So why was Amari Cooper traded twice in his prime?

[Mr. WEO]

16 hours ago, Logic said:

Raiders - Cooper (by his own admission) dealt with injuries, drops, and inconsistency, so even though he posted 2,900 yards in his first three seasons, the Raiders didn't want to commit to him long term. They traded him to Dallas instead.

Dallas - Jerry Jones didn't want to (or wasn't able to) give Cooper a long term extension. This is the same team, mind you, that handed Ezekiel Elliott an awful contract and recently had long and idiotic contract staredowns with CeeDee Lamb and Dak Prescott. They traded him to Cleveland.

Cleveland - Rumors are that Watson and Cooper didn't get along and that Cooper sort of quit on the team this year. Either way, the Browns are having a down year and likely were happy to get a draft pick back in return for a player who definitely wasn't going to be there in 2025.

So all in all, to answer your question: Early inconsistency and injury troubles, then bad front offices. That really seems to be it.

Cooper isn't a superstar WR. He's a mid to low end WR1 who will give you 1,000-1,200 yards most seasons. He's a smart and savvy veteran who knows how to get open, commands attention from the defense, and will add some juice to the Bills' receiver room. They'll either re-sign him to a reasonable deal next year or let him walk and re-coup the 3rd as a com pick, but either way, he makes the Bills' WR room materially better in 2024, and his past as an NFL player doesn't change any of that, no matter what theory you ascribe his various moves to. 

 

He's a legit #1, for the Bills purpose.   But he has bad hands.  He's dropped 30 passes in under 3 seasons---10 already this year!  His catch percent is in the Gabe Davis range---and Buffalo fans "ran him out of town" for that performance. 

[Mat68]

2 hours ago, freddyjj said:

Al Davis died in 2011.  Think you mean Mark, his son.

Fair

[colin]

3 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Let me preface this first with I was all for trading for him, he’s a good addition to the team in terms of what we need out of him.  But here is my honest opinion as to why and I have consistently said this about him for years.  
 

Cooper is kind of a more talented Gabe Davis in a lot of ways.  He has a few big games a season to make his season totals look good but his other weeks he is meh to MIA.  He’s wildly inconsistent on a week to week basis, and he drops a lot more balls than people think.  
 

It’s been that way his whole career.  Go look at each seasons game logs for his stats each week.  You will find majority of his games are not that impressive for a guy who made as much as he did.  But he will have 2-3 real big games that total like 30%+ of his season totals and make his season look good when it’s over.  
 

The good thing about his stop here is that we don’t need him to have a big game every week the way we can spread the ball around.  His presence will help open up more what they can do in other areas of the field. 

 

As a player the knock on him is the drops, and that's it.

 

I think he's a guy who takes his profession of football very seriously, but he doesn't sit around thinking about celebrations or endorsement deals.  He's a chess nerd, so he prolly loves that aspect of nfl football, and looks at scheme and film as a way to make the winning move, but he doesn't see his worth as a human being as being a big star or a leader of men.

 

people talk a lot about players as if they all are or all can be leaders.  coop is an example of someone who is simply not a leader.  he doesn't want to be and the bills have plenty of leaders on the team, with a youngish roster and allen and dawkings being the clear top two personalities.  we don't need a diggs or another fired up guy as much as we need excellent football players.

 

 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

7 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

He's a legit #1, for the Bills purpose.   But he has bad hands.  He's dropped 30 passes in under 3 seasons---10 already this year!  His catch percent is in the Gabe Davis range---and Buffalo fans "ran him out of town" for that performance. 

Don’t think it was really the catch percentage that ran gabe out specifically lol his route tree was like two routes 

[Royale with Cheese]

I mean Brandin Cooks has been traded 20 times in the prime of his career.

[Mister Defense]

38 minutes ago, colin said:

 

As a player the knock on him is the drops, and that's it.

 

I think he's a guy who takes his profession of football very seriously, but he doesn't sit around thinking about celebrations or endorsement deals.  He's a chess nerd, so he prolly loves that aspect of nfl football, and looks at scheme and film as a way to make the winning move, but he doesn't see his worth as a human being as being a big star or a leader of men.

 

people talk a lot about players as if they all are or all can be leaders.  coop is an example of someone who is simply not a leader.  he doesn't want to be and the bills have plenty of leaders on the team, with a youngish roster and allen and dawkings being the clear top two personalities.  we don't need a diggs or another fired up guy as much as we need excellent football players.

 

 

 

Well said, but I think leaders come in all shapes and sizes--and demeanors.

 

From all I read about Cooper, he is a true professional, has very high character, and is extremely dedicated to his craft.

