Harder Fix Saints or Browns?

[gordong]

Brown's and they get everything deserved to them on Watson's contract. (although I feel for the browns fans) it not even close, they should be selling everyone 25 and older...   

[Ballhawk]

Funny during last week's game, the announcer's said the saints would be 90 million over the cap next year. 90 vs 43 makes the gap closer, plus the Browns are one Watson misstep away from being able to use personal conduct clauses to get out of that contract...

Can we add the Jets to the poll, they're a lot more fun to watch implode!

[Philly McButterpants]

54 minutes ago, 17islongenough said:

I get what the Browns tried to do.   It just completely failed. 

 

Never got the Saints.  Should have torn it down after Brees retired.   But they just kept themselves in cap hell just to go 500.

 

 

I picked the Saints for this reason as well.  They just kept kicking the can down the road with no hope of being anything more than mediocre.

[JP51]

any combination of Haslam and Watson is a stone cold loser. 

[Antonio]

Saints is harder.

 

Cleveland could find a QB in the draft and just treat Watson as a very VERY costly backup. If they hit the QB Jackpot they could be very good with an avobe average backup qb and a good overall roster. 

[Bills aPHILLYate]

41 minutes ago, Shaw66 said:

I guess it isn't a fascinating question, because more or less everyone agrees it's the Browns. 

 

In my mind, it's simple. If you're NFL team and you don't have a QB to build around, you need a quarterback. 

 

Seems like both teams have cap problems that will keep them from acquiring a QB in free agency, but it's pretty tough to get a good QB in free agency - just look at, uh, the Saints. Cousins is about the free agent QB any team has gotten since, uh, the Saints and Brees. 

 

That means they have to draft a QB. Let's assume both teams hit the lottery and draft QBs are good from the get go and are guys they can build on. Which team is in a better position to build?  Saints, because their cap situation is less bad than the Browns. 

 

Ownership? I have no idea if Gayle Benson knows what she's doing in New Orleans. I am sure that Jimmy Haslam doesn't know what he's doing in Cleveland. Again, the negative advantage foes to New Orleans. 

 

I'd rather be the Bills. 

I agree with quite a few of your points but the question still poses some complexity...

For instance, the Browns could be the easier fix in some regards because they're gonna be buried in that division for the foreseeable future which is somewhat of a positive.

This affords them more of a chance to blow it up and attempt a rebuild and establish some sort of foundation during the remaining years of Watsons contract. 

There are no quick fix options available and this is known. This almost assures them 2-3 drafts alone to find a top notch qb prospect which they should be in prime position each year to have the picks of the litter with no true expectations. They need to be sellers in almost every facet to start righting the ship. They could move Garrett for a kings ransom for starters. 

 

The Saints have notoriously kicked the can down the road but are mired in purgatory. They never know if they're buyers or sellers.

The issue there is they keep thinking they're a piece away from competing in or overtaking a less solid division and keep repeating the cycle. There are way more expectations in NO in my opinion due to their division but they are perpetually torn between taking their medicine or patching things up. They are convinced there is a quick fix...

That presents a way longer road to recovery until they make a solid decision on how to approach their future while that same decision is somewhat dictated and attached  to the successes (or lack thereof) of their divisional opponents. 

 

I quick voted the Browns but I'm not as certain and that's primarily due to the looming expectations associated with each franchise.

Edited November 7 by Bills aPHILLYate

[Kirby Jackson]

1 hour ago, That's No Moon said:

Saints ownership is absolutely not more stable than the Browns. The Saints will be sold pretty soon.

This isn’t true. I worked for the Benson’s for a brief period. Gayle’s health is fine. She is 77. The team won’t be sold until after she passes. That could be 15+ years from now. 

[WhitewalkerInPhilly]

If I was a prospective GM and my one shot waslooking at these two salary caps? I'm Picking the Browns.

 

The big, big problem with the Browns (not counting ownership) is the utter millstone that is the Watson contract. It's bad, but the Broncos got out of similar straights with Wilson and are doing ok. The Browns have the rollover to suck it up and have a couple vets whose contracts are up in 2026 meaning they are great trade deadline pieces to accumulate assets and reset your cap.

 

2025 would be brutal. 2026 would be rough. 2027 you are clear salary and if you're smart be flush with young talents and picks.

 

 

[BuffaloBill]

The Browns are an absolute dumpster fire. I would say you can almost throw the Jets into this thread.

[PrimeTime101]

1 hour ago, KingBoots8 said:

Remember when they were a play away from the AFCCG and looked like an absolute force? That’s how fast bad ownership can ruin a promising team.

yep and that is my point exactly.

[corta765]

1 hour ago, 17islongenough said:

I get what the Browns tried to do.   It just completely failed. 

 

Never got the Saints.  Should have torn it down after Brees retired.   But they just kept themselves in cap hell just to go 500.

 

 

The roster itself was decent and owners convince themselves they are ready to win far more then reality

[corta765]

39 minutes ago, Bills aPHILLYate said:

 

 

The Saints have notoriously kicked the can down the road but are mired in purgatory. They never know if they're buyers or sellers.

