelon of can build a really good defense

 

And that's not a knock on spags who has his defense rolling... But he has years of defenses that without the pieces he doesn't look like a genius

 

When he has the pieces yeah he calls a good really aggressive defense.. but that aggression can come against you too

Edited November 12 by Buffalo716

[NewEra]

5 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Just because the bills don't beat the Chiefs in the playoffs doesn't mean he's better 

 

Spagnolo in his career has 5 defenses in the top 10 for yards.. he has six top 10 defenses in points 

 

Frazier has eight defensive teams in the top 10 for yards.. 4 for points 

 

Frazier has seven teams top 10 in takeaways, spags 4

 

Neither were great head coaches but Leslie Frazier was a better head coach with more wins and less losses.. 

 

We scored 30 on spags defense twice.. they scored 30 on our defense twice... Our defense also held them them to 20 twice

 

Our defense is usually always banged up in the playoffs that's the problem.. and I know other teams are too but you can't consistently be without your best guys when it matters

 

Neither are considered elite defensive gurus in the mold of Bill belichick... They're in the echelon of can build a really good defense

 

And that's not a knock on spags who has his defense rolling... But he has years of defenses that without the pieces he doesn't look like a genius

 

When he has the pieces yeah he calls a good really aggressive defense.. but that aggression can come against you too

No one ever said that he’s not better because he hasn’t beaten the chiefs-  strange idea tl lead with.  

there are stats to prove both sides of most arguments and this is really not worth my time to go back and forth with.   

I’ll just start and end with Spags’ defenses have 4 Lombaradi’s.  Frazier has none.  Spags shut down arguably the greatest offense in history while pulling off the biggest SB upset ever.  Holding them to 14 points. And then he won 3 more lombardis with a different team.  
 

Whether or not one was at better Hc or not is irrelevant. Whether or not they are considered elite like BB is irrelevant.  Spags will be in the HoF.  Frazier will not.

 

Feel however which way you like- I disagree and there isn’t a stat that could sway me to think Frazier is better.  Frazier was a very good DC.  We can leave it at that.  

 

 

 

[May Day 10]

Its strange that this is the team that has achieved 8-2 and not any of the previous 4-5 seasons.  Those teams felt stronger.  They are still 2nd in point differential, which is terrific as well.

 

The name of the game is hanging onto the Division, and going into the playoffs as healthy as possible.  Would be great to have the #2 or #3 seed locked-up before week 18 so we can have a mini bye-week.  I feel like the #1 seed is still attainable as well, but would be a grind.  Who knows?  If they beat KC, everything is on the table.

[Einstein]

15 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Spagnola is not some super defensive genius 

 

Eh… he’s pretty awesome. And his defenses were great in the playoffs even before the Chiefs got their current rejuvenation of defensive talent.

 

IMO, It’s less how he does throughout the whole game and more how he has a perfect instinct of what defense to call when the game is on the line.

[GunnerBill]

1 hour ago, NewEra said:

 Spags will be in the HoF.  Frazier will not.

 

 

Hmm is there a single coordinator in the HoF? I'm sure this came up with Dick LeBeau when he retired (if ever a guy was HoF worthy for his work as a DC it's him) and the answer was no. 

[NewEra]

20 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

Hmm is there a single coordinator in the HoF? I'm sure this came up with Dick LeBeau when he retired (if ever a guy was HoF worthy for his work as a DC it's him) and the answer was no. 

Not one.  There wasn’t a returner until Devin Hester.  A punter until ray guy or a kicker until stenarud.

 

sure, I could be wrong and he never makes it- I just think he (along with buddy Ryan) are historic DC’s.as they had beyond historic performances that rewrote NFL history.   85 bears known as the best D ever and 07 giants with the biggest upset in history- holding the undefeated 2nd best O ever to 14 in the SB. 
 

time will tell-  if he wins another Lombardi (or more) the discussion gets more intense.  

 

do you think Frazier is as good as Spags?

 

Edited November 12 by NewEra

[GunnerBill]

15 minutes ago, NewEra said:

Not one.  There wasn’t a returner until Devin Hester.  A punter until ray guy or a kicker until stenarud.

 

sure, I could be wrong and he never makes it- I just think he (along with buddy Ryan) are historic DC’s.as they had beyond historic performances that rewrote NFL history.   85 bears known as the best D ever and 07 giants with the biggest upset in history- holding the undefeated 2nd best O ever to 14 in the SB. 
 

time will tell-  if he wins another Lombardi (or more) the discussion gets more intense.  

 

do you think Frazier is as good as Spags?

 

 

No I don't think Frazier is as good as Spags. But I don't think Spags is close to Dick LeBeau and if he isn't in then Spags isn't in IMO.

[hondo in seattle]

16 hours ago, Buffalo716 said:

Spagnola is not some super defensive genius 

 

He's had plenty of defenses that struggle.. he has great pieces all over his defense.. when they didn't have those pieces they're not that electric

 

He's literally no different than Leslie Frazier... They run different schemes but they're success is basically the same.. when they have talent their defense is good when they don't have the talent they can struggle 

 

In fact when I went to Kansas City for the bills chief game couple years ago..  this just shows you how every fan base is alike 

 

Nobody and I mean nobody over there liked spagnola.. every single person said I wish we could trade Leslie Frazier for him 

 

Now fan appeal doesn't mean much... But the point stands that their own fans did not like him.. they didn't like the defense he ran and they didn't like his play calling

 

Yet this board, think we don't beat the Chiefs because they have guys like spagnola , yet he's not belichick or parcells

 

He has Chris Jones who is a Hall of Fame game wrecker that most teams can't block , with other good defensive lineman and linebackers and players 

 

Spagnola was literally one of the most inept head coaches of all time, he has a great team and a great organization.. he's not that special

 

Spagnola is the right guy in the right place at the right time.

 

I agree with much of what you say.  But games are played by players and every coordinator struggles when he doesn't have good players on the field. 

 

It's true Spags was a bad head coach.  But the last time he was a real full-time HC was 13 years ago.  He may have learned something since.  In any case, he plays a different role now.  

 

Spags success as a DC isn't owned by Spags alone.  Reid builds the culture, authors the training schedule, and so on. 

 

But there's a saying that's been around since the pyramids that runs something like this, "It takes a village to build a SB team."  Spags plays a vital role in that village.  

 

Any good team with good coaches can get lucky and win a Lombardi.   The reason the Chiefs have won 3 recent SBs is because their village has Reid as the HC, Spags as the DC, and Mahomes as the QB.  It's a deadly combo.  

[NewEra]

18 minutes ago, hondo in seattle said:

 

Spagnola is the right guy in the right place at the right time.

 

I agree with much of what you say.  But games are played by players and every coordinator struggles when he doesn't have good players on the field. 

 

It's true Spags was a bad head coach.  But the last time he was a real full-time HC was 13 years ago.  He may have learned something since.  In any case, he plays a different role now.  

 

Spags success as a DC isn't owned by Spags alone.  Reid builds the culture, authors the training schedule, and so on. 

 

But there's a saying that's been around since the pyramids that runs something like this, "It takes a village to build a SB team."  Spags plays a vital role in that village.  

 

Any good team with good coaches can get lucky and win a Lombardi.   The reason the Chiefs have won 3 recent SBs is because their village has Reid as the HC, Spags as the DC, and Mahomes as the QB.  It's a deadly combo.  

So who do you think is the better DC, Spags or Frazier?