 

I believe, even if it is just by being around him, watching him on the field and off, a player like Coleman will learn more from him than anyone else on the team.  And knowing Coleman, someone equally serious about football (don't let his good sense of humor fool you) and dedicated to his craft, will pick Cooper's brain like crazy, eager to learn as much as he can.  And I have no doubt Cooper will provide him with all he asks for, consistently.

 

Like I said in my first sentence, leaders are not all the same. They are not all people who 'fire up' others, and make a show of it.  Leaders make the people around them better, stronger, more confident. It seems to me that Cooper will be that kind of leader for the young receivers on this team.  We will see...

 

 

 

 

Edited October 24 by Mister Defense

[Einstein's Dog]

17 hours ago, Shaw66 said:

I "hate to say" it because I think every really successful team needs at least one truly outstanding guy at a key position. Cooper isn't that guy, at least I don't think so. 

To me, the Bills biggest weakness had been the lack of a top tier WR, they now have one and are a contender.  They not only got a top tier WR, but one who looks like will fit in the team philosophy, team first, non-diva. 

 

I am hoping Beane is giving it a few months of a test run and if everything is what it appears, give A Cooper an extension during the season.  A top tier WR wasn't a temporary weakness and the earlier it is fixed the better.  And from all indications to me, A Cooper is a great fit.  Beane may have just left a bad situation with a WR contract but he needs to get over it and carry on - I think A Cooper is it.

 

As for having one truly outstanding guy at a key position - the Bills have Josh Allen.

 

[GaryPinC]

4 hours ago, Alphadawg7 said:

Let me preface this first with I was all for trading for him, he’s a good addition to the team in terms of what we need out of him.  But here is my honest opinion as to why and I have consistently said this about him for years.  
 

Cooper is kind of a more talented Gabe Davis in a lot of ways.  He has a few big games a season to make his season totals look good but his other weeks he is meh to MIA.  He’s wildly inconsistent on a week to week basis, and he drops a lot more balls than people think.  
 

It’s been that way his whole career.  Go look at each seasons game logs for his stats each week.  You will find majority of his games are not that impressive for a guy who made as much as he did.  But he will have 2-3 real big games that total like 30%+ of his season totals and make his season look good when it’s over.  
 

The good thing about his stop here is that we don’t need him to have a big game every week the way we can spread the ball around.  His presence will help open up more what they can do in other areas of the field. 

I see what you're saying, having watched both him and Gabe I feel he's a lot more talented than Gabe.  He's much more diverse in terms of the routes he can run, the catches he can make, working for separation, and especially contested catches.  Not sure statistics can convey that.

 

My thought in the Cooper discussion is that we see how he does with Josh (a real quarterback) and Brady.  Does Coop have certain passes he struggles with (flat pattern?) and could be avoided?  The quarterback connection and offensive style help make a receiver.  Cleveland saw it last year when Flacco took over and Cooper caught fire.

 

He was a weapon with Cleveland.  You absolutely have to factor in he had DeShaun Watson and a struggling Cleveland Browns offense to work in.  You also have to consider that a solid number of his "stinkers" throughout his career he really wasn't targeted much in that game.  That's not to say he hasn't underperformed in games to your point, he has.  I think all good receivers will have games like this, whether it's totally their fault or if some of the fault lies in the offense or defensive plan/talent shutting him down.  You can go look at Justin Jefferson's 2022 season of 1800 yds and definitely see a few stinkers in there.

 

His drops are a concern, let's hope our offense can game plan to minimize them and I'm excited to see how it goes with Josh and his connection.  Strong chance this could be really good!

Edited October 24 by GaryPinC

[Mister Defense]

14 minutes ago, Einstein's Dog said:

To me, the Bills biggest weakness had been the lack of a top tier WR, they now have one and are a contender.  They not only got a top tier WR, but one who looks like will fit in the team philosophy, team first, non-diva. 

 

I am hoping Beane is giving it a few months of a test run and if everything is what it appears, give A Cooper an extension during the season.  A top tier WR wasn't a temporary weakness and the earlier it is fixed the better.  And from all indications to me, A Cooper is a great fit.  Beane may have just left a bad situation with a WR contract but he needs to get over it and carry on - I think A Cooper is it.

 

As for having one truly outstanding guy at a key position - the Bills have Josh Allen.

 

 

I agree completely and hard to imagine almost every Bills' fan not doing the same. A great fit, and in many ways. And a leader of men by example, like all true leaders.

 

Why get rid of Cooper next year, force the team to use an early round draft pick on a receiver, rather than a defensive end or another need, on a crapshoot, as almost all players are that, even highly regarded ones coming into the draft.  Even the most highly regarded receivers in this year's draft, Harrison and Rome Odunze, are not lighting their teams on fire so far.  The Bills do not want to wait for a new receiver to develop, they want to win now, and next year and...