The issue there is they keep thinking they're a piece away from competing in or overtaking a less solid division and keep repeating the cycle. There are way more expectations in NO in my opinion due to their division but they are perpetually torn between taking their medicine or patching things up. They are convinced there is a quick fix...

That presents a way longer road to recovery until they make a solid decision on how to approach their future while that same decision is somewhat dictated and attached  to the successes (or lack thereof) of their divisional opponents. 

 

I quick voted the Browns but I'm not as certain and that's primarily due to the looming expectations associated with each franchise.

reminds me of the Bills mid 2000s who were far further away but constantly thought they were close

[The Jokeman]

Cleveland's owner might make it the clincher for them, yet I voted for Nawlins as they have more holes to fill and they've kicked the can on the cap for years so who knows when they'll ever clear it and who knows who their next HC is going to be.  Cleveland however just lacks a quality QB, I know no easy fix, yet they do have a two time HC of the year, have Garrett which better than anyone on the Saints front 4. 

[Buffalo Junction]

3 hours ago, dpberr said:

I picked the Saints.  

 

In theory, the Browns have an issue around one player, and could drop a nuclear bomb and take that dead cap hit of $172 million over 1-2 seasons and be done with it or negotiate a retirement settlement with Watson that'd be less than that number.  Yes, they would likely field the worst team in league history, as every player would be league minimum, but it could be done.   The NFL would likely go to great lengths to stop it.  Fans would be apoplectic.  However, they likely get the #1 pick in the draft, and are also getting a new stadium.

 

Saints have a multi-year project of clearing dead cap and current cap with multiple bad contracts, and they have an aging facility.  There's little to look forward to until 2030.  

Browns would have to time that with the proper QB class, and Haslam would have to convince a good coach that there’s job security. 

Edited November 7 by Buffalo Junction

[schoolhouserock]

It all starts with ownership and Cleveland’s ownership might be the worst in the league.

[Shaw66]

2 hours ago, Bills aPHILLYate said:

I agree with quite a few of your points but the question still poses some complexity...

For instance, the Browns could be the easier fix in some regards because they're gonna be buried in that division for the foreseeable future which is somewhat of a positive.

This affords them more of a chance to blow it up and attempt a rebuild and establish some sort of foundation during the remaining years of Watsons contract. 

There are no quick fix options available and this is known. This almost assures them 2-3 drafts alone to find a top notch qb prospect which they should be in prime position each year to have the picks of the litter with no true expectations. They need to be sellers in almost every facet to start righting the ship. They could move Garrett for a kings ransom for starters. 

 

The Saints have notoriously kicked the can down the road but are mired in purgatory. They never know if they're buyers or sellers.

The issue there is they keep thinking they're a piece away from competing in or overtaking a less solid division and keep repeating the cycle. There are way more expectations in NO in my opinion due to their division but they are perpetually torn between taking their medicine or patching things up. They are convinced there is a quick fix...

That presents a way longer road to recovery until they make a solid decision on how to approach their future while that same decision is somewhat dictated and attached  to the successes (or lack thereof) of their divisional opponents. 

 

I quick voted the Browns but I'm not as certain and that's primarily due to the looming expectations associated with each franchise.

This is great stuff, nice analysis.  Thanks.

[machine gun kelly]

3 hours ago, Royale with Cheese said:

The Browns cannot cut Watson because the dead cap hit would be so large it would prevent them fielding a full 53 man roster.  They are stuck with him probably 2 more years and he is a bottom 3 QB.

The only option for the Browns is to keep him on the roster, find a Flacco type guy, don’t ever let Watson on the field ever, try and see if he’ll take an injury settlement.  They have much more talent than the Saints, amd hope to get back in a WC race in 2 years.

[Jauronimo]

3 hours ago, Sweats said:

The Browns is the correct answer here.

 

Everyone told them they were making a mistake by fully guaranteeing Watson and like i'm talking everyone from other owners to the fans, to the media, etc.......and the Browns did what the Browns always do, they made piss poor decisions that created a cap hell for that team.

Also, their owner and management are terrible.

 

You know what the word "Browns" reminds me of?..........that's right, a hot steaming pile (poop assessment thread for reference).

Hot steaming piles of poop....love 'em or hate 'em?

[Shaw66]

4 hours ago, Sweats said:

The Browns is the correct answer here.

 

Everyone told them they were making a mistake by fully guaranteeing Watson and like i'm talking everyone from other owners to the fans, to the media, etc.......and the Browns did what the Browns always do, they made piss poor decisions that created a cap hell for that team.

Also, their owner and management are terrible.

 

You know what the word "Browns" reminds me of?..........that's right, a hot steaming pile (poop assessment thread for reference).

When the Bills got Cooper, someone asked why has the guy changed teams so much.  Answer, ownership. He played for the Raiders, the Cowboy, and the Browns. That's dysfunctional, cubed. 

[eball]

Saints are/were due for a rebuild anyway and the fans know it, so that one will be "easier" to stomach.

 

Browns have the worst situation by far, and really no light at the end of the tunnel.  Factory of sadness indeed -- but their crook of an owner deserves it.