Where's Cole Bishop?

[HappyDays]

4 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Pretty sure the Ravens would disagree -- they picked Kyle Hamilton 14th overall and he’s the best player on their defense (@HappyDays).

 

Hamilton might be like Christian McCaffrey - a generational game changing talent at a non-premium position. But a single one of a kind player like that doesn't change the entire narrative. On the whole safeties are devalued in the modern NFL and their average salaries prove it. It's become more of a cerebral position than a physical one and there are a lot of players good enough to man the position without really hurting the defense. So I still don't support drafting them before round 3.

 

I also don't think safety is as big a problem for us as people think. Our problem is that our front 4 very rarely makes a consistent impact on the game, and our scheme & personnel archetype are vulnerable to offenses that push you around. A lot of our explosive plays given up this year are on runs or screens where our small defensive players are getting blocked out of the screen. We made the choice to build a defense susceptible to that style and we have to live with it.

[Brand J]

On 10/16/2024 at 9:40 AM, BananaB said:

Chances are when we get to playoffs they’ll be regretting not letting this kid take his lumps early in the season. Jmo

I said the EXACT same about Dorian Williams last year, no lie. And come playoff time what happened? Enter the disaster that was AJ Klein.

[FireChans]

44 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Pretty sure the Ravens would disagree -- they picked Kyle Hamilton 14th overall and he’s the best player on their defense (@HappyDays).

Great player. Better be a great player to be picked that high at a low-impact position.

 

Jahmyr Gibbs was picked #12. Are running backs suddenly super valuable? Of course not.

[VW82]

This kid is going to make some pro bowls and some people itt are going to eat some internet words. It's crazy that we still have doubters in this regime's ability to select and develop DBs.

Edited October 18 by VW82

[JoPoy88]

On 10/16/2024 at 12:15 PM, billsgpr88 said:

Is there any specific reason why he's hardly playing? I know he was injured early on in the year, and he did fill in for Rapp when he was injured, but it is strange to me that even local media never mentions him. Is it assumed that he is adjusting to the system, or has he just underperformed? Given that he was a 2nd round pick, I was hoping for a player who could come in and start almost immediately. It's frustrating to see players routinely getting open with space to run, and to my untrained eye the subpar play of Hamlin is a big reason for that. Maybe someone can fill me in if they know something I don't about Bishop's role on the team thus far.

That’s not how it works, starting isn’t dependent solely on where someone was drafted, so there’s no point in getting frustrated. He’ll assume a larger role when he’s ready. McDermott doesn’t care what you were “hoping” for.

[dave mcbride]

1 hour ago, FireChans said:

Great player. Better be a great player to be picked that high at a low-impact position.

 

Jahmyr Gibbs was picked #12. Are running backs suddenly super valuable? Of course not.

Ask the Ravens about how they feel in retrospect and come back to me.

[billsfan_34]

On 10/16/2024 at 12:20 PM, T.E. said:

You ever work at a place where promotions seem to be done by seniority rather than performance? I think there is a bit of that element with a McDermott roster.

McD has a very complex and deceptive defensive system. Part of me thinks Cole hasn’t fully picked it up yet.

[Starr Almighty]

On 10/16/2024 at 10:27 AM, MJS said:

He is also not a starter. That's why he isn't playing.

Damar is a starter?

[ghostwriter]

On 10/16/2024 at 12:15 PM, billsgpr88 said:

Is there any specific reason why he's hardly playing? I know he was injured early on in the year, and he did fill in for Rapp when he was injured, but it is strange to me that even local media never mentions him. Is it assumed that he is adjusting to the system, or has he just underperformed? Given that he was a 2nd round pick, I was hoping for a player who could come in and start almost immediately. It's frustrating to see players routinely getting open with space to run, and to my untrained eye the subpar play of Hamlin is a big reason for that. Maybe someone can fill me in if they know something I don't about Bishop's role on the team thus far.

There’s nothing to talk about. I think McDermott is going to ease him into the lineup slowly over time.

[Shortchaz]

Hamlin sells more jerseys 

[FireChans]

19 minutes ago, dave mcbride said:

Ask the Ravens about how they feel in retrospect and come back to me.

I don’t really care lol. You are arguing with the numbers.

 

QBs are paid the most because they are the most important. It all goes downhill from there.

 

Hamilton may be the best young safety in the league. He might get 20th highest WR money or 21st QB money. Tells you all you need to know about how important he is lol.

[NoSaint]

9 hours ago, ganesh said:

Cole Bishop (as per depth chart) is backing up at Strong Safety for Rapp.  Hamlin is playing the Free Safety position and is being backed up by Edwards.  I am not sure how Bishop can replace Hamlin.  We need to get Edwards ready.

I have some theories about how bishop could replace damar, but they might really blow your mind

[ChronicAndKnuckles]

Probably taking a dump

[GunnerBill]

 

8 hours ago, HappyDays said:

 

I also don't think safety is as big a problem for us as people think. Our problem is that our front 4 very rarely makes a consistent impact on the game, and our scheme & personnel archetype are vulnerable to offenses that push you around. A lot of our explosive plays given up this year are on runs or screens where our small defensive players are getting blocked out of the screen. We made the choice to build a defense susceptible to that style and we have to live with it.