 

I think Allen should go to Beane and indicate he will give the team a hometown discount, and not break the bank, not want to be the highest paid player of all time, though he should be. (Let Dak Prescott and the non competitive teams he has and will have, be that poster boy for the NFL.)   I think Josh will settle for just 50 million or so a year, knowing that Bills' fans will always be there to help him out if needs money for milk, eggs, bread if that need arises.

 

Before the season ends, if all goes as planned, Cooper will be signed for the next 2-3 years, if the Bills are smart.

 

 

 

Edited October 24 by Mister Defense

[GaryPinC]

31 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Don’t think it was really the catch percentage that ran gabe out specifically lol his route tree was like two routes 

I'd say both.  I've seen highlights from Jacksonville shanking well thrown balls.  Limited and significantly unreliable.

[Mr. WEO]

45 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Don’t think it was really the catch percentage that ran gabe out specifically lol his route tree was like two routes 

 

What's Cooper's excuse, this being his 4th team?

[Mr. WEO]

Just now, Mister Defense said:

 

What the heck, why be a Bills fan if you just want to rake players like Cooper over the coals, diminish them, for no reason at all?

 

Completely pathetic.

 

he's been a Bill for a week.  I was a vocal Gabe Davis defender here (you know, when he was on the Bills roster), so I asked the question based on @generic_bills_fan post above.  Pretty simple.

 

if you want to join this discussion, you are welcome to. Maybe you can answer my question, since you are eager to contribute. 

[SF Bills Fan]

19 hours ago, Augie said:

 

That is one ugly list of owners! Yikes! 

 

He should love catching balls from Josh and having a decent owner for the first time ever. 

Agree- Pegula and Josh Allen are the best owner and QB he has been involved with. He is set up for success, finally. 

[Generic_Bills_Fan]

37 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

What's Cooper's excuse, this being his 4th team?

Good players get traded all the time…he was a clear cap casualty in Dallas and Cleveland is completely blowing it up the best they can so they are unloading good players for picks 

 

I think the drop thing is a bit overblown personally,  it’s probably very tough to get in a rhythm when most of the time you are open and your qb completely misses you.  
 

Gabe had a lot more consistent qb play in  buffalo and now Jacksonville even than Amari had in Cleveland and it still never really came together for him.  Trevor’s wrs are letting him down bad down there in Jacksonville they drop everything 

 

also the ‘ran out of town’ isn’t even comparable.  Gabe was not resigned and Amari got traded for draft picks because he actually had value 

 

Edited October 24 by Generic_Bills_Fan

[NewEra]

58 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

He's a legit #1, for the Bills purpose.   But he has bad hands.  He's dropped 30 passes in under 3 seasons---10 already this year!  His catch percent is in the Gabe Davis range---and Buffalo fans "ran him out of town" for that performance. 

No- we ran him out of town because of that catch percentage, his limited route tree, he wasn’t a very good route runner, he had little speed, limited yac ability and his inability to separate.  Leaving out significant information doesn’t make your post correct. 
 

And then there’s context-

Prior to joining the Browns in 22- cooper had 2 seasons of sub 62 catch%.  His rookie and 3rd seasons with Derek Carr (a below average poor QB) throwing him passes. 57.8
 

His catch % with a Dak, a good QB, but not great, was 68%- very good.  

 

his catch % with Watson, the worst QB in the league, and the Browns was 55.6- poor, like the QB, team and surrounding weapons.  
 

Gabe- playing with a top 2 QB and opposite an all pro x, Davis never reached above 56.5%, his rookie season, and only got worse.  
 

for their careers:

cooper 61.2%- playing with zero elite QBs his entire careers. A handful of seasons playing with one good QB, his caught 68%

davis 54.5% playing with an elite QB his entire career (51.4 with Lawrence)
 

 

 

 

45 minutes ago, GaryPinC said:

I'd say both.  I've seen highlights from Jacksonville shanking well thrown balls.  Limited and significantly unreliable.

It was everything-  we had eyes and could see that he wasn’t very good- that’s why he was run out

34 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

What's Cooper's excuse, this being his 4th team?

Are you saying cooper isn’t good?

[Mister Defense]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

he's been a Bill for a week.  I was a vocal Gabe Davis defender here (you know, when he was on the Bills roster), so I asked the question based on @generic_bills_fan post above.  Pretty simple.

 

if you want to join this discussion, you are welcome to. Maybe you can answer my question, since you are eager to contribute. 

 

No, it is not a legitimate question, asked as if there's some nefarious reason for this being his fourth team, as ridiculous as the comment in the OP that 'teams couldn't wait to get rid of him''--and clearly seems to be supporting that nonsense.

 

We see this in the media sometime, throwing out these loaded negative 'questions', and so spreading nonsense by 'simply asking a question'.

 

 

 

Edited October 24 by Mister Defense

[MarlinTheMagician]

If he performs well, I hope we sign him.  I would much rather pay him $15 million than a top of the market guy $28 million.  Draft another receiver at the top of the draft and let Coleman, Shakir and the rookie learn from Coop.  When he is done, we are still set and Josh is like 31.

Top of the draft meaning our first two rounds - not the entire draft.

 

[NewEra]

11 minutes ago, Mr. WEO said:

 

he's been a Bill for a week.  I was a vocal Gabe Davis defender here (you know, when he was on the Bills roster), so I asked the question based on @generic_bills_fan post above.  Pretty simple.

 

if you want to join this discussion, you are welcome to. Maybe you can answer my question, since you are eager to contribute. 

And he’s been an nfl player for 10 years-  again- we have eyes-  we can see that he’s a good player.  You can go search for one stat that says he’s not.  While we’ll listen to the world talk about how great cooper is.  
 

He has had issues with drops.  It’s one of the reasons he’s not considered elite by many standards.  Had he not had the drops, there wouldn’t really be any blemishes in his game.  Other than that- he’s great at high pointing the ball and contested catches, one of the best route runners in the league and shows up to play without crying about targets every season.  
 

what does Gabe do great other than run block?  
 

it’s hilarious that you’re still going to bat for this guy.  Even funnier that your using Gabe and coop in the same conversation, thanks to one stat.
 

 

8 minutes ago, Mister Defense said:

 

No, it is not a legitimate question, asked as if there's some nefarious reason for this being his fourth team, as ridiculous as the comment in the OP that 'teams couldn't wait to get rid of him''--and clearly seems to be supporting that nonsense.

 

We see this in the media sometime, throwing out these loaded negative 'questions', and so spreading nonsense by 'simply asking a question'.

 

 

 

He woke up on the same side of the bed this morning.  Looking to piss in cereals, per usual

[Warriorspikes51]

the important thing is Beane managed to haul him in for a 3rd before one of KC, TB, SF, PIT, etc  would have certainly acquired him

Amari and Allen meshing = sign him to finish his career here.  He probably has at least 2 very good seasons left

Edited October 24 by Warriorspikes51

[Mr. WEO]

5 minutes ago, Generic_Bills_Fan said:

Good players get traded all the time…he was a clear cap casualty in Dallas and Cleveland is completely blowing it up the best they can so they are unloading good players for picks 

 

I think the drop thing is a bit overblown personally,  it’s probably very tough to get in a rhythm when most of the time you are open and your qb completely misses you.  
 

Gabe had a lot more consistent qb play in  buffalo and now Jacksonville even than Amari had in Cleveland and it still never really came together for him.  Trevor’s wrs are letting him down bad down there in Jacksonville they drop everything 

 

also the ‘ran out of town’ isn’t even comparable.  Gabe was not resigned and Amari got traded for draft picks because he actually had value 

 

"ran out of town" is a joke here lol--fans can't run players out of town, despite what many here think (see the guy below, for instance).  but they were down on him for drops and low catch %--same as Cooper.  

 

3 minutes ago, NewEra said:

No- we ran him out of town because of that catch percentage, his limited route tree, he wasn’t a very good route runner, he had little speed, limited yac ability and his inability to separate.  Leaving out significant information doesn’t make your post correct. 
 

And then there’s context-

Prior to joining the Browns in 22- cooper had 2 seasons of sub 62 catch%.  His rookie and 3rd seasons with Derek Carr (a below average poor QB) throwing him passes. 57.8
 

His catch % with a Dak, a good QB, but not great, was 68%- very good.  

 

his catch % with Watson, the worst QB in the league, and the Browns was 55.6- poor, like the QB, team and surrounding weapons.  
 

Gabe- playing with a top 2 QB and opposite an all pro x, Davis never reached above 56.5%, his rookie season, and only got worse.  
 

for their careers:

cooper 61.2%- playing with zero elite QBs his entire careers. A handful of seasons playing with one good QB, his caught 68%

davis 54.5% playing with an elite QB his entire career (51.4 with Lawrence)
 

 

 

 

It was everything-  we had eyes and could see that he wasn’t very good- that’s why he was run out

Are you saying cooper isn’t good?

 

Drops are drops--balls that should have been caught. His 1st target as a Bill was dropped.  He has 11 drops the past 7 games. 

 

Derek Carr is a career 65% passer, Josh Allen is 63%.  This season, Watson completed 63.4% of his passes first 6 games (that includes Cooper's 10 drops, of course).

 

I said Cooper is a legit #1WR for the Bills.  Where in that did you read "he's no good"?