 

I STRONGLY disagree with this. Almost every big play we are giving up is a result of poor safety play. And I am not just on about the physical limitations of a guy like Hamlin. Sure - the Henry touchdown - where everyone up front lost their assignment and then the safeties were just not fast enough to catch up even with the angle. But take that out.... the big plays are safeties making the wrong reads, taking the wrong angles or losing their position in coverage. Even the screen game you talk about multiple of those should - even with some of the failures on the front end - be 5 or 6 yard gains and a safety is out of position or taking a bad angle and its a 25 yard play. 

 

It is now, with the Cooper pick up, the single most limiting factor on this football team other than possibly kicker. Teams have gone after the Bills safeties all year and they will continue to do so. 

[Magox]

39 minutes ago, GunnerBill said:

 

 

I STRONGLY disagree with this. Almost every big play we are giving up is a result of poor safety play. And I am not just on about the physical limitations of a guy like Hamlin. Sure - the Henry touchdown - where everyone up front lost their assignment and then the safeties were just not fast enough to catch up even with the angle. But take that out.... the big plays are safeties making the wrong reads, taking the wrong angles or losing their position in coverage. Even the screen game you talk about multiple of those should - even with some of the failures on the front end - be 5 or 6 yard gains and a safety is out of position or taking a bad angle and its a 25 yard play. 

 

It is now, with the Cooper pick up, the single most limiting factor on this football team other than possibly kicker. Teams have gone after the Bills safeties all year and they will continue to do so. 

The Nico blown coverage TD was a huge play that I think is counting against Cole right now with Babich and McD.   He doesn’t have their full trust at the moment and he’s going to have to build that before he gets significant playing time unless injuries thrust into that role.

 

I think if the Bills get another player before the end of the trade deadline it would be safety.  Safety is their most pressing need.

[GunnerBill]

6 minutes ago, Magox said:

The Nico blown coverage TD was a huge play that I think is counting against Cole right now with Babich and McD.   He doesn’t have their full trust at the moment and he’s going to have to build that before he gets significant playing time unless injuries thrust into that role.

 

I think if the Bills get another player before the end of the trade deadline it would be safety.  Safety is their most pressing need.

 

Yea he was the guy in the wrong gap on the touchdown run for their first score too. In his one start he was literally responsible for both touchdowns given up. I want him on the field as much as anyone, and I agree with all the folks saying yea but by week 17 don't you want a settled in Bishop on the field going into the playoffs rather than the known limitations of Damar Hamlin? Of course. But when a rookie making his first start makes two major mistakes that give up touchdowns I think it is REALLY difficult to knock the coaching staff when they put him back on the bench the next week. I think pretty much every staff in the league would have done the same (possibly not the Panthers or Patriots or someone to whom winning this year isn't that important, but everyone else).

 

It's also worth taking note of what @ganesh said above, because he is right. Bishop and Rapp while probably the two most physically talented of our safeties (picks #60 and #61 in the NFL draft respectively though a few years apart) have similar rather than complimentary skillsets. My suggestion for how you get Bishop's feet wet a little bit without exposing yourself to all the rookie mistakes has been to use him as just a man coverage piece in the redzone where I think his size and athleticism has the potential to be a weapon. Goal to go, obvious passing downs, sub him in for Hamlin. Get him comfortable with that then build from there. 

[GaryPinC]

On 10/16/2024 at 12:31 PM, WeckMonster said:

McD values reliability. He probably views Bishop’s blown coverage as a big reason they lost to Houston.

 

But how do you get better without playing?

 

He should put Bishop in 10 snaps/game and have him do what he’s good at… man coverage on TE/RB, Blitz. And add snaps each game.

 

cant use a 2nd rounder and still have Hamlin playing all the snaps.

This.  Bishop will be a playmaker when he's up to speed.  We are all in every year.  This guy has to get reps and every opportunity to contribute for the playoffs.

What is he doing well in practice?  Plug him into the game when you see a favorable situation for him and grow from there.  Especially with Bernard back.  It will also help veteran safeties understand they should develop their own anticipation and playmaking more if they want to stay on the field.

 

Going all the way back to Nate Peter man, I feel like McDermott fixates on practice performance too much.

 

Another good example is plugging in Terrell Bernard after Edmunds left.  Coaches and Beane were all smug because this guy had showed it at practice the year before.  He's smart, aggressive,  takes great angles and closes quickly.  Great at attacking the LOS.  A playmaker.  The exact opposite of Edmunds.

 

Why the hell didn't they push Bernard's development on the field more the year before?  Under-developing your talent when the superbowl window is open is just criminal to me.

Edited October 18 by GaryPinC

[Captain_Quint]

12 hours ago, Brand J said:

I said the EXACT same about Dorian Williams last year, no lie. And come playoff time what happened? Enter the disaster that was AJ Klein.

This is how I feel when people suggest that we sign Hyde for the playoff push. He will look like he has lead boots on after sitting out all season. 

[BananaB]

On 10/16/2024 at 1:43 PM, peterpan said:

He got some time with Rapp out.  He looked terrible and we lost both games.  Not all his fault for the loses but he was a big problem. 

Jesus, he subbed in the Ravens game after Rapp got concussed. Game was already getting of hand, big part of that was of the play of Rapp and Hamlin. I don’t know what you guys been watching but our secondary looked like ***** the last 3 games, and the run support from safeties is terrible. Other than a few nice plays by Rapp against the Jets, the last 3 games have been terrible by everyone. Might as well throw Douglas name in the mix of playing like ***** as well

[Doc]

Hopefully the Bills are on the good end of blowouts and can play Bishop later in games.